Road Rage

[Penni]

I’m concerned about road rage. In fact, I’m pretty sure I’m going to die on the road and that it won’t be in an accident but will be by a person who fully wants to see me dead because I changed lanes during the full moon or something like that. My theory is that driving is becoming like a video game to our pop culture world. Or like that Schwarzenegger movie where they have a TV game show about actually killing real people. I think, in our cars, that people de-anthropomorphize us (is that a word?). And it seems like it’s getting worse. I truly HATE driving, whether it be in commuter traffic or on a long road trip on small roads where you get behind really slow people and can’t pass for 5 hours. Anyway, how bad is it? Witness these three things that have all happened to me in the last week:

1. I was driving in the fast lane on a big street behind a real slowbie. So, I was kinda, a little bit, tailgating this guy, hoping he would move over, because I couldn’t get around him. Well, the guy blocking me on the right suddenly decided it was absolutely critical that he be in my lane RIGHT THEN. So, despite the fact that I was about 2 feet away from the bumper of the guy in front of me, the Expedition (= arrogant, to my mind) puts on his blinker and starts to slide over. I don’t give, following the rule that whoever has the nicer car will give in (I have a piece of crap for a couple more weeks). Sure enough, he stops trying to force his way in and then just gets in behind me. So, I almost started to feel bad, because maybe he needed to turn left or something, which is why he had to get over then, but no, he doesn’t turn left at all. Instead he turns his brights on me, obviously pissed off that I didn’t let him in exactly when he wanted to be in. Oh, and did I mention that the lane was empty behind me for like ¼ of a mile? Yeah, he just had to be in front of me for some reason. Anyway, having him behind me opened the right lane up so I could get around the slowbie, which I immediately did, and the asshole followed me back into his vacated lane to keep his brights on me. Well, pretty quickly he decided he didn’t want to keep up with me (another thing that makes me question why he wanted to be in front of me), so he quite changing lanes with me and went back to low beams.
2. The next instance was on the way to work. I turn from a small street onto a large thoroughfare that sometimes gets backed up. So, sometimes, even when you get the green light, you can’t really go right away otherwise you’d get stuck in the middle of the intersection like a jackass and the light will change on you. Luckily, this is a good light, and as long as you don’t leave the lane, it will know you are still there, and will stay green for you for up to 2 minutes or more, giving the backed up traffic time to make room for you to turn and not get stuck in the intersection. So, I am at the front, waiting to turn, the light turns green and it’s way too backed up for me to go, so I wait, knowing traffic will clear up in a couple of seconds and I’ll make it through no problem. But, the guy in back of me starts honking at me insistently, even though the light is not changing. He can clearly see that it is still green. So, I ignore him of course, but I can practically see his eyes bulging out of his head in my rear view mirror. Eventually, the traffic clears up and, as I knew, we all made it through without getting stuck in the intersection. Nevertheless, even though I arguably saved this guy a cycle of the light, he whipped around me as soon as we got on the major thoroughfare, like I was some kind of gramma driver.
3. The final instance was on the way home from work. I’m on a one way street in which the very left hand lane is actually usually a parking lane, but turns into a driving lane from 4-6pm every day to accommodate a higher flow of traffic. So, as I’m leaving work, as soon as I get to that part, I get over into the leftmost lane, because I like that lane, but also because the guy in my lane was a slowbie. I crested a small hill and, oh shit! There’s someone parked in my lane ahead. Crap, I forgot I left work late, it’s actually 6:08 and people are already parked there. So, real quick like, I accelerate to get a safe distance in front of slowbie and put on my blinker and get back over. A second or two later, he honks at me (talk about delayed reaction). I don’t know why, because I was a good distance in front of him, so I certainly didn’t do anything unsafe. It really was just an accident on my part, again, but no harm, no foul, right? No! This guy now speeds up and tries to tailgate me, apparently to teach me the lesson that he’s not the slowbie I thought he was. Well, he utterly failed because, again, I quickly outdistanced him driving my normal speed (yeah, I’m a fast driver, but this guy seriously was a slowbie and was obviously nervous exceeding 70mph). It reminded me of some saying, “I wanted to yell at the guy that cut me off, but I couldn’t catch up with him”


Anyway, I’m pretty sure that each of these three guys would have thrown a party if they had seen my mangled body on the side of the road a few minutes later. Whereas, if we had been face to face, we never would treat each other that way, with petty punishments and angry gestures. It’s just shocking. Now, let me tell you two more stories. My boss was recently involved in two incidents that show how things can get bad really quickly, and frankly, I would have hoped his behavior would have been better, even if the other person’s was not.

