faggot as a pejorative

[beyelzu]

although I support gay rights, I often use the words faggot and gay as pejoratives.

I use faggot as a general term. If someone irritates me I am as likely to call them a faggot as I am to call them a cunt or motherfucker.


I use gay in a similar fashion but I am more likely to use it in the place of stupid or campy.

I know why I do this, while I have no problem with homosexuality I dont like girly men regardless of sexual preference, I am pretty old school in this regard.


Anyway, recently I have decided to start using fucktard instead of faggot but I am not sure of a good replacement word for the way I use gay.

I was just wondering about people's thoughts on this subject.

are there words that you use that you wish you didnt?

[Petra]

No. I might say something is "so gay" or something like that. I don't use the word faggot at all, but my flatmate, Paul, does and I always shoot him a "I am not amused" frown when he does.

I'm a bit free with the word cunt, though. I do actually like the way the word sounds, and a part of me enjoys it's shock factor.


Edit: one word I use too much and I wish I didn't because I don't like the sound of the word, is the word "that". I use it too often, in writing especially, and I don't like it.

[viscousmemories]

No, I don't ever say faggot and I've probably said 'gay' (as in stupid) half a dozen times at most, and I always feel like a teenage gamer when I do - since it was playing UT where I first heard the word used excessively in that fashion.

I use homosexual as a pejorative, though. I always call my roommate that, which is particularly fitting given the fact that he's a single man in his 30's living with another single man in his 30's. The irony of "taking back" the clinical term and making it an insult has a certain amusing charm for me.

I don't really say any words habitually that I wish I didn't. I am "PC" in the sense that I make a concerted effort - and have for 15 years or so - not to use loaded words that demean any particular groups of people. Except bitches, of course. So I'm not a bigot like you, bitch.

[livius drusus]

I don't say "gay" or any variety of "fag", but I definitely say "cunt" more than is decent.

The weird thing is I know I used to say "that's so gay" all the time in junior/high school, but at some point in my later teens I just stopped. It wasn't social consciousness, I assure you, but by the time I graduated college not only did I not use it on principle. but I actually totally forgot that I had used it when I was younger.

I remembered all of the sudden a little while back. I mean, we had an Italian hand gesture signifying "fag" and everything. You put your hand behind your ear and kinda hit it forwards twice like a dog scratching. I know. Pretty gay, huh?

[Z500]

where's the "sometimes, but i don't feel bad about it" option? mostly i just use some sort of combination with "fuck" in it

[beyelzu]

where's the "sometimes, but i don't feel bad about it" option? mostly i just use some sort of combination with "fuck" in it
just pretend that there is an option that says, I say faggot sometimes and think its funny cuz I am an intolerant fundie and then virtually click it :D

[Godless Wonder]

I don't use "faggot." Well, I did recently on iidb after the election, sarcastically in some context related to, I forget, reaching out to try to join with the republicans or something so I said something about how I was going to become a republican and about how I was "taking a class to learn how to hate faggots" or something like that, among a bunch of other horrible stuff I was supposedly doing to join with the right. I think that is the only time I've ever used that word.

[Cool Hand]

I don't really say any words habitually that I wish I didn't. I am "PC" in the sense that I make a concerted effort - and have for 15 years or so - not to use loaded words that demean any particular groups of people. Except bitches, of course. So I'm not a bigot like you, bitch.

Some here may find it hard to believe, but I don't regularly employ any such words in my daily life either. I also made a conscious effort years ago to remove any such words from my working vocabulary, and I try to maintain its neutrality as well as I can. I still fail because I'm still human. I also consciously removed regional idioms like "fixin' to do something" and "I'monna do something."

Despite my disdain for the militant exercise of political correctness for its own sake, I recognize that PC has brought about a positive effect of elevating awareness of how language informs and reflects culture and its prejudices. Although I still fail regularly at recognizing many of those prejudices, I like to think that I have become much better at it than before the PC movement began.

