YouTube thwarts suicide attempt

[Legs]

Florida - some suicidal guy (http://www.local6.com/news/14471080/detail.html) posts his last will & testament on YouTube and takes a handful of pills

5 hours later

New York - some guy sees the YouTube video and calls police

Florida - Police go to the apartment and there is no answer, they break down the door and there is suicidal guy unconscious. He's in the hospital now, having survived.

I wonder if suicidal guy will be happy about NYC guy's interference? or pissed about it?

[Artemis Entreri]

I vaguely remember something similar with opposite results on a news show a few years back.
Some kid was on a internet chat room threatening to kill himself and everyone in the room started taunting him and telling him to do it. I think he also had a web cam too. Well he did, with a handful of pills too. His mom found him and read all the PM's he received telling him to kill himself.

[chick]

The young man who committed an overdose several years ago was named Brandon. Pals see chatroom suicide | The Sun |HomePage|News (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article155158.ece)

There was a more recent case where a man hung himself on webcam:
Chatroom users 'egged on father to kill himself live on webcam ... (http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23390052-details/British+man+commits+suicide+on+live+webcam/article.do)

Both stories are tragic.

[fragment]

Was that the "I told you I was hardcore" guy? I think I read part of the chatlog of that once. Pretty disturbing stuff, so it's nice to see someone doing better on Youtube.

I've wondered before whether large sites with lots of users should monitor for things like suicide attempts.

[chick]

Yeah, the kid is the one whose last words were "I told you I was hardcore."

[JamesBannon]

The guy may be pissed & try again. OTOH he may be thankful someone saved his life. If I were the guy watching the video I would have done the same if I could, although I'm not quite sure how.

[ITSOZAZ]

I've wondered before whether large sites with lots of users should monitor for things like suicide attempts.

absolutely not.

[fragment]

Why not? We're talking publicly posted material here, so there's no privacy issues, and it would raise the chances of intervening in time to prevent death or serious harm. What's the downside?

[ITSOZAZ]

because people don't need to be monitored online. what should we monitor for next?

you're not going to stop idiots and disturbed people from offing themselves, so why welcome big brother over to try?

michael :)

[Naru]

because people don't need to be monitored online. what should we monitor for next?

you're not going to stop idiots and disturbed people from offing themselves, so why welcome big brother over to try?

michael :)

Clearly, you are at least some of the time. Y'know, because it happened.

[fragment]

IOW, a knee-jerk reaction to the word "monitor", utilising a straw man and appealing to a slippery slope, followed by a statement refuted by the facts already posted in this very thread and a wildly inaccurate appeal to Orwell.

Kinda what I expected.

[ITSOZAZ]

burned! :)

ok...but it wasn't because of a monitor...it was the act of individuals that saved the day...encourage that, not big brother.

[ITSOZAZ]

IOW, a knee-jerk reaction to the word "monitor", utilising a straw man and appealing to a slippery slope, followed by a statement refuted by the facts already posted in this very thread and a wildly inaccurate appeal to Orwell.

Kinda what I expected.


much like the fact i am not surprised that a bleeding heart lefty would come in asking for minders...

no need for a smug reply.

[fragment]

Oh, and a complete misrepresentation, too. :yawn:

[viscousmemories]

They'll start monitoring after they lose a few wrongful death lawsuits.

[fragment]

Would they really be legally liable? I was thinking that there's an ethical duty of care that might apply, but a legal one seems over the top.

[viscousmemories]

What am I a lawyer? No, no I'm not. Do we have a lawyer in the house?

[D. Scarlatti]

Everyone is potentially liable for anything. Especially in Wisconsin. Starting now.

[viscousmemories]

Bada bing!

[Uthgar the Brazen]

I agree with the resident looney.

:hellfreezesover:

My opinion of suicide is likely to be equally unpopular.

[Sock Puppet]

no need for a smug reply.Too late, you already posted.

[JamesBannon]

OK let's get serious for a minute. How can YouTube (or more accurately it's owners) be held accountable for the wrongful death of someone who decides to off himself / herself and post a video of the event? Seems to me that it would be the equivalent of asking the owners to vet every video that was posted prior to publication on the web.

[Sock Puppet]

It'll be an interesting argument when a plaintiff comes up with one, to be sure. Maybe Scarlatti can work on his New King of Torts rep and bring a case.