1. So, I guess he kinda cut some lady off on the way to the grocery store. Well, she was so pissed off, that she followed him to the g store and ran into the store after him, running into aisles after him calling him a motherfucker. So, he called her a skank. Then, she went and got her husband and got back before he was done shopping, and blocked his car in the parking spot. So, the couple taunted him for a while, then the husband went in to the store to ask them to call the police (for calling his wife a skank??), so my boss backed his car into their car and rocked it a little to scare the wife. Then, he went into the store to make sure they DID call the police, because he was being illegally blocked, but by the time he got back out, they were gone.
2. He was on the freeway in the fast lane and he had some guy on the right that was blocking him. He swears he didn’t do anything to this guy, but he was just a nutjob and the guy kept slowing down when he would slow, speeding up when he would speed up, essentially trapping him in the fast lane and he could actually see the crazy guy laughing out loud about it! So, eventually the guy had to get off the freeway, and they ended up getting off at the same exit. Well, they pulled up at the light right next to each other and all of the sudden crazy guy looks over and gets the scare of his life. Well, my boss actually decides to follow him and follows him right to the parking lot of his condo complex. Boss jumps out and sees crazy guy grab a crowbar (conveniently kept in the passenger seat?!?!) and start to get out. So, my boss is a big guy, but who wants an encounter with a crowbar? So, he slammed the guy’s own car door on his exiting leg and called him a nutjob and the guy, I guess was like drooling with fury. Some words were exchanged or something that that effect, and boss says, “Now I know where you live. Be afraid.” And leaves.

I think road rage will only get worse and worse. I’m pretty sure I encounter more minor incidents than those above pretty much every day (i.e. exaggerated swerving around people, lots of honking, etc.). And I think that that Schwarzenegger movie is truly a predictor of our future. I wish photon transporters (or whatever they would be called if they existed) really were possible, because we need to find a way to avoid the roads…think also about all the saved time and the quality of life improvements!

In the meantime, I don’t know what to do. I have to balance my desire not to die because some guy takes my fast driving as a personal insult, with my desire to get places fast.

P.S. It's been a while since I've been around, so hi! Life has been busy and really fun lately, so I guess I only spend time on internet forums when I am bored and disgruntled. Not sure what that says about me, but I certainly wish I had more time to spend here as there are a lot of topics I would love to read!

[TomJoe]

2. The next instance was on the way to work. I turn from a small street onto a large thoroughfare that sometimes gets backed up. So, sometimes, even when you get the green light, you can’t really go right away otherwise you’d get stuck in the middle of the intersection like a jackass and the light will change on you. Luckily, this is a good light, and as long as you don’t leave the lane, it will know you are still there, and will stay green for you for up to 2 minutes or more, giving the backed up traffic time to make room for you to turn and not get stuck in the intersection. So, I am at the front, waiting to turn, the light turns green and it’s way too backed up for me to go, so I wait, knowing traffic will clear up in a couple of seconds and I’ll make it through no problem. But, the guy in back of me starts honking at me insistently, even though the light is not changing. He can clearly see that it is still green. So, I ignore him of course, but I can practically see his eyes bulging out of his head in my rear view mirror. Eventually, the traffic clears up and, as I knew, we all made it through without getting stuck in the intersection. Nevertheless, even though I arguably saved this guy a cycle of the light, he whipped around me as soon as we got on the major thoroughfare, like I was some kind of gramma driver.

That was you?!?! You bastard!










