I'm an Insulting, Hypocritical Asshole

[livius drusus]

I suppose it's a fair enough cop (http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?t=122281). :giggle:

[Gurdur]

I think I can still out-do you.

[Dingfod]

Locked. You evil biatch!

[Skep]

You're also a spineless, thin skinned crybaby.

[John Carter]

I never go into a debate with the aim of deconverting them (very unlikely), but to convince the fence sitters that I am right. This requires me to demolish their arguments, and appear to have the upper hand. They use straw men, red herrings, cleverly disguised ad hominems? Fine, I'll do the same.


This in particular is utter bullshit. If I was a "fence sitter" I certainly would not be convinced by such tactics. If anything, such a debste would serve only to keep me firmly on the fence, or cause me to look for a third alternative.

[beyelzu]

You're also a spineless, thin skinned crybaby.
and a good thing too, I dont think that the world at large could deal with a spined livius drusus.
:tmgrin:

[xouper]

OK, what I don't get is why was the thread locked? Is that any way to treat OdysseusTheInnkeeper's apology? Why not just punish the miscreants instead of the whole thread? What am I missing?

[MooseIBe]

I was very impressed with OtheI's apology, frankly.

As for fence sitters .. well, I AM one (though I am never ever going to fall on the fundy side of anything, FWIW) and I have to say that seeing tit for tat behaviour and low tactics on both sides would, as someone else has already said, keep me firmly on the fence.

[viscousmemories]

OK, what I don't get is why was the thread locked? Is that any way to treat OdysseusTheInnkeeper's apology? Why not just punish the miscreants instead of the whole thread? What am I missing?
In my experience The Other Michael always favors locking threads over editing content, at least in ICR threads. There's a law not unlike Godwin's that goes something like "As an ICR thread grows longer the probability of The Other Michael locking it approaches one."

I don't know if his rationale is something nobel (i.e. preferring to lock the thread over editing or deleting what people write) or not so much (i.e. preferring to leave insults directed toward particular posters), but whatever the case that's his typical response. Roland98 is the only admin who typically moderates the ICR as if it's one of the regular fora, and would probably have deleted the insults and left the thread open.

[HelenM]

OK, what I don't get is why was the thread locked? Is that any way to treat OdysseusTheInnkeeper's apology? Why not just punish the miscreants instead of the whole thread? What am I missing?
In my experience The Other Michael always favors locking threads over editing content, at least in ICR threads. There's a law not unlike Godwin's that goes something like "As an ICR thread grows longer the probability of The Other Michael locking it approaches one."

I don't know if his rationale is something nobel (i.e. preferring to lock the thread over editing or deleting what people write) or not so much (i.e. preferring to leave insults directed toward particular posters), but whatever the case that's his typical response. Roland98 is the only admin who typically moderates the ICR as if it's one of the regular fora, and would probably have deleted the insults and left the thread open.

I can't speak for any particular admin, but I would say that once the apology had been made and accepted, there wasn't a clear reason to keep it open anymore anyway.

It does amaze me how some people on discussion boards seem intent on advertising what an asshole they are - no, I didn't mean you, liv :D

Helen

[livius drusus]

I think I can still out-do you.

Hey, I've only been on the net for 6 years or so. Give me time to catch up.

Locked. You evil biatch!

I do what I can. The weird thing is I was genuinely trying to get him to chill and stop crapping on the thread. I prolly shouldn't have put that little dig in at the end, huh? :shy:

You're also a spineless, thin skinned crybaby.

I totally am a crybaby, that's true. One out of three ain't bad.

This in particular is utter bullshit. If I was a "fence sitter" I certainly would not be convinced by such tactics. If anything, such a debste would serve only to keep me firmly on the fence, or cause me to look for a third alternative.

I suspect if he ever were in a debate with a fundamentalist -- I doubt he's actually been in one for real -- his viciousness would be the one glaring feature of the interaction, even more so than the fallacy mirrorring he seems to think is so convincing.

I don't really have any previous experience with this guy, but someone who calls other atheists every name in the book is hardly going to be a model of persuasiveness for the undecided.

and a good thing too, I dont think that the world at large could deal with a spined livius drusus.

I am not a cephalopod! :cthulhu3:

OK, what I don't get is why was the thread locked? Is that any way to treat OdysseusTheInnkeeper's apology? Why not just punish the miscreants instead of the whole thread? What am I missing?