This may be hard to believe, for instance, but I had no idea that "liberal elite" (which I've always understood to refer primarily to a certain brand of journalist in large Northeastern cities and on the West Coast) and "Middle America" (which I've understood to be a nebulous amalgam of everyone but the extremes of the "liberal elite" and its faithful followers, and their analogs from the right) could be so incendiary. Regionally, if it can be broken down as such, this pattern seems roughly to follow the most recent map of "red" and "blue" states. My usage of those terms was very casual and offhand. I'm pretty sure I learned those terms from the Wall Street Journal. I don't listen to or watch any right-wing "news" programs, nor have I ever watched them more than on rare occasion as a curiosity, so I'm certain I didn't learn them there. I assure you that I didn't mean to inflame anyone.

Yeah, I did mention "out of touch with" and I did intend it to mean disconnected. I was trying to comment on the possible loss of objectivity, however, not to call anyone stupid.

Oops. Sorry for the apologetic tangent.

Cool Hand

[Adora]

Although I support gay rights, I often use the words faggot and gay as pejoratives.
You kind of undermine the first part of your statement with the second part, you do realise?

The only time I use "fag" or "faggot" commonly is with other people I know are queers (usually gay men), as they have "reclaimed" it, or as a derogatory term to gay people I don't like. Same way I use "arsehole" or "dick" to describe males I dislike and "cunt" or "bitch" to describe females, though there are instances where this deviates. Sometimes close friends and I will use terms like "bitch" and "wanker" and "dickhead" as terms of endearment for each other. Australian tradition and all. Usually though, it's targeted abuse for targeted audiences. I don't do it often with fag though, because I don't have a lot of gay male enemies, and it feels strange mixing meanings with such a loaded term.

My brother once jokingly said he always makes a difference between "ghey" and "gay". The former just means stupid, the latter means homosexual. I still smack him upside the head when he uses it though, because generally the term is used as a homophobic abuse, and I don't appreciate it. (Yeah, that's my mode of training him: "Be tolerant or I'll slap you!" :D )

Despite my disdain for the militant exercise of political correctness for its own sake...
Example, please?

Regionally, if it can be broken down as such, this pattern seems roughly to follow the most recent map of "red" and "blue" states.
Ahhh, I knew that the IPU sent me this link (http://www.fuckthesouth.com/) today for some magical higher purpose.

[HarryLime]

This is actually a really interesting question for me. I get the feeling that I've used the phrases, but I don't remember specific times. I think that "gay" and "fag" for me kind of fall into that list of terms that I don't really use because I find them a bit unpleasant, much like "cunt." I love profanity, don't get me wrong, but I generally just use "douche" as a catch all for people I don't care for.

Will

[HarryLime]

That, or cocksmoker. Which, ironically enough, I don't even mentally equate with homosexuality when I use the term.

Will

[beyelzu]

Although I support gay rights, I often use the words faggot and gay as pejoratives.
You kind of undermine the first part of your statement with the second part, you do realise?


uh no.

saying faggot does not equate to being against civil rights for homosexuals.

Just like saying nigger doesnt mean I want to bring back slavery.

I realize that it is offensive and wish to curtail my usage of the word, but I dont think that using the word means that I am undermining civil rights or some such shit.

[Petra]

...cocksmoker.

/me bursts into song...




Biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo bow!

Mister richard smoker, you're a poopy poker
Chardonnay & cocaine in the spa
Cigarettes and coffee breath
Little boys on crystal meth
Tonight we'll tango in the street
You eat dark meat

Mister richard smoker, you're a chicken choker
Tonight you're gonna let it all hang out
Pantyhose and Aqua-Net
Smoking menthol cigarettes
Tonight we'll tango in the street
You eat dark meat

Biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo bow!
Smoke!

You eat dark meat
Biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo bow!

Mister richard smoker, you're an Ono Yoker
Cognac and black coffee with the boys
Dancin' in your buster browns
Whirlin' to the techno sounds
Your hands are wet, your hair is slick
You smoke big dick

Mister richard smoker, you're a velvet coker
Bruce and Geoff will pick you up at ten
Goin' out, dancin' in the city
Friday night, gotta look pretty
Tonight we'll tango in the street
You eat dark meat

Biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo bow!
Biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo bow, yeah!
Biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo bow, smoke!
Biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo, biddley bah boo bow!




