The History of Food and Beverage

[Petra]

Some foods and drinks have wonderful histories, playing a role in culture and taking people on intrepid journeys for trade. Sometimes even being catalyst to war, I've heard.

The histories of salt (http://www.saltinstitute.org/38.html), cocoa and chocolate (http://inventors.about.com/library/inventors/blchocolate.htm), absinthe (http://www.absinth.com/links/history.html), and coca-cola (http://members.aol.com/rcrown/Coke/CokeHist.htm) are among the obvious ones, I guess.


Are there any foods and/or beverages you know and enjoy the histories of? If so, please share. :D

[Dingfod]

Even though I thought my mother invented them in the mid-60s, S'mores (http://www.gti.net/mocolib1/kid/foodcookies.html#smores) date back a ways, published in a Girl Scout recipe book in 1927, but something similar was made circa 1900.

[livius drusus]

Excellent topic, luna. Just to name a few of my fascinations, corn (http://www.nativetech.org/cornhusk/cornhusk.html), pizza (http://www.michigan.gov/mda/0,1607,7-125-2961_21430_21431-53822--,00.html), olives (http://www.internationaloliveoil.org/tm/usa/about_history.asp) and tomatoes (http://www.tomato-cages.com/tomato-history.html).

I'm interested in their cultivation history, mythology, urban legends, methods of preservation, even marketing. Not to mention cooking 'em. :gnoshing:

[Dingfod]

The Dr Pepper Company is the oldest major manufacturer of soft drink concentrates and syrups in the United States. And the best, I might add. And, according to various sources, including the very lovely tour guide at the Dr Pepper Museum in Waco, Texas, Dr Pepper does not contain any prune juice (http://www.snopes.com/business/secret/drpepper.asp).

[Petra]

Even though I thought my mother invented them in the mid-60s, S'mores (http://www.gti.net/mocolib1/kid/foodcookies.html#smores) date back a ways, published in a Girl Scout recipe book in 1927, but something similar was made circa 1900.

I wondered what y'all were on about when you mentioned smores in another thread. Now I know! Cheers. :)

We have Girl Guide Biscuits here. They're a very plain, sweet, dry biscuit (cookie to you cookie monsters), but are legendary. They're the type of biscuist that makes excellent cheesecake base. :)

They are only available for a few weeks in the year - don't ask me which weeks - but is a successful fundraising venture for the Girl Guides. I remember them being around, like, forever, and as far as I know, go back to the 30's or something. There are even jokes from the old door-to-door era of Girl Guides in their Girl Guide uniforms selling these biscuits.

[Petra]

Excellent topic, luna.Thank you, liv.

While my knowledge is far too scant to provide great posts on specific food histories, I knew you would enjoy the journey of discovery of history, art, culture and food that I hope this thread will become. Just to name a few of my fascinations, corn (http://www.nativetech.org/cornhusk/cornhusk.html), pizza (http://www.michigan.gov/mda/0,1607,7-125-2961_21430_21431-53822--,00.html), olives (http://www.internationaloliveoil.org/tm/usa/about_history.asp) and tomatoes (http://www.tomato-cages.com/tomato-history.html).

Cheers! Off to read now...

Thanks for the links, Bella. :)

I'm interested in their cultivation history, mythology, urban legends, methods of preservation, even marketing. Not to mention cooking 'em. :gnoshing:

Me, too! It's part of the rich and wonderful meal of life!

Buono appetit, m'dear.

[Petra]

Browsing lazily on a sunny Wednesday afternoon, the story of corn reminds me of the story of hemp in some respects. The way husks were used to create bags and shoes - accessorising is not just a modern phenomenon driven by 20th Century pop culture, y'know :wink: - illustrates the importance of this plant as not just food, but as a cultural and practical resource with regard to industry and art.

...not that hemp is food, but you know what I'm sayin', yeah....?

:naughty:

[livius drusus]

Hemp and food certainly go together like a horse and carriage, if ya know what I mean. :wink:

But seriously folks, you're right luna and there are a great many foodstuffs that are not just that. The buffalo for plains Indians leaps to mind, as it provided food, clothing, shelter and played a religious role as well. Multipurpose food makes a lot of practical sense, but even more than that, food is really a keystone of culture, I think, and is found in so many elements of it.

[wei yau]

During a visit with some friends in Atlanta, I went to the "World of Coca Cola", a "museum" dedicated to Coca Cola.