I think vm is right that not every admin would have locked that thread. In my day on the job, I would probably have split off the pissy posts (including mine, natch) and left the apology thread open.

I actually didn't expect the lock. Damn shame too, because my retort would have been good.

I was very impressed with OtheI's apology, frankly.

As for fence sitters .. well, I AM one (though I am never ever going to fall on the fundy side of anything, FWIW) and I have to say that seeing tit for tat behaviour and low tactics on both sides would, as someone else has already said, keep me firmly on the fence.

I was impressed with his apology too, Moosie. I was impressed with yours also, btw, because although I basically agreed with what you told him on that other thread, I did think it was more than a little hyperbolic. ;)

Yeah, I have no idea where m_h gets his notions of how to win friends and influence people. Okay I have some idea, but I won't repeat it in fence-sitting company. :D

In my experience The Other Michael always favors locking threads over editing content, at least in ICR threads. There's a law not unlike Godwin's that goes something like "As an ICR thread grows longer the probability of The Other Michael locking it approaches one."

He he... Well, I don't really think he gets involved often enough for us to be able to formulate that kind of law, but I do think he has a low tolerance for thread clean-up.

He had edited two of m_h's posts already to remove one insult a piece ("pussy" to OdysseusTheInkeeper and "asshole" to TySixtus). I suspect he wasn't keen on picking out the naughty bits of that last post and just threw up his hands. That would explain why the litany of flames against me still cheerily stands. Not that I'm complaining, mind you. This thread would be far less entertaining if it had to link to an edited post.

I can't speak for any particular admin, but I would say that once the apology had been made and accepted, there wasn't a clear reason to keep it open anymore anyway.

There's just as much reason to keep it open as there is reason to keep open any thread. The default should be threads are open, imo. Just on principle, you need a clear reason to lock them, I think, not to keep them open.

It does amaze me how some people on discussion boards seem intent on advertising what an asshole they are - no, I didn't mean you, liv


Oh suuuuure you didn't. :giggles:

[Legs]

When I grow up I wanna be just like liv :yup:

[MooseIBe]

Heeheee yes I was in a rather hyperbolic frame of mind at the time and, most other times, I would have framed it a little more calmly.

[livius drusus]

When I grow up I wanna be just like liv

Don't let the average message board poster fool you: quality spineless, thin-skinned, insulting, hypocritical asshole crybabies are made, not born. I suggest you start working on it now, Legs, because you've got a long way to go.

Heeheee yes I was in a rather hyperbolic frame of mind at the time and, most other times, I would have framed it a little more calmly.

I hear ya. I probably could have refrained from using the classic general statement which is obviously an insult but is not editable according to the rules and policies of IIDB trick myself.

[MooseIBe]

/me looks shocked that Liv admits using the classic general statement which is obviously an insult but is not editable according to the rules and policies of IIDB trick myself and asserts that would never dream of such a thing herself :D

[livius drusus]

/me giggles prettily and slips Moosie a quick behind the back low five.

[MooseIBe]

/me maintains an outward air of deep shock and disapproval

[viscousmemories]

In my experience The Other Michael always favors locking threads over editing content, at least in ICR threads. There's a law not unlike Godwin's that goes something like "As an ICR thread grows longer the probability of The Other Michael locking it approaches one."
He he... Well, I don't really think he gets involved often enough for us to be able to formulate that kind of law, but I do think he has a low tolerance for thread clean-up.

He had edited two of m_h's posts already to remove one insult a piece ("pussy" to OdysseusTheInkeeper and "asshole" to TySixtus). I suspect he wasn't keen on picking out the naughty bits of that last post and just threw up his hands. That would explain why the litany of flames against me still cheerily stands. Not that I'm complaining, mind you. This thread would be far less entertaining if it had to link to an edited post.
Oh sure, go for the most charitable interpretation of his actions. It's always the same with your ilk. :madrazz:

[livius drusus]

They don't call us spineless crybabies for nothing, you know.