/me ducks and runs...

[LadyXoc]

I don't say faggot or gay. I am a purist with my cursing and prefer classics such as cocksucker, cunt, etc.

But according to BBC, you too can eat your faggots with a lovely gravy.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/food/recipes/database/faggotswithoniongrav_3899.shtml


*plays tambourine while lunachick sings*

[Dingfod]

As for saying something is gay because it's stupid, no, I don't say that, I still use a 1980s "that's lame". But the other perjoratives I use, but only on the opposite people they refer to or friends, for instance, I might call my worst homophobic coworkers fags or faggots (although, if they are homophobic because of latent homosexuality, I might be hitting a bit close to the mark). I might call my male friends sluts or a cunts depending on the circumstances. The one that brings me a bit of shame is my use of "cocksucker" which might refer to the hammer that just hit my thumb, or someone that screwed me over. Oft times it is lumped in with a string of epithets, "Motherfucking cocksucking son of a bitch bastard!!!", after which the hammer just lays there on the ground where I threw it, looking innocent, just as though it had done absolutely nothing wrong, the bastard.

[Cool Hand]

As for saying something is gay because it's stupid, no, I don't say that, I still use a 1980s "that's lame". But the other perjoratives I use, but only on the opposite people they refer to or friends, for instance, I might call my worst homophobic coworkers fags or faggots (although, if they are homophobic because of latent homosexuality, I might be hitting a bit close to the mark). I might call my male friends sluts or a cunts depending on the circumstances. The one that brings me a bit of shame is my use of "cocksucker" which might refer to the hammer that just hit my thumb, or someone that screwed me over. Oft times it is lumped in with a string of epithets, "Motherfucking cocksucking son of a bitch bastard!!!", after which the hammer just lays there on the ground where I threw it, looking innocent, just as though it had done absolutely nothing wrong, the bastard.

Those hammers... always lying there, looking so innocent!...

[Cool Hand]

Despite my disdain for the militant exercise of political correctness for its own sake...
Example, please?



I was thinking of displays and expressions of moral outrage and indignation in the 90s over the nicknames of certain athletic teams. For example, there was once a serious campaign among some PC advocates to convince the Atlanta Braves to change its name so as not to offend any Native Americans. This was despite there having been no remarkable outrage or offense expressed by the most relevant contingent, Native Americans themselves. It was primarily white Americans of mostly European descent who objected so vociferously, and seemlingly for the sake of "cleansing" language and culture of all vestiges of ethnic slurs and stereotyping.

Some critics of the movement countered with asking what was so offensive about the term "Brave." What exactly is pejorative about it? After all, "brave" is the term translated into American English for Native American warrior. If anything, it's recognition of a once-proud tradition among certain Native American cultural icons. Is it really an ethnic slur? If so, then what about Celtics, or Fighting Irish, or Trojans? Where was the PC outrage about those undeniably ethnic nicknames? Are any of them really offensive? How is the use of an icon an unacceptable promotion of stereotype?

I see the whole Atlanta Braves moral outrage thing as militant policing just for the sake of enforcing a rigid political correctness for its own sake, without regard to whether offense is actually intended or reasonably construed.

(BTW, I can understand being offended by "Redskins," and for the record, there was a serious movement to get Washington's football team to change its name too, but it didn't prevail.)


Regionally, if it can be broken down as such, this pattern seems roughly to follow the most recent map of "red" and "blue" states.
Ahhh, I knew that the IPU sent me this link (http://www.fuckthesouth.com/) today for some magical higher purpose.

Well, if the higher purpose was to make me laugh, it succeeded. I can laugh at myself as much as the next guy.

Cool Hand

[beyelzu]

Although I support gay rights, I often use the words faggot and gay as pejoratives.
You kind of undermine the first part of your statement with the second part, you do realise?

