Intellectual Integrity

[squian]

What does intellectual integrity mean to this community? Is it valued?

[LadyShea]

Do you mind defining what you mean by intellectual integrity? I don't think I have ever used or discussed the term to know if I value it :blush:

[squian]

Do you mind defining what you mean by intellectual integrity? I don't think I have ever used or discussed the term to know if I value it :blush:
Although the point of the OP is to open the discussion for the group, it only makes sense that I should put meaning to the term first.

I may have heard the term first in academic circles where I think it means the ideas you present as your own are your own (not plagerism). And that when you represent the ideas of another person you do so in such a way that does not distort the original author's intent.

Over time, the words have taken root in my head and sprouted into something more. To me intellectual integrity means the set of ideas that I represent are genuine, whole, and consistent. It means those ideas are, to my understanding, true and correct.

A concrete counter-example of intellectual integrity is trolling, in which a person is not really interested in the outcome of the discussion but only in getting many people to react.

If the phrase intellectual integrity is too unfamiliar, what are the intellectual aspects of integrity?

[Godless Wonder]

Well, I find the concept of faith to be intellectually dishonest, for example.

As far as I can tell, there is no such thing as honest faith, as it invariably involves the dishonest suppression of honest doubts.

Many disagree with me about this. They are all dishonest idiots. :)

[squian]

Well, I find the concept of faith to be intellectually dishonest, for example. As far as I can tell, there is no such thing as honest faith, as it invariably involves the dishonest suppression of honest doubts.
Can you elaborate? I was raised without faith and have a hard time understanding it. Although I have read and heard many definitions, none have helped me to understand why people believe in the supernatural (and yet they do).

I believe things about which I have doubts. How can I tell if my "suppression" of those doubts is dishonest?

[ApostateAbe]

What does intellectual integrity mean to this community? Is it valued? I never used the term, but now that you mention it, I suppose intellectual integrity means being commited to the truth regardless of cost. Before the election, I gave a compelling case that Michael Moore was a bullshitting deceiver. Yet, even as some other liberals knew this, they still gave their support to Michae Moore because they thought he would contribute to the cause of winning the election for Kerry, and they thought that his bullshit wasn't so bad, really. That is contrary to intellectual integrity as I would see it.

[Godless Wonder]

Well, I find the concept of faith to be intellectually dishonest, for example. As far as I can tell, there is no such thing as honest faith, as it invariably involves the dishonest suppression of honest doubts.
Can you elaborate? I was raised without faith and have a hard time understanding it. Although I have read and heard many definitions, none have helped me to understand why people believe in the supernatural (and yet they do).

I believe things about which I have doubts. How can I tell if my "suppression" of those doubts is dishonest?
I was also raised without faith, so I also have a hard time understanding it. However, from what I've experienced in terms of others, "faith" means believing something for which there is no evidence. This in itself is dishonest. It may depend on what you mean by "believe." I can say for instance that I think that solipsism is probably wrong, but (of course) I nor anyone else can disprove it, so you might say I have faith that solipsism is false. But I have room for doubt. I don't know it's false and acknowledge that possibly it is true. For me to claim, or to believe that solipsism is absolutely false would be dishonest. I have no basis to make such a claim, and believing in the absense of such a basis woudl be dishonest. Just an example. The Ethics of Belief (http://www.infidels.org/library/historical/w_k_clifford/ethics_of_belief.html) by William K. Clifford might clarify things (or not.)

[viscousmemories]

To me intellectual integrity means the set of ideas that I represent are genuine, whole, and consistent. It means those ideas are, to my understanding, true and correct.

A concrete counter-example of intellectual integrity is trolling, in which a person is not really interested in the outcome of the discussion but only in getting many people to react.
I'm a bit confused about the active and passive voice in this text. To me intellectual integrity is something you have, and intellectual honesty is something you practice. So I would say that honest assessment of ideas (being open-minded, considering my own bias, etc.) is to have intellectual integrity, and trolling is to practice intellectual dishonesty. I value both intellectual integrity and honesty very highly.

[squian]

I was also raised without faith, so I also have a hard time understanding it. However, from what I've experienced in terms of others, "faith" means believing something for which there is no evidence. This in itself is dishonest. It may depend on what you mean by "believe."
I think Mark Twain once told a story in which a boy gave a similar definition when asked by his teacher. However, I have never met anyone who actually lived by this definition of faith. Everytime I hear, "I have faith in God," it's coupled with "because ..." The evidence never satisfies me but that does not mean it doesn't satisfy the believer.

The Ethics of Belief (http://www.infidels.org/library/historical/w_k_clifford/ethics_of_belief.html) by William K. Clifford might clarify things (or not.)
So I read this. Now my skepticism is piqued. First, I'm doubting if I read it carefully enough. Then, I'm doubting I understood the intention (yours or the authors). Moreover, my doubts about my own suppression of doubts are rising. How am I ever going to know if I have been dishonest in their suppression? You've got to help me out here GW! Tell me! Have I been dishonestly suppressing my doubts?!?

[squian]

To me intellectual integrity is something you have, and intellectual honesty is something you practice.
Yes, this makes sense. I guess I was simultaneously making the connection that if you have intellectual integrity, you are practicing intellectual honesty.