[Gurdur]

The whole thread is pretty damn peculiar, livius drusus and Moose being two of the sane people on it.
I was quite astonished to see Odysseus The Innkeeper make an apology like that, because frankly Odysseus is a minor nut with a vicious kind of style himself --- I suspect him of being a former psych patient, one on the mild side of the range of possible illnesses, and he also has a yen for Scientology, and hates anyone who debunks $cientology.
So it was a big surprise to see him stand up on his hind feet and make an apology to Seebs like that.

So anyway the thread started going off into Kumbaya-Land with Moose and others being all nice, and then mountain_hare makes his big squat.
Now, Seebs, whatever else he is, is not a fundy, so mountain_hare was way off from the start; but the brilliant thing was how he so viciously attacked Odysseus for simply being big and nice. I mean, Way to go, arsehole ! How To Lose Friends And Influence People Against You!
:yup:
Total dildo --- I hope he keeps up the attacks on anyone he sees as backsliding, anyone he sees as dallying with the Devil, because, like wow, man, could you ever ask for a more beautiful example of a Raving Fundy Atheist Nutcase Being Completely Counter-Productive in action ?
I didn't like that thread being locked (and if I had seen this and therefore it before it had gotten locked, I would have probably broken my own rule and said something on that thread) -- that rewards the arseholes like mountain_hare, it doesn't discourage them. But then, hey, what happens over there is just so not my problem. Especially when locked.
:popcorn:

[MooseIBe]

I just got a rather viscious PM from Mountain Hare which makes me think he's veering way off into la-la land. Anyone with an ounce of sanity (gosh, I AM pleased that you think I have some .. cheque's in the post :D) can tell that that kind of style isn't going to win anyone over at all .. I'd prefer talking with a fundy to be honest *reconsiders this statement and wonders if she can possibly let it stand, then rereads MH's frankly unpleasant message to self and decides she can*.

/me bursts into a chorus of Kumbayah, just for the helluvit.

[Gurdur]

* MooseIBe bursts into a chorus of Kumbayah,
Tsk ? Tsk.
I prefer The Jam.

[viscousmemories]

Not that y'all aren't aware of this, but just a friendly reminder that this is a public forum with a lot of posters from IIDB. So you might not want to say anything about anyone that you don't want to have to defend when someone invites them to come here and read it. (Which seems to happen with some frequency, Kumbaya refrains aside...) :wink:

[MooseIBe]

LOL I haven't said anything that I mind people reading :D. Though I was tempted to, once or twice.

And damnit, I want Kumbaya!

/me starts to sing very loudly, drowning out the punk coming from Gurdur

[livius drusus]

I actually seriously considered alerting m_h to this thread last night when I first posted it. I'm still considering it. :)

[viscousmemories]

He's definitely a confusing person. I seem to recall him jumping in my shit on the Pope poll thread in ~e~ for daring to suggest that it was tasteless, but then yesterday I noticed that he had started a thread on April 5th lauding the Pope for his good works. Not that those two actions are necessarily mutually exclusive, but it just seems odd to me that someone with such hostility toward Christians in general would start a thread praising the Pope. :shrug:

[Gurdur]

Do I look worried ? Not totally, yes ?
I'm well-aware this is a public board, and well-aware that mountain_hare (or anyone else) could easily see my comments; I'm prepared to expand on them.
:yup:
Bugger "defending" my POV, Yeeee-haaaw ! It's time to loose my Scythian horse-archers upon the world !
:yup:

[livius drusus]

Breaking news: he's been banned (http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?p=2334097#post2334097).

[Gurdur]

Tsk. tsk ? tsk.
Talk about him being ineffectual.

[HelenM]

I can't speak for any particular admin, but I would say that once the apology had been made and accepted, there wasn't a clear reason to keep it open anymore anyway.

There's just as much reason to keep it open as there is reason to keep open any thread. The default should be threads are open, imo. Just on principle, you need a clear reason to lock them, I think, not to keep them open.

I agree with you regarding discussion threads, which are implicitly invitations to anyone to comment at any length.

This wasn't really a discussion; it was simply a public apology. I think a case could be made for not leaving certain forms of public statements open indefinitely. One could argue perhaps that nothing should be posted on a discussion board unless the poster is prepared to have it dissected, discussed and debated at length. But in practice on IIDB there has been differentiation between 'types of threads' as long as I can remember, with some forums limiting any debate on them in any type of thread, with limited posting rights for users in P&C, and with statements from staff generally being locked so that no user can respond or comment on the statement in the thread itself.