The only time I use "fag" or "faggot" commonly is with other people I know are queers (usually gay men), as they have "reclaimed" it, or as a derogatory term to gay people I don't like. Same way I use "arsehole" or "dick" to describe males I dislike and "cunt" or "bitch" to describe females, though there are instances where this deviates. Sometimes close friends and I will use terms like "bitch" and "wanker" and "dickhead" as terms of endearment for each other. Australian tradition and all. Usually though, it's targeted abuse for targeted audiences. I don't do it often with fag though, because I don't have a lot of gay male enemies, and it feels strange mixing meanings with such a loaded term.

My brother once jokingly said he always makes a difference between "ghey" and "gay". The former just means stupid, the latter means homosexual. I still smack him upside the head when he uses it though, because generally the term is used as a homophobic abuse, and I don't appreciate it. (Yeah, that's my mode of training him: "Be tolerant or I'll slap you!" :D )

Despite my disdain for the militant exercise of political correctness for its own sake...
Example, please?

Regionally, if it can be broken down as such, this pattern seems roughly to follow the most recent map of "red" and "blue" states.
Ahhh, I knew that the IPU sent me this link (http://www.fuckthesouth.com/) today for some magical higher purpose.


I would just like to point out that your little link is full of shit on the founding fathers.

Jefferson and Washington were both from virginia a state that seceded.

but I loved this quote

. Yes, we're fascinated by how you get up every Sunday morning and sing, and then you're fucking towers of moral superiority. Yeah, that's a workable formula. Maybe us fucking Northerners don't talk about religion as much as you because we're not so busy sinning, hmmm?
and thought the whole thing was funny as hell.

[THX1138]

I don't use the word, except when making fun of bigots.

J

[LadyShea]

I have never used faggot, and haven't used "gay" to replace "stupid" since I was 10 (when did that come back into usage anyway, or did it never go away?).

I have noticed that the use of "faggot" ,in a teasingl sense amongst friends, is usually men talking to other men.

[viscousmemories]

I have never used faggot, and haven't used "gay" to replace "stupid" since I was 10 (when did that come back into usage anyway, or did it never go away?).
I never heard gay used that way until I started playing Unreal Tournament - a shooter video game - online. At first I found it offensive because I thought people were using it to imply homosexuality as an insult, but then I came to realize that it was being used as a synonym for 'stupid', and had nothing to do with homosexuality. As such I'm now a bit confused, to be honest, about whether it is or should be unacceptable to use it that way.

[wade-w]

I see the whole Atlanta Braves moral outrage thing as militant policing just for the sake of enforcing a rigid political correctness for its own sake, without regard to whether offense is actually intended or reasonably construed.

(BTW, I can understand being offended by "Redskins," and for the record, there was a serious movement to get Washington's football team to change its name too, but it didn't prevail.)


I lived in Atlanta when that was going on, Cool Hand. To be fair, there were some Native Americans involved. Not many, and for each one that was you could find many that didn't think it was a problem. One thing nobody ever mentions whenever this comes up is that right up until the Braves came to Atlanta there was a minor league (AAA, IIRC) team there called the Atlanta Crackers.

And am I the only person who sees the irony in the very phrase "Politically Correct?" Every time I hear that phrase, I get images of jack booted thugs goose stepping down the street, or someone being sent to the Gulag for saying the wrong thing.

[Adora]

As such I'm now a bit confused, to be honest, about whether it is or should be unacceptable to use it that way.
Well, I'd be asking how it came to be used as a replacement for "stupid" in the first place. Somehow, I doubt it has anything to do with the other meaning of 'faggot' (bundle of sticks).

I see the whole Atlanta Braves moral outrage thing as militant policing just for the sake of enforcing a rigid political correctness for its own sake, without regard to whether offense is actually intended or reasonably construed.
Agreed. I've rarely seen things like this happen, though. It doesn't happen as much as the press likes to hash it up.

I would just like to point out that your little link is full of shit on the founding fathers.
I would also like to point out that it is obviously a joke.

[beyelzu]

As such I'm now a bit confused, to be honest, about whether it is or should be unacceptable to use it that way.
Well, I'd be asking how it came to be used as a replacement for "stupid" in the first place. Somehow, I doubt it has anything to do with the other meaning of 'faggot' (bundle of sticks).