But seriously, this is where new duties are born: successful lawsuits in front of a sympathetic panel. It'll take a fairly egregious case for it to happen, I'll wager.

[Kevlar]

Why are you guys so hard on Zeke? He's not loony, he's Canadian.

Besides, such a monitoring system would be highly unreliable, costly, and make your online experience just that much slower. On top of that, it would just get bogged down with fakers wanting attention. The best thing would be to rely on the users to IMMEDIATELY report it to a moderator or law enforcement.

[Sauron]

A similar thing happened here in Seattle a few years back. The Aurora Avenue bridge is a frequent site for suicide jumpers.

http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/pic/PTGPOD/409502~Aurora-Bridge-and-Lake-Union-at-Sunrise-Seattle-Posters.jpg

One morning traffic on the bridge was backed up badly, because a woman was on the ledge, threatening to jump.

The metro bus full of people were so pissed at the traffic backup that they hung their heads out the window and shouted at the woman to jump; get it over with already.

Which she did.

[Legs]

Pretty place to die.

[ITSOZAZ]

Why are you guys so hard on Zeke? He's not loony, he's Canadian.


hehe...

but the real answer is jealousy.

i'd like to hear uthgar's opinions on suicide. i find that i actually agree with him a lot. proof that what you believe and how you behave can be two totally opposite things...

i'm ok being the loon...beats being a hate-filled dork...at least i'm unique here.

michael :)

[viscousmemories]

hard on
heh heh hardon
:beavis:

[Leesifer]

I'm ok being the loon...beats being a hate-filled dork...at least i'm unique here.
michael :)

So, now we're all hate-filled dorks? Fuck you too, Michael. :)

[Petra]

but the real answer is jealousy. :laugh:

...beats being a hate-filled dork...at least i'm unique here.

michael :)

Granted, you are unique. I'll give you that. But you are also a hate-filled dork. And I'm sure you know to it, too. You can see it the mirror.

[ITSOZAZ]

Granted, you are unique. I'll give you that. But you are also a hate-filled dork. And I'm sure you know to it, too. You
can see it the mirror.

ha! zing...i love when people remember to use my philosophy, even if it's to make me look bad ;)



relax leesifer...i didn't say all, just that it isn't as unique as being whatever it is i am- whining, lunatic cunt? something like that, i'm sure...

michael :)

[livius drusus]

Would they really be legally liable? I was thinking that there's an ethical duty of care that might apply, but a legal one seems over the top.
I think any kind of formal monitoring system might actually increase the liability for any failures of said system. Internet law is still pretty nebulous, but when we were researching before we opened FF, we found that sites that actively sought to quash certain behaviors might in fact be more liable for any such behaviors that fell through the cracks.

I can't find the reference now (my bookmark is broke, dammit), but I believe it was on the ACLU site.

[Leesifer]

I'm ok being the loon...beats being a hate-filled dork...at least i'm unique here.

relax leesifer...i didn't say all, just that it isn't as unique as being whatever it is i am- whining, lunatic cunt? something like that, i'm sure...


Hmm. You'd best look up the meaning of the word unique, michael.

[Petra]

Would they really be legally liable? I was thinking that there's an ethical duty of care that might apply, but a legal one seems over the top.
I think any kind of formal monitoring system might actually increase the liability for any failures of said system. Internet law is still pretty nebulous, but when we were researching before we opened FF, we found that sites that actively sought to quash certain behaviors might in fact be more liable for any such behaviors that fell through the cracks.

I can't find the reference now (my bookmark is broke, dammit), but I believe it was on the ACLU site.


That kinda makes sense, as the site would be being negligent in it's stated mission. :chin:

[livius drusus]

Right, Pets. If a site intentionally shoulders the responsibility, then it stands to reason that the responsibility is theirs.

[Petra]

Best to not be responsible for anything, imho. In fact, that is a motto that has served me quite well for years now.

[livius drusus]

:lol:

[ITSOZAZ]

i can still be unique compared to quite a few of the posters here i consider to be hate-filled dorks. some are even ok with admitting that. shit, chuckf even used a quote of mine as part of his id!! to be honest, i have never considered you to be one of these people and am kind of weirded out that you took it to heart. perhaps you're unique here, too? oh hell...aren't we all in my gay little mirror??

michael :)

[Leesifer]

OMG! Somebody, get me out of ITSOZ's gay mirror. I don't like it here. For many reasons:

1) It's foreign
2) It's a mirror
3) It's gay
4) There's no food!
5) HALP!

