Crumb's [Future] House Of Reptiles

[Crumb]

:lizard:

I have recently decommissioned my 100 gallon fish tank that I have maintained for the last decade. I am in the process of unloading the gravel, and then I will give it a thorough cleaning. My plan is to convert it into a home for a reptile or two. :D

I haven't decided on a species. My preference is for a lizard of some type. :gecko: I don't want snakes, but I would consider a turtle or tortoise. Lizard's seem to be more interactive and lively though.

I've done a little research and have heard that leopard geckos and bearded dragons are good reptiles for first timers. I don't want anything too unruly. :unzilla:

Any FFers ever kept reptiles? Any advice, warnings or precautions?

[Demimonde]

Turtle tank wouldn't be a far leap from fish keeping. I've kept red eared sliders. They are super active and so much fun! All you need is a light source for their vitamin D and a platform. No need for biological filtration unless you want to keep minnows for them to chase.

Pro tip: when keeping turtles, it is good to make a play pen box for feeding time. That way they make their mess in there and you have less tank maintenance. I think daily handling and positive interaction with food makes them more socialized with people. A plastic sweater box is good for this, rinse and go. This is also a good thing to do with hermit crabs, which I have also kept. Not a reptile, but SO FUN. Ours also liked exploring the house in hamster balls.

Sliders are also cheap and easy to find. Around here, you just need to know someone with a pond. They will have plenty to re-home to protect their fishes.

http://www.dfw.state.or.us/conservationstrategy/images/invasive_species/red-eared_slider_turtle.jpg

[Watser?]

We had turles when I was a wee lad. But I don't remember them much. But they would require a lot of water to swim around in of course. With a gravel or sand beach.

[Ymir's blood]

:raptorattack:

[Crumb]

Turtle tank wouldn't be a far leap from fish keeping. I've kept red eared sliders. They are super active and so much fun! All you need is a light source for their vitamin D and a platform. No need for biological filtration unless you want to keep minnows for them to chase.

Pro tip: when keeping turtles, it is good to make a play pen box for feeding time. That way they make their mess in there and you have less tank maintenance. I think daily handling and positive interaction with food makes them more socialized with people. A plastic sweater box is good for this, rinse and go. This is also a good thing to do with hermit crabs, which I have also kept. Not a reptile, but SO FUN. Ours also liked exploring the house in hamster balls.

Sliders are also cheap and easy to find. Around here, you just need to know someone with a pond. They will have plenty to re-home to protect their fishes.

http://www.dfw.state.or.us/conservationstrategy/images/invasive_species/red-eared_slider_turtle.jpg

Yeah, it would be fun to have an aquatic turtle, but I am planning to go the non-aquatic route. I want to turn the tank into a terrarium.

[Ymir's blood]

Next up, The War on Terrarium!

[lisarea]

I do not know much about it, but here is our local reptile shelter's recommended and minimum requirements for reptile habitats, for a general idea of what would work in yours:

habitats (http://www.corhs.org/habitat.html)

[Kyuss Apollo]

Turtles are cool! Just don't let anyone's babby's lick them because for teh Salmonella.

Some years back I used to have fish, frogs, toads, and even had a couple of baby snappers at one time; one a roommate had rescued from a driveway on a construction site and the other I got from a friend's girlfriend whose mother was going to flush the turtle down the toilet.

They were one of the most interesting pets I ever had but I ended up letting them go as some morons that came over my house at the time didn't get the idea of a SNAPPING turtle. If you put your finger on the outside of the tank they would be all nonchalant "hmm hmm-hmm" swimming slowly along and then they'd pivot and lunge SNAP! you could hear their jaws clamp through the water and glass...after they graduated to a goldfish diet and they were getting to be 5"-6" long I figured a tank was no place for them (plus the aforementioned idiots) so I let them go in the Pawcatuck River behind my house.

Then I had another roommate that had a pet iguana that was fairly large, 3'-5' range. At night you'd be walking through the living room and it'd throw itself at the glass at you, freak you right the fuck out.