:P

[maddog]

1. I was driving in the fast lane on a big street behind a real slowbie. So, I was kinda, a little bit, tailgating this guy, hoping he would move over, because I couldn’t get around him. Well, the guy blocking me on the right suddenly decided it was absolutely critical that he be in my lane RIGHT THEN. So, despite the fact that I was about 2 feet away from the bumper of the guy in front of me, the Expedition (= arrogant, to my mind) puts on his blinker and starts to slide over. I don’t give, following the rule that whoever has the nicer car will give in (I have a piece of crap for a couple more weeks). Sure enough, he stops trying to force his way in and then just gets in behind me. So, I almost started to feel bad, because maybe he needed to turn left or something, which is why he had to get over then, but no, he doesn’t turn left at all. Instead he turns his brights on me, obviously pissed off that I didn’t let him in exactly when he wanted to be in. Oh, and did I mention that the lane was empty behind me for like ¼ of a mile? Yeah, he just had to be in front of me for some reason. Anyway, having him behind me opened the right lane up so I could get around the slowbie, which I immediately did, and the asshole followed me back into his vacated lane to keep his brights on me. Well, pretty quickly he decided he didn’t want to keep up with me (another thing that makes me question why he wanted to be in front of me), so he quit[] changing lanes with me and went back to low beams.Well, lessee. You were tailgating. You were tailgating to force the slower person in front of you to move over. You saw the car in the next lane signalling, because they wanted to come into your lane. You refuse to let them in. Instead, you make them drop behind you to change lanes, and THEN you immediately move into THEIR lane, where you really wanted to be all along, because you wanted to get around the slowbie in front of you. So that's twice that you essentially used your car as a weapon, once to put fear into the guy in front of you, and once to prevent the guy beside you from changing lanes. For what? The only "reason" I see is that you like to drive fast. That's not a particularly good reason in my book. Slow down. Be nicer. No wonder road rage happens around you (and your boss)!
#243

[Penni]

1. I was driving in the fast lane on a big street behind a real slowbie. So, I was kinda, a little bit, tailgating this guy, hoping he would move over, because I couldn’t get around him. Well, the guy blocking me on the right suddenly decided it was absolutely critical that he be in my lane RIGHT THEN. So, despite the fact that I was about 2 feet away from the bumper of the guy in front of me, the Expedition (= arrogant, to my mind) puts on his blinker and starts to slide over. I don’t give, following the rule that whoever has the nicer car will give in (I have a piece of crap for a couple more weeks). Sure enough, he stops trying to force his way in and then just gets in behind me. So, I almost started to feel bad, because maybe he needed to turn left or something, which is why he had to get over then, but no, he doesn’t turn left at all. Instead he turns his brights on me, obviously pissed off that I didn’t let him in exactly when he wanted to be in. Oh, and did I mention that the lane was empty behind me for like ¼ of a mile? Yeah, he just had to be in front of me for some reason. Anyway, having him behind me opened the right lane up so I could get around the slowbie, which I immediately did, and the asshole followed me back into his vacated lane to keep his brights on me. Well, pretty quickly he decided he didn’t want to keep up with me (another thing that makes me question why he wanted to be in front of me), so he quit[] changing lanes with me and went back to low beams.Well, lessee. You were tailgating. You were tailgating to force the slower person in front of you to move over. You saw the car in the next lane signalling, because they wanted to come into your lane. You refuse to let them in. Instead, you make them drop behind you to change lanes, and THEN you immediately move into THEIR lane, where you really wanted to be all along, because you wanted to get around the slowbie in front of you. So that's twice that you essentially used your car as a weapon, once to put fear into the guy in front of you, and once to prevent the guy beside you from changing lanes. For what? The only "reason" I see is that you like to drive fast. That's not a particularly good reason in my book. Slow down. Be nicer. No wonder road rage happens around you (and your boss)!
#243

Erg, lame. I didn't want him in front of me because that would just be more cars slowing me down. Him eventually moving over had the happy benefit of opening up that lane, which I never could have predicted when he was in it, not being able to see that that lane was or was not clogged up. You seem to be going from some premise that slow people have the right of way or everyone is each other's keeper and should be slowing other people down. First, I was not exceeding the speed limit, and even if I was, that's not an excuse to be going 45 in a fast lane where the speed limit is 55. I used my car to assert my rights on the road, as the other guy does not have a right to change lanes on top of other people. I am a fairly nice driver, but I don't let people walk all over me.