At first, it was kinda cool. The history of Coca Cola was interesting. However, at some point I realized I was completely immersed in the global marketing giant that is Coca Cola. A huge building with multimedia displays and exhibits all touting the greatness that is Coca Cola.

I started to feel a little queasy.

[Petra]

Hemp and food certainly go together like a horse and carriage, if ya know what I mean. :wink:

I do indeed. :wink:

...food is really a keystone of culture...

Yup. Food is what brings us together. On my travels the most special times were spent sharing regional meals with the locals. Each place has it's own wonderful flavours, regional produce, and cooking methods.

When people share a meal, they share life. They talk and laugh, and extend the hand of friendship through the nourishment of another - whether it be during celebration times with more formal meals - such as during religious or national holidays - or with informal and spontaneous gatherings that result in a slap-up barbeque or picnic.

:)

[Petra]

During a visit with some friends in Atlanta, I went to the "World of Coca Cola", a "museum" dedicated to Coca Cola.

At first, it was kinda cool. The history of Coca Cola was interesting. However, at some point I realized I was completely immersed in the global marketing giant that is Coca Cola. A huge building with multimedia displays and exhibits all touting the greatness that is Coca Cola.

I started to feel a little queasy.

Ahh, yes - try to ignore the immersion in marketing and focus only on the actual history.

I'm pretty sure tha Coca-cola was the only company to do well(ish) during the Great Depression, but then it was still hopped up with cocaine back then. heh. "Coke adds life!" - or it did until the FDA made them take the coca out in the early '60s, anyway.

[livius drusus]

I had pretty much the same reaction to the World of Coca-Cola, eldar. If museums were food, World of Coca-Cola would be pixie stix.

Luna, I don't want to derail your thread or anything and this might be better off in a thread of its own, but are you familiar with the Slow Food Movemement (http://www.slowfood.com/eng/sf_cose/sf_cose.lasso)?

[Petra]

And how about the humble potato (http://collections.ic.gc.ca/potato/index.asp)? It was an important food stock in times of war (http://collections.ic.gc.ca/potato/history/war.asp), and even had a war named after it in 1778, between Prussia and Austria.

Fun fact #1: Potato Envy
In order to entice superstitious French farmers into harvesting potatoes, Antoine Parmentier put guards in his potato field by day and withdrew them at night. The farmers thought that if the crop was guarded it must be important, and crept in at night to harvest the potatoes. It was soon cultivated all over France.

Fun fact #2: Writer's Block
In 1664, an English author, attempting to promote the potato, wrote a book all about spuds. It was entitled England's Happiness Increased, of a Sure and Easie Remedy Against All succeeding Dear Years by a Plantation of Roots called Potatoes. It's likely it wasn't a best seller, but it does get points for having the longest title.

[Petra]

Luna, I don't want to derail your thread or anything and this might be better off in a thread of its own, but are you familiar with the Slow Food Movemement (http://www.slowfood.com/eng/sf_cose/sf_cose.lasso)?

I don't see your post as a derail at all. In fact, it's quite in keeping with the spirit of this thread. :yup: :)

I have heard of the Slow Food Movement, but had forgetten all about it, so thank you for bringing it to my attention again.

In a world of fast food with no taste and too much salt and fat, the Slow Food Movement is a welcome return to real food culture.

I'm a fan of anything that brings us back to fresh produce, fresh herbs and spices, loving preparation, healthy cooking methods, and joyful communal gnoshing.

Now, how am I going to get you all here for dinner?!

[livius drusus]

Oh the potato is a good one. It's amazing how many times you find the potato at the crossroads of history.

[Petra]

A friend of mine who came to a dinner party we had here a week or so ago, bought me a pomegranate (http://www.pomwonderful.com/history.asp) as a gift. It had been years since I'd last eaten a pomegranate, but I love them.

They are steeped in myth (http://www.pomwonderful.com/history_myth.asp), with some scholars suggesting that it was the pomegranate and not the apple that got Adam and Eve into so much trouble with the Big Guy.

[The Lone Ranger]

Speaking of soft drinks, I think it's interesting how different regions (at least here in the U.S.) have different locally-produced soft drinks that you don't find elsewhere.