Not recommending the iguana experience.

Toads are the best terrarium pet imo. Nice, mellow, cheap and easy to feed in the summer (as long you you don't mind trapping the bugs that get in the house or catching crickets outside). They can live for years too.

Plus you can get down with your eyes right next to the tank and look up at the toad, and pretend you are in the Carboniferous Period and that the toad is this giant 2 meter long carnivore!

[Crumb]

This is the range that I am looking for:

Bearded dragon 75 gallons and larger 40 gallons
Blue tongued skink 75 gallons 40-55 gallons
Green anole 40 gallons tall 20 gallons tall needs dense cover
Leopard gecko 55 gallons 30 gallons
Aboreal geckos 40 gallons tall 20 gallons tall
Schneider's skink 75 gallons and larger 40-55 gallons Insectivore in the wild

I have a 100 gallon fish tank.

[Chris Porter]

I vote for chameleons. Would they work in your allotted space? I have no experience with chameleons, they just look cool.

My experience with leopard geckos: Mean little fucks.
My experience with African horned frogs: Mean little fucks.
My experience with iguanas: Mean big fucks.
My experience with snapping turtles: Vicious big fucks.
My experience with red-eared sliders: Mellow fellows.
My experience with some sort of buff-colored tortoise: Utterly charming.

[Stormlight]

We had turles when I was a wee lad. But I don't remember them much. But they would require a lot of water to swim around in of course. With a gravel or sand beach.

Better make that sand or I'm not coming! :unnope:

[ITSOZAZ]

my wife and i had an iguana she saved from an abusive owner...don't own an iguana.

[Qingdai]

I vote frogs!

And some sort of rescued animal.

[Watser?]

We had turles when I was a wee lad. But I don't remember them much. But they would require a lot of water to swim around in of course. With a gravel or sand beach.

Better make that sand or I'm not coming! :unnope:

OMG, you're not even invited! :lonebday:

[Jerome]

Tokay Gecko

:yup:

[Pinecone]

When I read the thread title I was "OMG Crumb is going to join the teabaggers and vote some more of them in!!??"

But oh whew ... It's about the kinder more gentler reptiles.

[Sonoma Bear]

I vote for chameleons. Would they work in your allotted space? I have no experience with chameleons, they just look cool.

My experience with leopard geckos: Mean little fucks.
My experience with African horned frogs: Mean little fucks.
My experience with iguanas: Mean big fucks.
My experience with snapping turtles: Vicious big fucks.
My experience with red-eared sliders: Mellow fellows.
My experience with some sort of buff-colored tortoise: Utterly charming.

I'd vote for chameleons also - they're way cool!

[curses]

Iguanas are big packages of evil. I loved my leopard geckos but I have always wanted a Bearded Dragon. Had a friend with one and they had him trained to sit on their shoulder.

[curses]

Oh and the :heart: of my reptiles was a red tail boa. She was the greatest, but the heating unit went out while we were on vacation and it basically killed her. I felt like such a bad mom.

Oh, and don't get a uromastix for your first reptile. Those bastards are extremely sensitive to any change in their climate and it can kill them quite quickly. /experience

[Ymir's blood]

I understand that mutated versions of Jackson's Chameleons make great pets.

7442

[freemonkey]

I like #5 on this list (http://bestpetlizard.com/) because you can teach them tricks, they respond to their names and you can walk them on a leash and harness, but they grow to be 3.5 - 4 feet long! Probably bigger than you'd like.

[Chris Porter]

I used to work in a pet store that sold a variety of reptiles and amphibians, which is where I get my experiences from (I can't believe that site mentioned by freemonkey says leopard geckos are docile! The ones I knew were biters, and would lunge at you to bite you.) But if snakes are on the options list, I too would recommend a boa, one of the smaller ones. Every one I handled was unfazed by being picked up. And they are quite beautiful. The one I loved the most was a 3-foot rainbow boa (abut half grown), that was just a nice snake overall, beautiful pattern of pink and brown with a green sheen, curious, and outgoing (sort of odd for a snake, I suppose). Would not bite.