And you're not surprised that these things happen around me? Puh-leeze, just because I acted aggressively in ONE of my three instances quoted?

And finally, you'll notice I never exempted myself from the concern about road rage. Certainly the examples I quoted were acts in which the other drivers' behavior was incongruent with mine, but it's not as if I was whining about how I am persecuted on the road because I am so nice and everyone else is so mean. :roll eyes: I'm not asking why people are mean to ME, but why we as a culture are experiencing so much road rage.

[viscousmemories]

Yeah I have to go with everyone else (okay maddog :P) who said you seem to be the aggressor in at least story one and two of your own experience there Penni. The most prominent lesson I remember from drivers ed is "drive defensively". When I drive the speed of the traffic around me, back off from people who want to bully in and just generally avoid aggressive driving I almost never have any problems with people.

ETA: Oops, we cross-posted.

I'm not asking why people are mean to ME, but why we as a culture are experiencing so much road rage.
Because there are some people who believe they have a right to drive however they want and fight aggression with aggression, to their own and others detriment, rather than being the one to back down first when conflicts arise.

Oh and I don't exclude myself either. Notice I said "when I drive defensively"... I don't always, but far more often than most people I know. And I'm convinced aggressive driving is the cause of most accidents.

[Penni]

I very much disagree. I was the responding aggressor in the first instance, but I was agressed against in the initiation of the event. Sure, I could have backed off, but why should I? He shouldn't have done it in the first place. Now, again, I am not trying to say I am an angel driver, and would even point out that my reasoning, which to me is perfectly logical (i'll follow the rules and be nice AS LONG AS other people do, too, but don't expect me to let you walk all over me should you choose to "break the rules"), IS part of what I see as the source of road rage (furthered by my theory that it is easy to be mean to someone in a car that you have de-anthropomorphized).

And my behavior in the other events certainly wasn't aggressive. One was an honest mistake, and the person's reaction to it was all out of proportion, and in the other one (the signal light) I was actually helping the guy out!

Anyway, I placed this in the Philosophy, Religion and Morality forum because (again!) I was interested in talking about how road rage is infecting and affecting our culture, not because I was posting a misplaced complaint about San Diego drivers. So, let me just say it now, so we can all get passed it: I can certainly at times be part of the problem rather than the solution. Hopefully that helps everyone get passed their issues with my driving...does anyone have ANY interest in discussing the causes, ramifications, eventual evolution of and possible solutions to road rage in general?

ETA: Oops, I cross posted with your ETA!... so forgive any redundancy...

[Beth]

I usually just flip a bird and be done with it. I do not tail gate and apologize profusely if I cut someone of by some rare chance. I am nice, I let people in front of me if they are not assholes, and I drive a safe distance from behind. But if they are too rude, I flip a bird. It is rare, oh, I also use my horn.

[Corona688]

Because there are some people who believe they have a right to drive however they want and fight aggression with aggression, to their own and others detriment, rather than being the one to back down first when conflicts arise. We're just not built to avoid that kind of conflict. Every time the other guy "gets ahead" we're a left a little bitter, and nobody wants to take that forever. Also, people spend significant portions of their lives driving to and fro, I doubt there's many that enjoy putting their lives on hold. All the problems of a long walk and none of the benefits, in short. No time to think, no time to stop, no time to do anything, just the road ahead of us and the impediments blocking our way.

[maddog]

. . . My theory is that driving is becoming like a video game to our pop culture world. . . . I think, in our cars, that people de-anthropomorphize us (is that a word?). And it seems like it’s getting worse. I think you're quite right to be concerned, and I think you're also right, sociologically, that being inside cars is sort of anonymous, and therefore it's not so easy to remember our humanity.