In Maine, they sell this stuff called Moxie (http://www.mainegoodies.com/food/Moxie/). Thankfully, it's not found anywhere outside of New England. I swear, the stuff tastes like malted battery acid. None of the locals drink the stuff (at least, no one I know does). I'm convinced they foist it off on innocent tourists to discourage them from coming back.

On the other hand, in the Southeast (especially the Carolinas) they sell this absolutely delicious drink called Cheerwine (http://www.cheerwine.com/), which I actually kinda miss. Every now and again, I wonder if I shouldn't ask one of my friends or relatives Back East to buy a couple of 2-liter bottles and put 'em in the mail for me.

Cheers,

Michael

[Petra]

The Dr Pepper Company is the oldest major manufacturer of soft drink concentrates and syrups in the United States. And the best, I might add. And, according to various sources, including the very lovely tour guide at the Dr Pepper Museum in Waco, Texas, Dr Pepper does not contain any prune juice (http://www.snopes.com/business/secret/drpepper.asp).

I totally missed this post until now - sorry about that, warrenly, m'dear.

I'd never heard of Dr. Pepper being rumoured to contain prune juice before, but it's an interesting story. I really dig the whole thing about the secrecy of the recipe and how it is split in two and kept in separate bank vaults so that no single person can have possession of the whole thing.

[Petra]

Speaking of soft drinks, I think it's interesting how different regions (at least here in the U.S.) have different locally-produced soft drinks that you don't find elsewhere.

In Maine, they sell this stuff called Moxie (http://www.mainegoodies.com/food/Moxie/). Thankfully, it's not found anywhere outside of New England. I swear, the stuff tastes like malted battery acid. None of the locals drink the stuff (at least, no one I know does). I'm convinced they foist it off on innocent tourists to discourage them from coming back.

Wow. That stuff goes back to 1884, too. It seems that the late 1800s was when the whole soda pop thing really started - only then they were marketed for their "medicinal" qualities rather than just as thirst-quenchers.

Is that why those places in the US called "drug stores" yet they don't sell drugs are called "drug stores"? I suppose it must be, eh?

On the other hand, in the Southeast (especially the Carolinas) they sell this absolutely delicious drink called Cheerwine (http://www.cheerwine.com/), which I actually kinda miss. Every now and again, I wonder if I shouldn't ask one of my friends or relatives Back East to buy a couple of 2-liter bottles and put 'em in the mail for me.

Cheers,

Michael

Cheerwine. What a great name! Sounds like something I'd be into. :D

Not as old as Moxie (http://www.cheerwine.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=About.History), but it looks delish!

Cheers! :cincin:

[viscousmemories]

A friend of mine who came to a dinner party we had here a week or so ago, bought me a pomegranate (http://www.pomwonderful.com/history.asp) as a gift. It had been years since I'd last eaten a pomegranate, but I love them.
I've never tried one. Well that's not quite true. I bought one a week or so ago, carefully extracted all the seeds, then dumped them in the juicer along with enough pineapple and apple that the flavor was completely lost. :(

I didn't even think to taste one seed first.

[Dingfod]

Moxie once outsold Coca-Cola. (http://www.geocities.com/jphistoricalsociety/moxie.html) Moxie is older too. Moxie is still bottled by Monarch-Moxie-NuGrape in Georgia.

http://www.crabcoll.com/images/moxie1.jpg

[Petra]

I didn't even think to taste one seed first.

Why on earth not? They're delicious.


They're also good to add to the blender with vodka, fresh papaya, orange juice, passionfruit, ice and a tiny, tiny bit of fresh grated ginger.

Hmmm. Now I wish I had some papaya. :prost:

[viscousmemories]

Why on earth not? They're delicious.
I didn't even think of it!! :madrant:

They're also good to add to the blender with vodka, fresh papaya, orange juice, passionfruit, ice and a tiny, tiny bit of fresh grated ginger.

Hmmm. Now I wish I had some papaya. :prost:
Yum.

Warrenly for some reason NuGrape made me think of Towne Club pop. When I was a kid you would buy a case of bottles in a wooden crate, then return the bottles to the store to get a new case when you were done.

I think it might've been an exclusive Detroit thing though.

http://www.angelfire.com/de2/detroitpix/TownClub.jpg

[Petra]

Why on earth not? They're delicious.
I didn't even think of it!! :madrant:

Are you nuts? Tasting the seeds would be the very first thing I'd think of!