[Jerome]

I like #5 on this list (http://bestpetlizard.com/) because you can teach them tricks, they respond to their names and you can walk them on a leash and harness, but they grow to be 3.5 - 4 feet long! Probably bigger than you'd like.

Only if you want to get bit, a savanna monitor would be a better choice for a lizard that gets that large, though this tegu is a much more attractive animal, a stark defined color pattern and their skin is as smooth as silk.

[fragment]

Komodo dragon.

Doubles as a solution for unwanted house guests.

[Ymir's blood]

But a Deathclaw would be a solution for unwanted neighbors!

[Dingfod]

http://kaweahoaks.com/html/lizard_legless.jpg

[mulebear]

I recently had a discussion with Sonoma Bear about the wonderful Eastern Indigo Snake. They are considered endangered in Georgia, but their is a market for these snakes as pets in other states. They are non-venomous and absolutely gorgeous. Unfortunately, they need a lot of room and 100 gallons probably isn't enough.

http://www.floridasprings.org/images/artmax_409.jpg

[Gonzo]

Get a bird. :flutter: They the upgrade to reptiles. :luvbirds:

Get a bird.
:parrot:

[Gonzo]

Oh, Bearded Dragons are awesome. I didn't even recognize. They're nice little fellas. So I vote that.

[curses]

Oh, and watch out for gravel/sand substrate. Reptiles can ingest it and it will screw their stomachs up royally.

[Jerome]

Oh, Bearded Dragons are awesome.



:yup::yup::yup:

[Jerome]

Oh, and watch out for gravel/sand substrate. Reptiles can ingest it and it will screw their stomachs up royally.

Agreed, use pebble aquarium stone, nothing even close to fine.


Bonus, it is easier to clean when needed.

[Crumb]

At this point I am debating between a bearded dragon and some kind of turtle. I would really like a turtle, but I'm not sure what kind would be right, or what kind of setup I would need. I am using an aquarium so that would be an advantage if I went for some kind of small aquatic turtle. :chin:

[Jerome]

For a turtle you need a wide and low enclosure.

[Demimonde]

Turtle tank info (http://www.fishpondinfo.com/turtles/turtank.htm) for you. Pretty good page with lots of ideas and links. You can have a lot of fun with DIY, and with a 100 gal tank to start with you should have lots of room for a turtle to grow into.

[Crumb]

I've been going down the aquatic turtle route, but they are not legal to keep as pets here.

It is unlawful for any person to hunt, trap, pursue, kill, take, catch, angle for, or have in possession, either dead or alive, whole or in part the Western pond turtle and the Western painted turtle. Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife (OAR 635-044)

Prohibited species may NOT be imported, released into the wild or possessed alive in captivity without a special permit. Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife (OAR 635-056). If you have questions about this, contact ODFW�s NW Region Office in Clackamas at (971) 673-6000. Prohibited turtle species include:
COMMON NAME FAMILY/GENUS/SPECIES COMMENT
Snapping turtle Chelydridae All species and hybrids
Chinese pond turtle Emydidae — Chinemys All species and hybrids
Pond turtle Emydidae — Clemmys All nonnative species
Painted turtle Emydidae — Chrysemys All nonnative sub-species
European pond turtle Emydidae — Emys orbicularis
Blanding�s turtle Emydidae — Emydoidea blandingii
Map turtle Emydidae — Graptemys All species and hybrids
Asian pond turtle Emydidae — Mauremys All species and hybrids
Pond slider Emydidae — Pseudemys and Trachemys All species and hybrids (Red-eared slider)
Common musk turtle Kinosternidae — Kinosternon odoratum
Common mud turtle Kinosternidae — Kinosternon subrubrum
North American soft shell turtle Trionychidae — Apalone All species and hybrids
African soft shell turtle Trionychidae — Trionyx triunguis
:sadcheer:

[Demimonde]

That is crazy Crumb! And too bad, :sad:

[Dingfod]

Get a pet rock, they're low maintenance.