Helen

[MooseIBe]

LOL I would be more than happy to expand on my feelings about MH here if he showed up :D. Though I wouldn't want to turn the thread into a free for all brawl, of course *is picture of moosely innocence*

[Gurdur]

LOL I would be more than happy to expand on my feelings about MH here if he showed up :D
Just wait your turn in the queue.
I have some business to conclude with mountain_hare if he ever turns up; I don't like his choice of target in that thread, and I have some things to say to him about his remarks to certain people.
Though I wouldn't want to turn the thread into a free for all brawl,
Then let it be free for me.
I've been far too pacific anyway lately.

Besides which, The Jam beat Kumbaya hollow.
And BTW, they were never really punk, just Brit working-class.

[MooseIBe]

oh yeah? Wanna fight for the right to have first go at him? :D

Seems to me like his targets were indiscriminate today ... he's been rude to absolutely everyone, sort of like a direct 'ban me' challenge to the admins. I wonder if he even realises how pathetic THAT is in someone who claims to dislike extremism.

[Gurdur]

oh yeah? Wanna fight for the right to have first go at him?
You really don't want to do this. No, no, sirree. Reflect, and go in peace.
I'm first up in the queue.

[MooseIBe]

/me starts singing 'Jesus wants me for a sunbeam' in loud and slightly off key voice

[Skep]

Breaking news: he's been banned (http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?p=2334097#post2334097).
LOL (http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?p=2238446#post2238446)

[Gurdur]

* MooseIBe starts singing 'Jesus wants me for a sunbeam' in loud and slightly off key voice

* Gurdur simply gently but firmly places one hand over her mouth and guides her to a seat in the corner of the pub, sits her, gives her a beer and wanders off to allow her to recover her (quiet) serenity in peace. *

(and in case you wonder, yes, I actually have done this wiith someone else before --- only one week ago in the pub with an aggravating person)

[MooseIBe]

Hey I will be quiet for free beer :D. Once it's run out though I start singing agaiN!

[livius drusus]

This wasn't really a discussion; it was simply a public apology. I think a case could be made for not leaving certain forms of public statements open indefinitely. One could argue perhaps that nothing should be posted on a discussion board unless the poster is prepared to have it dissected, discussed and debated at length. But in practice on IIDB there has been differentiation between 'types of threads' as long as I can remember, with some forums limiting any debate on them in any type of thread, with limited posting rights for users in P&C, and with statements from staff generally being locked so that no user can respond or comment on the statement in the thread itself.

That's a fair point, Helen. You're right that a public apology is a different animal from a standard discussion thread and that IIDB has a long history of treating threads differently based on assessment of their intent and optimal direction.

The problem is I don't see what kind of practice could be put in place which wouldn't strike me as a harsh treatement of an apology. Locking it once the person to whom its directed has posted even though no rules have been broken and it's a thoroughly positive interaction seems wrong. What if the apology isn't accepted? Surely the recipient should have the option of turning a nice apology thread into an extension of the original conflict, as long as she follows the rules. What about fake apologies?

There are enough variables to make paragraphs of apology-handling procedures, which is why I would still tend to stick to the keep open unless extant rules are broken principle.

LOL

I had forgotten that! I wish I could remember his reasons for leaving a month ago. :chuckle:

[viscousmemories]

This thread would be far less entertaining if it had to link to an edited post.
Sorry, liv. Looks like Mediancat has edited out the insults directed toward you.

[livius drusus]

Oh poopsie. Thank Gates for Wordpad, huh? :beaugest:


For calling posters in this thread names

You mean like this...

if atheists can act like infants with a poopie diaper,

Implying that I am acting like an infant. Wow, this appears to be a case of the pot calling the kettle black.


For treating people with vicious discourtesy simply because they have the temerity to disagree with your approach.

You disagree with my approach, and are running me down. POT, KETTLE, BOTH BLACK.

The rest of your short post is basically disguised ad hominem. I'd just like to say that all the sophisticated, elegant phraselogy in the world doesn't disguise the fact that you're being an insulting, hypocritical asshole. At least I'm honest enough to say it up front, whereas you try to twist the rules to suit your purposes.

Advice: 1. Grow a thicker skin.
2. Use 'no tears' baby shampoo.
3. Stop being such a spineless hypocrite.