I also find this statement:
In the meantime, I don’t know what to do. I have to balance my desire not to die because some guy takes my fast driving as a personal insult, with my desire to get places fast. pretty disturbing -- it evidences the problem, in fact. You're scaring me now. Value your life, friend! Getting there "fast" is worth nothing compared to that!
#245

[Penni]

I also find this statement:
In the meantime, I don’t know what to do. I have to balance my desire not to die because some guy takes my fast driving as a personal insult, with my desire to get places fast. pretty disturbing -- it evidences the problem, in fact. You're scaring me now. Value your life, friend! Getting there "fast" is worth nothing compared to that!
#245

Yeah, I didn't even realize I wrote that...but that's exactly like a video game, like you have 5 lives and you'd rather get your character killed than sacrifice the goal. Of course, I don't feel that way when I think about it, but more like I should never have to worry about dying at someone's hand like that. But, the more people distance themselves from others, the worse I think it is. For instance, I also find it easier to hate people in big cars, like hummers or expeditions, as opposed to people in smaller vehicles, in which the person can be seen more easily.

I think that, in the absence of a solution to human behavior, the idea used in the movie I, Robot would also be helpful: where they had auto drive. I wonder how implausible that is. Imagine the benefits, though! I believe they mentioned in the movie that accidents were reduced by some enormous percentage, in addition, as Corona mentioned, driving (or riding, more like) wouldn't be such a waste of everyone's time. You could read, do your nails, talk on the phone without danger. Basically, productivity would fly through the roof (even if it wasn't all economic productivity), deaths and injuries would decrease and people would just plain be happier.

I know Toyota was working on a system somewhat akin. It's been a while since I read about it, but basically, it would reduce traffic on freeways by allowing cars to travel much closer together (aka tailgating) without any danger. The cars would have an automatic response to a reduction in speed of the car in front that would decelerate you in time to not hit them. They were testing it out down here in SD, apparently, but haven't heard anymore about it in years. I was unsure of how something like this could be implemented. I mean, if only some people had this system in their cars, people they were "tailgating" may not know if they did or did not have the system and be very nervous. Not only would that be stressful, but it would probably reduce the benefits in flow of traffic because the driver in front might start slowing down or changing lanes excessively because of his nervousness. But, I would definitely like to hear more about that idea. Even if you still had to pay attention, and do the lane changes and etc. Not having to worry about sudden stops would be a big improvement. What with this idea and the auto parking that Toyota has in some vehicles in other countries, perhaps fully automated driving isn't as implausible as we might think.

[JoeP]

people de-anthropomorphize us (is that a word?).
Dehumanize, perhaps?

I think people in cars are often less than human. If you treat them as dangerous animals that only sometimes have predictable behaviour, then instead of getting angry with the idiots you keep your distance and increase your distance when they start looking unstable.

Someone (it might have been a bunch of us at school, for all I can remember) put forward the theory that aliens visiting the planet would conclude that cars are the dominant form of life - they force us to build roads for them, dig for oil and ship it to them, in fact we have wars to feed our cars.

joe

[JoeP]

auto drive.
In this country it would be cheaper to hire a driver. I have almost seriously thought about doing this.

[JoeP]

some kind of gramma driver.
Is that like a grammar cop (grammer nazi)? :livcop: :livcrop:

[Penni]

Someone (it might have been a bunch of us at school, for all I can remember) put forward the theory that aliens visiting the planet would conclude that cars are the dominant form of life - they force us to build roads for them, dig for oil and ship it to them, in fact we have wars to feed our cars.

joe

That's funny and true!

Speaking of unstable animals, as part of my mother's defensive driving tactics, she often swerves around in her lane, especially when there is traffic and congestion ahead, in order to scare off anyone tailgating her so that they back off and don't accidentally hit her when she has to stop quickly. It sounds like a great idea to me, but I have been a little too nervous to implement it myself, as I picture accidentally swerving too dramatically and actually having an accident. Nevertheless, it's an interesting tactic to get frustrated drivers to back off by making yourself seem dangerous as opposed to just aggressive toward them.