[Crumb]

The good news is the diamond terrapin is legal in :or:! :woohoo: We are going to the pet store today to check one out. I think this may be the guy for us, and they are small enough we could comfortably house two adults. :pleased:

http://www.msa.md.gov/msa/mdmanual/01glance/symbols/images/terp6a.jpg

[Jerome]

My State Mascot!!!


:bbed:

:jumpforjoy:

:hyperb::hyperb::hyperb:

:cheered::cheered::cheered:

:bundance::bundance::bundance:

:baby:



http://www.msa.md.gov/msa/mdmanual/01glance/symbols/images/terp6a.jpg

[Crumb]

We went and had a look and they are so cute. They are black and just a tad bigger than a quarter. A few months old. :aww: I am so excited to get things set up and ready for them. :) Really just have a buy a big filter because my old power heads aren't up to the turtle task. Other than that just need to get things set up. I have a basking spot and a UVA/B bulb. :excited:

The ones they have look a lot like this guy:
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_CSgTfgHQ8aI/SvSZCwx8ayI/AAAAAAAAE-g/36P3jyfOF3M/s320/baby+terrapin-747203.JPG

[Pinecone]

Cute :turtle: !! :excited:

[Jerome]

I have never seen one that small. :deepsigh:

[Crumb]

The Creation of a Terrapin Tank (These are pictures from the work I did on the tank yesterday.)

The Blank Canvas:
7482

Added background, gravel and a splash of water
7483

Filled about half full of water. This is around the level I think I may have the water depending on how the basking light and area works out.
7484

This morning the water had cleared up quite a bit.
7485

[Jerome]

How are you filtering the water?

Will you place a big rock above the water line for the turtle to rest on?

[Crumb]

In the set up you see I have an under gravel filter and two power heads. On the way in the mail is an internal filter that uses carbon.

I have a floating platform that hooks to the wall as a pull out and basking area. It should appear in the next pictures when I get it assembled.

[Jerome]

I can tell you are having fun. :yup:

[Crumb]

I am. :)

[livius drusus]

As am I watching it all come together. :wriggle:

[Demimonde]

:heart: undergravel filter! Glad it is coming together Crumb!

Since you will have a grow light, have you considered planting your tank? I know of a few cheap varieties that are turtle tolerant and quite pretty. Natural plants will also cut down on algea growth.

[Flying Monkey]

I can tell you are having fun. :yup:

He certainly is! :happy:

He's gone a little nuts in fact, so has the feline. :hellyes:

[Crumb]

:heart: undergravel filter! Glad it is coming together Crumb!

Since you will have a grow light, have you considered planting your tank? I know of a few cheap varieties that are turtle tolerant and quite pretty. Natural plants will also cut down on algea growth.
I might consider natural plants. I did have some algae problems when it was a fish tank and now adding the UV light might just increase the problem.

What plants would you recommend?

[Crumb]

He's gone a little nuts in fact, so has the feline. :hellyes:
I'm not nearly as crazy as that cat. :nutty:

[Flying Monkey]

He's gone a little nuts in fact, so has the feline. :hellyes:
I'm not nearly as crazy as that cat. :nutty:

You might be crazier.

"This one's trouble" they said...you just had to have the trouble maker :curses:

[JoeP]

The Creation of a Terrapin Tank (These are pictures from the work I did on the tank yesterday.)



Added background, gravel and a splash of water
7483



Not bad. You just need to complete the background with :glare: or :lolhog:

And possibly a :turtleporn: to inspire the little darlings.

[Crumb]

Here is the tank as it is now. I am still waiting on my internal filter, but it is still turtle worthy at this point:
7494

Is this some Chinese take-out?
7495

Nope it is our new little diamondback terrapin! :w00t:
7496

Here he (or she) is checking out her new basking spot:
7497

and taking a dip in the water:
7498

:D

Now we need to name... it.