I see the whole Atlanta Braves moral outrage thing as militant policing just for the sake of enforcing a rigid political correctness for its own sake, without regard to whether offense is actually intended or reasonably construed.
Agreed. I've rarely seen things like this happen, though. It doesn't happen as much as the press likes to hash it up.

I would just like to point out that your little link is full of shit on the founding fathers.
I would also like to point out that it is obviously a joke.


but since I found it offensive, I can only assume that you will remove it and apologize to me. somehow, I doubt you will


if you read my post carefully you will notice that I enjoyed parts of it and that I obviously found it funny in part.

[livius drusus]

Damn, you crackers shore are sensitive.















I couldn't resist, bey, I'm sorry. I would totally remove it and apologize if you wanted me to.

[LadyXoc]

I'm an ex-cracker. Somebody come up with a word for that. Come on.

[Godfather]

Like any other well-founded principle, there will always be silly people who take political correctness too far (eg the Atlanta Braves kerfuffle). But this doesn't justify the seething indignation of all those middle-class white males who put 'PC' at the top of their list of What is Wrong with the World Today. I appreciate these people's position, but I think it stems largely from a misunderstanding. It's easy to argue against change from a comfortable position of power, and it doesn't make you evil or selfish, necessarily. The biggest kid in the playground might object to rules against hitting because they stop him from ordering all the other kids around, but it might also be because he just doesn't believe they are needed. It's harder to see a problem with face-punching if everyone is so scared to even consider punching your face that you can't even imagine what it might feel like.

I prefer to think of myself as politically appropriate, anyway, because 'correct' seems to imply that an objective value. I choose my mode of communication depending on whom I am communicating with. I don't feel uncomfortable calling one of my friends a fag frequently (actually, I call him a 'bummer' since watching Spaced) because he isn't. I would never call another one of my friends a fag, because he is, and I know he happens to lack the subtlety to tell the difference between a friendly joke and an insult. It's all about avoiding offence. If you cause offence accidentally, you're a clod. Cause it deliberately, you're an arse. People who despise PC, I believe, fail to see it for what it is: a set of guidelines which takes away their right to be a clod, but still lets them be an arse if they choose.

[Cool Hand]

I see the whole Atlanta Braves moral outrage thing as militant policing just for the sake of enforcing a rigid political correctness for its own sake, without regard to whether offense is actually intended or reasonably construed.



I lived in Atlanta when that was going on, Cool Hand. To be fair, there were some Native Americans involved. Not many, and for each one that was you could find many that didn't think it was a problem. One thing nobody ever mentions whenever this comes up is that right up until the Braves came to Atlanta there was a minor league (AAA, IIRC) team there called the Atlanta Crackers.


Yeah, I followed it a little, but I just didn't get that there was a consensus of strong opposition among American Indians. Anyway, I find it ironic that the PC people insisted on adopting the term "Native American," when several years later those persons that term describes seem to have selected the term "American Indian" as their preferred descriptor. Aren't there official organizations called the American Indian this and that fund? What's really silly is that most people were calling them American Indians already, before the PC movement came along. It's now full circle. Ridiculous.

Cool Hand

[viscousmemories]

I prefer to think of myself as politically appropriate, anyway, because 'correct' seems to imply that an objective value. I choose my mode of communication depending on whom I am communicating with.
That's how I feel about it. My roommate and I aren't homosexual or anti-homosexual, and we know that about each other. So when I insult him by calling him a homosexual it is (in my opinion) an utterly harmless joke.

[Petra]

I'm an ex-cracker. Somebody come up with a word for that. Come on.

How about Rehabilitated.

:wink:

[Corona688]

And am I the only person who sees the irony in the very phrase "Politically Correct?" Every time I hear that phrase, I get images of jack booted thugs goose stepping down the street, or someone being sent to the Gulag for saying the wrong thing. I mentioned 'political correctness' to a friend of mine, a German old enough to remember the reich. He was quite disturbed, until I explained what that meant here.