[ChuckF]

Florida - some suicidal guy posts his last will & testament on YouTube
Loser An Hero.
i can still be unique compared to quite a few of the posters here i consider to be hate-filled dorks.
No you can't. :lol: @ "hate-filled dork."

[Kyuss Apollo]

Elsewhere...who remembers moshing to this classic ode to self-obliteration?

Suicide's An Alternative / You'll Be Sorry (http://www.box.net/shared/3iv555p0av)

Sick of people-no one's real
Sick of chicks-they're all bitches
Sick of you-you're too hip
Sick of life-it sucks

Suicide's an alternative

Sick of trying-what's the point
Sick of talking-no one listens
Sick of listening-it's all lies
Sick of thinking-just end up confused
Sick of myself-don't wanna live
Sick and tired-and no one cares
Sick of life-it sucks

Sick of politics-for the rich
Sick of power-only oppresses
Sick of government-full of tyrants
Sick of school-total brainwash
Sick of music-top-40 sucks
Sick of myself-don't wanna live
Sick and tired-and no one cares
Sick of life-it sucks

Suicide's an alternative

Sick of life-it sucks
Sick and tired-and no one cares
Sick of myself-don't wanna live
Sick of living-gonna die

Suicide's an alternative

Well I've got a little story to tell
About a man said he came from Hell
He said Satan's been lookin' especially for me
He said Satan's got a paper gonna set your body free
He said power and glory, bitches for screwin'
All in your name and all for you today

Oh yeah!

Power and fame, all in your name
All the gold and bitches you ever could have

Oh yeah!
Power, fame, all in your name
All that you want, all that you need
Everything that you want to add to your dreams
Anything that you ever would need
Well sign the paper that's all you do
Sign the paper it's ready too
Anything there it's all up to you
Just sign these papers

Oh let me see if I got this right...
so I sign these papers and I get all these things I dunno man there's got to be something else happening besides like a trip downward...

Well I don't care too much about gold
And I don't really give a fuck about what you've been told
And I don't really care if anyone lives after me
Besides I'm a meaner son of a bitch than that fuck ever could be

[Plant Woman]

Year's ago on another online community, I was reading one of the regular's posts and as I read it, it dawned on me she was going to commit suicide. It wasn't readily apparent, but I picked up on it. So I said so in my post and asked if anyone knew her and could check on her. Fortunately someone did know her and called the police. They found her unconscious after taking pills.

Another friend posted after that and told the story. When this person finally came back she was quiet for awhile but was part of the community again. She never spoke a word about it to me although I am sure she must have read my post.

I would do it again. Had I not posted that I thought she was going to commit suicide (I wasn't sure that was her intent as the note wasn't specific and no one else picked up on it) and she had died, I would have felt responsible. I took the chance and went with my gut feeling knowing I risked being wrong and would look foolish. However, I felt that feeling foolish beat being dead wrong and she being dead. You don't get a second chance at a better life when you die. I often wonder if she is ok now and hope her life is better now.

[fragment]

Would they really be legally liable? I was thinking that there's an ethical duty of care that might apply, but a legal one seems over the top.
I think any kind of formal monitoring system might actually increase the liability for any failures of said system. Internet law is still pretty nebulous, but when we were researching before we opened FF, we found that sites that actively sought to quash certain behaviors might in fact be more liable for any such behaviors that fell through the cracks.

I can't find the reference now (my bookmark is broke, dammit), but I believe it was on the ACLU site.

While it was an idle thought, and I hadn't thought through any specifics, the idea was sort of akin to the way a popular alpine hiking area might have a mountain rescue service. That is, it makes no claim to prevent all deaths and injuries, but exists to provide a timely response capable of improving outcomes in emergency situations. Maybe it's not at all feasible on a website, but if a way could be found that a small amount of effort had the potential to cut an hour or two off response times, that could save a few lives, and thus seems worth doing. If that can't be done in any way without increasing liability, then it seems that there's something a bit out of whack with the law.

[Corona688]

Why are you guys so hard on Zeke? He's not loony, he's Canadian. Hey, leave us out of this.

[Corona688]

Why are you guys so hard on Zeke? He's not loony, he's Canadian.

hehe...

but the real answer is jealousy. fascinating. what are we jealous of, exactly?