[livius drusus]

OMGOMGOMG :headasplode:

[slimshady2357]

Legen -wait for it- DARY!

[BrotherMan]

Is this some Chinese take-out?

Nope it is our new little diamondback terrapin! :w00t:

DONT' LET QINGDAI SEE IT! Not mutually exclusive categories!

Now we need to name... it.

Archibald J. Terrapin.

[livius drusus]

He looks like a Chauncey to me. Or maybe an Atticus. Or Fletcher.

[freemonkey]

so cute.

[Jerome]

I Love the Sphinx!

:happy::mememe::happy:

[Jerome]

I am amazed by the definition in color on the neck, beautiful!

So happy for you!

This Terrapin has a happy home.

:cheer::cheer::cheer:

[lisarea]

You have to give it a gender neutral name.

Like Terry. Terry Pin.

Wait no. Sparklepants. Sparklepants is better, and still gender neutral.

[livius drusus]

Rory B. Bellows

[Crumb]

Or Terry Pin Sparklepants.

[Demimonde]

Such a little darling! :squee:

For plants I would start with duckweed. It grows like crazy and is an excellent fresh food source. Easy peasy and pretty. It is a free floater and a great plant. Turtles love this stuff so the hard part will only be letting it establish itself into a good bunch that will tolerate grazing. You can start it in a bucket with an air stone for circulation. Also your wee mite I can't imagine would eat much so you can try starting it in the tank.

Anacharis is a good low light plant that the turtles will leave alone for the most part. It doesn't have roots per se but will anchor in the substrate. Java fern is pretty and also not generally devoured by turtles. You can tie it to drift wood or a stone and it will develop into a nice focal point.

I like to keep it simple with plants, one type for grazing and a couple ornamentals is a good mix. One floating type with a couple statuesque planting is nice, especially when your floater is a food source and your critters will move it around and nom/play with it.

I would tuck the anacharis in the substrate with a weight on the darker half of the tank while it gets established. The java fern closer to the light will be necessary. The duck weed will wander to it's own sweet will to be devoured or thrive. Oh, and if you have issues with duckweed getting in the filter, you can make a barrier or pre filter for the intake.

Being a diamond guy, might I suggest Cartier and Winston for names. Oh! or Cabochon (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cabochon) or some kinda diminutive there of. Cab is a fun name.

[Demimonde]

IIRC you collect currency don't you Crumb? Thought I'd share that my fancy goldfish are all named to a currency theme. Dollar, Cash, Franc, Sterling, Yen, Dinero, Sheckle... you can go on forever with that.

Congrats on the new baby!

[Crumb]

He looked lonely so I put a friend in with him:
7499

Oh and we still have Jasper too. :) I think he is a little jealous of the terrapin. :giggle:
7500

[livius drusus]

Double the cute! :aww: :aww:

Jasper looks like he's clinging to his scratching post for comfort. I see you also have one of those nail file mat things. Does he use it?

[freemonkey]

Terry Pin Sparklepants is giving Rubber McFakeypants the "look"

[Jerome]

Or Terry Pin Sparklepants.

too gay

[Demimonde]

Silly Jerome it is so totally gender neutral.

I say Harry Winston, because Harry is an hilarious name for a turtle. Then when you get the second one, he can be Jean Jacques Cartier. You can call him JJ and say DYN-O-MITE!

Also you can brag about the swag you bring home to FM.

[Jerome]

I like Harry, .. :blush:

[Crumb]

I see you also have one of those nail file mat things. Does he use it?
No. :sadno: He likes to keep his razor sharp machetes as long as possible. :blackcat:

[Jerome]

He looked lonely so I put a friend in with him:


His friend is a sea turtle, are you providing encouragement?


:cool:

[Crumb]

He can dream big. :yup:

[Qingdai]

He look delicious Yang tonifying cute, Crumb.

[wei yau]

Wally.

All turtles should be named Wally.

Mine was.