[Gurdur]

Always drive with an axe close to hand.

[Darren]

people de-anthropomorphize us (is that a word?).
Dehumanize, perhaps?

I think people in cars are often less than human. If you treat them as dangerous animals that only sometimes have predictable behaviour, then instead of getting angry with the idiots you keep your distance and increase your distance when they start looking unstable.

Someone (it might have been a bunch of us at school, for all I can remember) put forward the theory that aliens visiting the planet would conclude that cars are the dominant form of life - they force us to build roads for them, dig for oil and ship it to them, in fact we have wars to feed our cars.

joe

How true. I remember once while I was crossing a side road (on foot) a car came tearing round the corner, narrowly missing me. Then - despite the fact that I had priority, under the circumstances, as a pedestrian already in the process of traversing the side road - the driver yelled at me that roads were for cars, not people. That really put me in my place!

[Ensign Steve]

Damn! I had a man yell at me from his truck as I was crossing the street, on the green, in the crosswalk, to "get out of the road!" :rolleye1:

[godfry n. glad]

Okay... A little advice to those of you who feel the need to make public your poor opinion on another's driving skills, particularly to them.

I drive an import minivan. One evening, while attempting to enter a bridge on-ramp from a two lane arterial, I being in the left lane, turning on to two lanes, the other fellow in a large pickup with oversized wheels. It was a nice day and windows were down. He was on a cellphone and during a right turn, nearly sideswipes my car because he's not staying in his lane.

So... I flipped him off and screamed that he should hang up and drive. I then increased my distance by accelerating onto the four-lane bridge to the legal limit. He then barrels right up to behind me and rides my bumper all the way across the bridge, tailgating. So I flipped him off, again. Through the back window, without turning around.

Coming off the bridge on the other end, the four lanes expands to six, allowing a turn lane two blocks long before getting to the next cross arterial with a complicated set of lighted signals. When the traffic spreads out due the new lane, this bozo pulls into the right lane (I'm in the left lane, bound east), roars past me, swerves in front of me in a yellow light and stops as the light turns red (I'm at the stop line, his truck is 20' ahead of me facing north in the southbound crossing lane). He pops his door and jumps out, storming over to my door, which I'm rolling up. He screams at me with his veins popping out all over his neck and his face turning red, pounding on my mostly closed window about my bad driving skills. When he took a breathe, I pointed out that he'd left his vehicle illegally stopped, facing the wrong dirction in the lane it was in, it was running that the door was standing wide open and the driver was more than 20' away...who's got driving skills problems, shitforbrains? He was blocking traffic, obviously, so he returned to his truck.

He then proceded to follow me, clear to my home. That was my mistake. I saw him following me, I should have driven to the police precinct office, about another mile. But I got out and he pulls up and stops in the lane, screaming obscenities from his vehicle. So I screamed obsenities back, noted his driver's license number and the vehicle description and his description, went inside and called the police, asking for an officer to come to my door, so I could file a complaint.

The officer's response? I should follow my own advice and refrain from digital communications with other drivers.

Let that be a lesson to you.

...I guess.

godfry

[Penni]

When someone's tailgating me really, really bad and maliciously, I always think about stomping on my brakes, like as if a deer or rabbit ran in front of me suddenly, and let them smash right into me. I've never been quite brave enough to do it, and if I haven't done it yet with my crappy car, I'm certainly not going to do it with my brand new car. Nevertheless, I really thought it would be a noble sacrifice if I did it :wink:

[Gurdur]

Nevertheless, I really thought it would be a noble sacrifice if I did it :wink:
I once used to work as a paramedic. As one of the first on such scenes, I can assure you that the usual attitude to you would be simply dealing with yet another casualty in need of treatment, or yet another corpse, rather than regarding you as a noble sacrifice.