Wassamaddawidya! :loser:

:P

[viscousmemories]

:biglaugh:

[beyelzu]

cheerwine is sold at the store I work at. I drink the diet cheerwine and it is much beter than diet coke.


I think the history of pizza is fucking cool because it is something that I think of as italian but is actually a very recent addition to italian cuisine.

[godfry n. glad]

I found this to be an interesting source:

Seeds of Change: Six Plants That Transformed Mankind by Henry Hobhouse (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0333736281/qid=1100793895/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/002-4195106-5111235?v=glance&s=books)

From Library Journal:
This book, devoted to quinine, sugar, tea, cotton, and the potato, is not just about plants but about history. It shows how certain plants influenced the course of human affairs, often negatively. Quinine, for instance, cures malaria, but that quality allowed temperate-climate peoples to exploit tropical areas. The development of cheap sugar is linked with slavery, and tea with opium. Seeds of Change is fascinating and well researched.

Originally written as "Five Plants That Transformed Mankind", subsequent editions added in coca as the sixth plant to be discussed. Hobhouse has also released a new title, Seeds of Wealth: Four Plants That Made Men Rich, which deals with timber, tobacco, wine and rubber.

I'm rather interested in the diffusion process, particularly in regards to the spread of New World foodstuffs throughout the world. Tomatoes, corn (aka maize) and potatoes have become staples worldwide. How many can imagine Italian cuisine without the marinara sauce?

godfry

[livius drusus]

I think the history of pizza is fucking cool because it is something that I think of as italian but is actually a very recent addition to italian cuisine.

Me too, bey. I always have to remind myself that the tomato is a New World thing. It's so integral to Italian cooking now that it's almost hard to imagine a time when Italian food has no tomatoes.

Also, my favorite pizza is the original Margherita. It's just such a classic combination of flavors.

Edit: Wow, godfry, nice cross-post. Get out my head, damn ye!

[Petra]

I remember being fascinated by pizza in Italy. They were so different to the pizza I was used to; nothing at all like Pizza Hut or Pizza Haven. My fave was the Four Seasons pizza with a glass of white wine. I could live in Italy - Retire there in the regions around Largo DiGarda. It's so beautiful around there.


I was looking more at the Slow Food Movement pages last night, and had no idea that they were a movement for bio-diversity and conservation. I thought it was just a movement celebrating "real" food with regard to good, fresh produce, joyous cooking, and healthy eating - and taking your time enjoying the whole experience with friends and family - the complete opposite of fast food. I had no idea they were more than that. I wonder how we can get the Slow Food Movement to become so big that Monsanto is forced into bankruptcy.

The Slow Food Movement is very cool.


Godfrey, that book reminds me of another page I was browsing last night: http://www.killerplants.com/plants%2Dthat%2Dchanged%2Dhistory/

I was also reading a bit about coffee, but I'll post that when I have a little more free time later this evening. :)

[viscousmemories]

I used to go to a place called Oliver's outside the base in Germany. It was owned and operated by Italians, and the pizza was out of this world. Thin, crunchy and salty crust. Even though I "defiled it" (if you ask liv) with ham and pineapple, it was :homdrool:

[Petra]

Thin, crunchy and salty crust.

The way God intended it. :yup:

[viscousmemories]

Oh yeah, and a thin layer of sauce and cheese (if there was any cheese at all... now I don't remember). Anyway neither slathered on like Americans do it, although I rather like slathering of things.

[firescience]

When I was a kid you would buy a case of bottles in a wooden crate, then return the bottles to the store to get a new case when you were done.

I think it might've been an exclusive Detroit thing though. Thats not the case....about 7-10 years ago there was even a towne club store in my neighborhood of Rochester NY...actually in greece ny..very good soda. They had birtch beer, root beer, cream soda, and sarsaparilla...best flavor soda i have ever had in my life...

[Bella]

I've been told that Cod: A Biography Of The Fish That Changed The World (http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=1N6Gok6Dp5&isbn=0140275010&itm=1) and Salt: A World History (http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=1N6Gok6Dp5&isbn=0142001619&itm=1) are both excellent, but though I've read excerpts (for class) I never have gotten round to reading them through. Kurlansky has another book coming out at the end of the month, which completes the hattrick: The Big Oyster: History On The Half Shell (http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=1N6Gok6Dp5&isbn=0345476387&itm=7) as well.