And I miss him.

[mulebear]

Since you don't know the gender, may I suggest the following...

Drag Queen Names

1. Rita Beads
2. Shanita Quit
3. Crystal DeCanter
4. Della Catessen
5. Patty O'Furniture
6. Miss Inglink
7. Eileen Dover
8. Sofonda Peters
9. Dee Flaytable
10. Winnie Baygo
11. Ginger Vitus
12. Barb Wire

[livius drusus]

Are all those drag queens personal friends of yours or are you just a fan?

[mulebear]

Actually, I was acquainted with drag queens that went by the monikers of Shanita Quit, Sofonda Peters, and Dixie Dee Cup.

My cousins used to love going to drag shows and I used to tag along, but for the most part I found them boring.

Anyway, I thought the turtle would look cute in some taffeta.

[Flying Monkey]

Or Terry Pin Sparklepants.

Sparklepants will not be any part of the name.

[Flying Monkey]

He looked lonely so I put a friend in with him:
7499

Oh and we still have Jasper too. :) I think he is a little jealous of the terrapin. :giggle:
7500


That's my little trouble maker!:spinning:

[livius drusus]

Jasper, the second terrapin or Crumbles?

[Crumb]

:lol:

[The Lone Ranger]

Diamondback Terrapins are notoriously difficult to sex when young, but there are a few things you can look for. (It'd probably be a good idea to look at several in the store for comparison, so you'll have an idea of the normal variation between the sexes.)

Sexing adults is easy, because the females grow to much larger size than do the males. Sexing juveniles can be ... difficult. It's my understanding that it's all but impossible to accurately determine a Diamondback's sex before it has reached a length of at least 4 inches.

Once it has gotten that large, differences between the sexes should be apparent. The first difference that will be noticable is that a male's tail is much longer and wider than is a female's. Beyond that size, the differences between males and females become ever more obvious because the female's head is larger, and her carapace is more highly domed. And she grows to a much larger final size, as mentioned.


Cheers,

Michael

[Crumb]

Well there were only two in the store. The other one had a slightly longer shell and a larger ridge on the shell. So she could have been the female and we took the male, but with only two it could have been just individual variation. I didn't really pay attention to their tails.

[freemonkey]

I think you should go back and get the other one. You know, for comparison.

[Ymir's blood]

Stay safe!

http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/nn259/pitshade/mensadventure_04.jpg

[Crumb]

I think you should go back and get the other one. You know, for comparison.
we would have got both right off the bat, but they are a bit expensive. If this one seems to thrive we certainly have the room to get him a buddy.

[lisarea]

Diamondback Terrapins are notoriously difficult to sex when young[...]

Sexing adults is easy[...]. Sexing juveniles can be ... difficult. It's my understanding that it's all but impossible to [...] sex before it has reached a length of at least 4 inches.


What happened to FF? Has there been some sudden outbreak of Klassy going around or something?

[Crumb]

Oh and I have an aquarium related question.

I have some large rocks that were in my tank before when I had an algae issue. Now those rocks have a definite greenish hue to them. Will it encourage algae growth if I put them in the new tank? Is there a safe way I can kill any algae in the rock and then put it in the tank?

[Jerome]

Oh and I have an aquarium related question.

I have some large rocks that were in my tank before when I had an algae issue. Now those rocks have a definite greenish hue to them. Will it encourage algae growth if I put them in the new tank? Is there a safe way I can kill any algae in the rock and then put it in the tank?

Those rocks are fine, algae is not bacteria, it will get in there if the conditions are right no matter if those rocks go in or not.

[Demimonde]

Algae will get in no matter what, but they might propagate off the dried algae. You can scrub them with vinegar and let them dry in the sun, but give them a serious rinsing before you put them back in the tank.

[Sonoma Bear]

Or Terry Pin Sparklepants.

too gay

or... not gay enough! :D

[Flying Monkey]

Or Terry Pin Sparklepants.

too gay

or... not gay enough! :D

ohhh deep...