Toyota Prius

[Ronin]

Does anyone drive a Prius?

I'm considering getting one in the near future and was looking for words of advice, pros, cons...about having one.

Also, what are the major pitfalls (if any) of leasing over buying?

[curses]

I used to drive one, it was great on saving gas but hell when it started slowly dying. I drove an '01 and it was fine for a few years, then something started going wrong with it. What that something was was never determined. It started shuddering badly when I had to stop quickly. It did that for about 6 months, then it started stalling and shaking in rush hour traffic. The warranty had just expired, but Toyota worked with us since we'd been bringing it into the shop like once every 3 months for some complaint or other. It cost us over $3,000 which was roughly a third of the total repair cost. That bought me a new main battery, transmission, and computer. Didn't fix the issue and it finally died.

My dad has been driving them since they came out (my car was originally his) and he's never had an issue. He also trades them in and gets a new one before they break the 5 year limit.

[Dingfod]

Don't expect the thing to pay for the cost difference between it and a Corolla. You're saving fuel, not dollars.

[ShottleBop]

I've had one for about 3 1/2 years. It gets great mileage, and it's good for commuting, but the seats are not the best for long trips.

[ceptimus]

A non-hybrid modern diesel car will get better mileage than a gasoline hybrid. And with the diesel you won't have to buy a new battery pack every few years. Diesels don't have such clean exhaust fumes as a Prius, but if you factor in the total environmental impact of producing and disposing the battery pack, then the hybrid isn't very clean over its life cycle.

[godfry n. glad]

A non-hybrid modern diesel car will get better mileage than a gasoline hybrid. And with the diesel you won't have to buy a new battery pack every few years. Diesels don't have such clean exhaust fumes as a Prius, but if you factor in the total environmental impact of producing and disposing the battery pack, then the hybrid isn't very clean over its life cycle.

Less clean, I hear, than the Hummer2. I think that Dingfod has the data on that.

Generation of electrical energy is not particularly 'clean', nor is the manufacture of batteries.

ETA: Here's an overview article (http://hubpages.com/hub/Prius) of the comparisons, with links to the original article and the response.

[Ronin]

I've had one for about 3 1/2 years. It gets great mileage, and it's good for commuting, but the seats are not the best for long trips.

That's something I was wondering as well. A couple of 500+ mile trips per year is a usual.

[wei yau]

[SPACE RESERVED: For discussion of non-Toyota vehicles, so to ensure that we're not all myopic and consumed with Toyota products.]

[Ronin]

A non-hybrid modern diesel car will get better mileage than a gasoline hybrid.

Really, more than 51 mpg?

And with the diesel you won't have to buy a new battery pack every few years. Diesels don't have such clean exhaust fumes as a Prius, but if you factor in the total environmental impact of producing and disposing the battery pack, then the hybrid isn't very clean over its life cycle.

What is the battery disposal process, turn it back into a Toyota center or some such?

What sort of adverse/unclean total impact comparison is available?

I'll have to look into that aspect of it.

[Ronin]

[SPACE RESERVED: For discussion of non-Toyota vehicles, so to ensure that we're not all myopic and consumed with Toyota products.]

The social conservative commentors are all, "Our Humvees nevah, evah pollute!"

:cool:

[Naru]

I've had mine for a year, no problems with it. It's also my first car, so I can't really offer any insight about how it's different from any other car.

[Gonzo]

I had a hunch ~ 浪人 was a commie name.

[Ronin]

I had a hunch ~ 浪人 was a commie name.

Only the commiest!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SO4s4GQqt_U&NR=1

[Ronin]

[SPACE RESERVED: For discussion of non-Toyota vehicles, so to ensure that we're not all myopic and consumed with Toyota products.]

From the OP ~

I'm considering getting one in the near future and was looking for words of advice, pros, cons...about having one.

:wave:

[Ronin]

What about benefits/detriments of leasing over purchasing?

I've always bought my vehicles until paid off and then maintained them (10+ years) until they fell apart.

My Dad always preferred purchasing over leasing and, at one point many years ago, provided some reasoning why leasing isn't the way to go...but I'm not sure I remember that it was all that bad a thing/didn't understand what he was on about.

[ceptimus]

I would just compare the likely cost of ownership for the leasing and purchasing options - then choose the cheapest. Of course, you don't know all the numbers, so you have to make guesses about the likely costs of servicing, spare parts and so on.