[Beth]

When someone's tailgating me really, really bad and maliciously, I always think about stomping on my brakes, like as if a deer or rabbit ran in front of me suddenly, and let them smash right into me. I've never been quite brave enough to do it, and if I haven't done it yet with my crappy car, I'm certainly not going to do it with my brand new car. Nevertheless, I really thought it would be a noble sacrifice if I did it :wink:
I hit my brakes or tap them, just to let them know to back off. Usually it works and they back off a little. I normally will not switch lanes to avoid such a person, though, if they don't like behing behind me, they can either pass or swich lanes.

Godfry, that was a good reminder, I never have done any of that type of thing. Normally I just flip a bird and be done with it. Honestly, though, I think I've only done it about four times last year and once this year to a bicyclist who was illegally riding in the road in the wrong direction- he was riding directly toward my car, he refused to yield and had the gall to glare and make an insulting face as he past my car that was then in a dead stop to avoid hitting him because there was no way I could switch lanes to get past him. So, I flipped him a bird.

[maddog]

When people tailgate me, I tend to slow down. If I'm in one of the faster lanes, I do move over to let the faster traffic by. Those people scare me. I prefer to drive in the next-to-the-slow lane on the freeway. When I'm behind someone else, I play a counting game: whenever I can see the vehicle in front of me pass a stationary landmark (like the shadow of a bridge) I count "one, one thousand, two, one thousand, three one thousand," to see how many seconds after them I pass the same landmark. To be safe, at just about any speed, you need to be three one thousands behind them. I'm often closer than that, so I vary my speed and count again at the next landmark, to be sure I've got enough following distance. Of course, as soon as you get a good following distance, somebody else moves into it, and the game starts again.
#248

[Penni]

When people tailgate me, I tend to slow down. If I'm in one of the faster lanes, I do move over to let the faster traffic by. Those people scare me. I prefer to drive in the next-to-the-slow lane on the freeway. When I'm behind someone else, I play a counting game: whenever I can see the vehicle in front of me pass a stationary landmark (like the shadow of a bridge) I count "one, one thousand, two, one thousand, three one thousand," to see how many seconds after them I pass the same landmark. To be safe, at just about any speed, you need to be three one thousands behind them. I'm often closer than that, so I vary my speed and count again at the next landmark, to be sure I've got enough following distance. Of course, as soon as you get a good following distance, somebody else moves into it, and the game starts again.
#248
My drivers' ed taught me just 2 seconds. And yeah, if you don;t follow "close enough" you'll just have people cutting you off every few seconds. It's especially bad in traffic, when everyone's just going 5 mph. You have to be right on the guy in front of you, or people will keep moving between you. Of course, you will still be going forward, but after a while, you'll be like 50 cars back from where you would have been, and in bad traffic, that is a big delay.

[godfry n. glad]

When people tailgate me, I tend to slow down. If I'm in one of the faster lanes, I do move over to let the faster traffic by. Those people scare me. I prefer to drive in the next-to-the-slow lane on the freeway. When I'm behind someone else, I play a counting game: whenever I can see the vehicle in front of me pass a stationary landmark (like the shadow of a bridge) I count "one, one thousand, two, one thousand, three one thousand," to see how many seconds after them I pass the same landmark. To be safe, at just about any speed, you need to be three one thousands behind them. I'm often closer than that, so I vary my speed and count again at the next landmark, to be sure I've got enough following distance. Of course, as soon as you get a good following distance, somebody else moves into it, and the game starts again.
#248

I was taught "a least one car length for every 10 mph of velocity" as the proper distance to maintain between you and the car in front of you. It's fairly rare to see that here; usually the distance maintained is significantly less.

godfry

[lisarea]

I was taught the two-second rule, too, but when you're driving at highway speeds, two seconds of braking time is plenty of room for gap closers to pop in between you and the car in front of you. Which gets a little old after about the fourth or fifth time it happens in a single trip.