I suspect purchasing is likely to be cheaper. The leasing company has to make enough money to pay its costs somehow, so on average they must expect to take more in lease payments than they pay out to the manufacturers, garages etc. I know they will (because of their size and bargaining power) be able to purchase these things cheaper than individuals could, but I suspect that isn't enough to cover all their costs and turn a profit too.

If I had money saved up, I would definitely purchase. If I had to borrow money to buy the car then I would look more seriously at leasing, but probably still purchase anyway.

[ShottleBop]

I've had one for about 3 1/2 years. It gets great mileage, and it's good for commuting, but the seats are not the best for long trips.

That's something I was wondering as well. A couple of 500+ mile trips per year is a usual.

The seats do not provide a lot of back or leg support. We bought lumbar supports for the front, which helps. We've taken it from San Diego to San Francisco several times, and it works. It's got just enough juice in the battery to make it up the Grapevine. (I've never had the battery run out while out on the road, so I don't know what would happen.)

[Dingfod]

If you tend to keep a vehicle for a long time, leasing definitely is not the way to go, but for someone that trades cars every three or four years anyway, a lease is quite likely the cheapest way to go.

[Crumb]

Though if you are going for environmentally friendly, trading cars every 3 to 4 years is not the way to go.

[Dingfod]

If you really were going environmentally friendly you wouldn't buy a Prius.

[Ronin]

If you really were going environmentally friendly you wouldn't buy a Prius.

What would I buy?

[Deadlokd]

A Ford Fiesta (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Fiesta#ECOnetic_model) or VW Golf diesel.

[Dingfod]

:yeahthat:

[Dingfod]

Or . . . I wouldn't buy a new car at all, keep the old one going for as long as possible, or until rust makes it unsafe. Then I would buy a nice three or four year old car with low mileage and make it last 10 years or more.

[godfry n. glad]

:yeahthat:

That's what I try to do.

And...Leasing agencies are great places to find two to three year old vehicles with low miles (but not necessarily low fuel mileage) to purchase.

[California Tanker]

A non-hybrid modern diesel car will get better mileage than a gasoline hybrid.

Really, more than 51 mpg?



What he said.

There's a reason that hybrids are not popular cars in Europe where fuel tends to be expensive: Diesels are easily available.

A good example can be found in the Top Gear (TBSOT) Season 12 Episode 4 where they try to drive from Basel, Switzerland, to Blackpool, England, on a single tank of fuel. They all picked diesels. May took a Subaru Legacy which came in (In UK terms) at 63mpg, Hamster had a VW Polo which clocked in at 80mpg, and St. Clarkson (Who decided if you're going to try a futile challenge, at least fail in style) chose a turbo-diesel Jaguar XJ and still managed 53mpg.

In American terms, the Jag came in at 44mpg, the Legacy at 52mpg, and the Volkswagen at 66mpg. OK, the Jaguar had worse fuel consumption than a Prius, but considering it's a big, luxury car which still does 0-60 in under 8 seconds, I think the point is made. Bear in mind, when looking at the figures, that this was almost exclusively motorway driving. If you spend lots of time in traffic, hybrids rapidly make up the difference.

Now, if you're in the US, you're limited by the current selection, as not many diesels are available for sale right now. But if you must have a hybrid, I'd still look at something like the Camry or Accord over the Prius. The new Insight might be worth a look as well, far more practical than the old one.

I have a review of the previous model Prius over here.
Car Review Thread. - Freethought Forum (http://www.freethought-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15099)

I have not driven the current generation which came out recently, I don't know how much has changed.

On the leasing/purchasing question, I very much am on the 'purchasing' side. Although I don't go as far as Household 6 and drive the things until the wheels fall off, I like the fact that after making my payments, I have nearly free transportation. My Chevy now costs me all of $100 a year to own. The Audi convertible, is about $400 a year. If the worst comes to the worst, if I lose my job and have no income, then I don't need to worry about making monthly three-figure payments in order to have wheels to get to the next job interview. (Of course, compared to the mortgage, the car payment is, granted, negligible).

I also lean towards purchasing new if I can afford it. To me a car is more than just a method of transportation, it's something to be enjoyed. That generally means that in order to get the specifications I want (colour combo, equipment etc) I need to buy new. The extra mileage on the warranty helps too. So far I've bought two new, two second-hand.

NTM

[Dingfod]

Europeans get the fun diesels too, like the turbo diesel Ford Focus RS, that has more power than the gasoline engine, but gets like a bazillion miles per gallon. Or how about those Audi diesel F1 cars, ripping around the track at 200 mph, getting miles per gallon way more gooder (about 30% better) than their competition, who are getting gpm instead of mpg. And winning.