I had a nightmare commute for quite a while around here. About sixty miles each way, and over a pretty open, almost never patrolled stretch of road, so while the speed limit was usually around 75, that translated to anywhere from 45 (farm vehicles) to 90 in the slow lane, with the fast lane probably averaging around 100 MPH. Add to this the weirdassed weather cells where, all of a sudden, out of the blue, you'd get a bank of fog with no visibility, a teeny weeny little blizzard, a patch of black ice. Add to that, even, the fact that unsecured loads were the norm, and you'd have to negotiate not just the usual obstacles like the occassional ottoman, hubcap, or retread, but weirdassed shit, like the four ladders, laid out like a maze, a couple of shower stalls, or a couple dozen bales of hay. And those fuckwit trucks driving around with the "Stay Back 200 feet because I'm SPRAYING GRAVEL at your windshield, fuckah!" signs on the back. Nightmare. All too often, when I'd get to my destination, I'd be a little surprised I made it without incident.

Anyway, it really was (is) a pretty notorious stretch of road, so for a while, the state highway patrol did a little road rage sting. They'd send unmarked cars out to drive like old people and things like that. They'd do the speed limit in the fast lane, maybe 5 or 10 miles below it in the slow lane, and they'd pull over and ticket people who tailgated or drove aggressively.

I loved that. It was the only time I ever felt even remotely safe driving along that stretch of road. I didn't mind in the least arriving at work ten minutes later if it meant I didn't have to navigate a bunch of aggressive fuckwits in the process.

But, as seems to be the default, the fuckwits ended up getting their way. They wrote enraged letters to the editors of the papers, claiming entrapment, claiming that the 'slow' (SPEED LIMIT, remember) drivers were impeding the flow of traffic and putting people at greater risk, and as a result of the uproar, the Highway Patrol stopped doing it. And again, I had to drive about 95MPH on my way to work, just hoping I'd come across one of those WalMart trucks that drove the speed limit, so I could just hang behind them all the way to my exit. Hell, sometimes, I'd hang behind a farm vehicle for a while, just for the brief respite.

I've experienced my share of road rage, but if I'm going to kick someone's ass, I want to do it up close and personal. Not from behind the wheel, and sure as hell not if I'm dragging a bunch of other people into it. For the most part, I get out of the way and just hope that, when the asshole inevitably ends up in a smoldering pile in the median, they don't take anyone else along with them. Nobody's right to arrive quickly at their destination trumps everyone else's right to arrive safely. Period. If you've got a bleeding child in your car, well, I hope you tried 911 first, but if this is your only option, you get a pass. Godspeed. If you've got a loved one in the hospital, and you're trying to reach them to say your last goodbyes, I'm very very sorry to hear that, but you still don't have the right to put everyone else at risk so that you can get your closure. If you're late for a fucking meeting, well, you need to stop breathing my air.

Edit: Moop. In case that last part sounds like I'm addressing someone here, I'm not. Unless you're one of those guys who follows me at 80MPH so closely that I can't see your bumper in the rearview mirror.

[beyelzu]

I admit completely that I drive aggressively, I also watch all the cars arouknd me and check all three mirrors every couple of seconds.

I will sometimes get close to another cars bumper briefly in order to pass, when there isnt enough otherwise.

I only tailgate after I have flashed my lights a couple of times and the dipshit doing the speedlimit or a paltry 5 over wont get the fuck over.

if someone bright lights me for an extended period of time, I spend the next 5 minutes or so fucking with them.

slowing down not letting them pass, until they decide to not brightlight me anymore.

keep in mind that if I see someone coming up on me I get the fuck over, if they flash their lights I get the fuck over.

[godfry n. glad]

Edit: Moop. In case that last part sounds like I'm addressing someone here, I'm not. Unless you're one of those guys who follows me at 80MPH so closely that I can't see your bumper in the rearview mirror.

Nice statement, lisarea, but where in dog's pottyspot do you live?

Those kinda speeds would never be allowed around here. Do you live near Boston or something? Or maybe Montana?

[lisarea]

Nice statement, lisarea, but where in dog's pottyspot do you live?

Those kinda speeds would never be allowed around here. Do you live near Boston or something? Or maybe Montana?

Colorado. The stretch of road is I-25 roughly from Thornton, at the northern edge of the Denver area suburbs, to Fort Collins, which is a discrete metropolitan area from the "Denver metro," so there are large expanses of farmland and other rural developments where the speed limit is 75.