Perhaps then I'll take you seriously.

[HelenM]

That's a fair point, Helen. You're right that a public apology is a different animal from a standard discussion thread and that IIDB has a long history of treating threads differently based on assessment of their intent and optimal direction.

The problem is I don't see what kind of practice could be put in place which wouldn't strike me as a harsh treatement of an apology. Locking it once the person to whom its directed has posted even though no rules have been broken and it's a thoroughly positive interaction seems wrong.

I see what you're saying; that may well imply to the apologizer that there was something wrong with the apology, which wouldn't necessarily be the case.

What if the apology isn't accepted? Surely the recipient should have the option of turning a nice apology thread into an extension of the original conflict, as long as she follows the rules.

I can't see IIDB favoring any form of continuance of personal conflict, including this one - I can't imagine a continuance that can comply with the spirit of their rules and moderating.

And in general I don't think that propagating a conflict to more threads, or re-opening it in a new thread, does much good in an online community, even if it's not breaking rules.

What about fake apologies?

:fuming:

I'd be happy to see a fake apology thread closed, speaking for myself.

There are enough variables to make paragraphs of apology-handling procedures, which is why I would still tend to stick to the keep open unless extant rules are broken principle.

I'm generally in favor of keeping threads open as long as they stay on topic. I don't see the point in threads 50 pages and more long where the recent posts have nothing to do with the OP.

Actually, if we take a step back, the necessity for an 'apology OP' thread was caused by the closure of the original thread. Ideally, the apology should have been able to go in the first thread, which is where it belonged (assuming it was being made publically and not privately).

Helen

[viscousmemories]

Actually, if we take a step back, the necessity for an 'apology OP' thread was caused by the closure of the original thread. Ideally, the apology should have been able to go in the first thread, which is where it belonged (assuming it was being made publically and not privately).
That makes sense to me. Merge an apology thread into the original thread. :yup:

I don't know if you were being facetious about locking fake apology threads, but I'd just as soon not leave it up to the staff to make determinations about users' intent.

[MooseIBe]

What IS a fake apology? I don't think I've ever seen one on ii ... how would you tell if someone's apology was real or not?

[viscousmemories]

What IS a fake apology? I don't think I've ever seen one on ii ... how would you tell if someone's apology was real or not?
See? Here's a mod who doesn't even know what one looks like! :P

[xouper]

HelenM: ... I don't see the point in threads 50 pages and more long where the recent posts have nothing to do with the OP.
OK, here's what I don't get. Please correct me if I misunderstand. Just because you don't see the point doesn't mean there isn't one. The name for that logical fallacy is argument from incredulity. Seems to me that if people keep posting in such a thread, they see some point in doing so. Who are you to judge? Obviously I just don't get some people's need to control what other people post by locking threads. But maybe that's just me. :)

[Corona688]

What IS a fake apology? I don't think I've ever seen one on ii ... how would you tell if someone's apology was real or not? Some people seem to think an apology is a license to do the same thing again, then apologize for it again, rinse, repeat. That is a fake apology imho. Don't know Odd well enough to say whether it's fake of course.

[MooseIBe]

OIC. I've never seen him apologise before but then I must say I didn't know him from a hole in the wall before so I am judging him entirely on his first post and then the apology .. and the latter more than wipes out the former, IMO. Of course, if a person were to do that repetitively then yeah, I can see how it would be fake.

[HelenM]

HelenM: ... I don't see the point in threads 50 pages and more long where the recent posts have nothing to do with the OP.
OK, here's what I don't get. Please correct me if I misunderstand. Just because you don't see the point doesn't mean there isn't one. The name for that logical fallacy is argument from incredulity. Seems to me that if people keep posting in such a thread, they see some point in doing so. Who are you to judge? Obviously I just don't get some people's need to control what other people post by locking threads. But maybe that's just me. :)

I'll try to clarify - my issue is that the thread has gotten waaaayyy off topic. By all means have the discussion that's happening 50 pages out, but please start a thread whose purpose is to have that discussion, rather than taking the original thread way away from what it was all about.

Maybe locking is not the ideal solution to prevent the huge off-topic thread. But I understand why mods might use it, nevertheless, to prevent a thread meandering on forever off-topic and 50, 100, or more pages long.

Helen

[xouper]

HelenM: I'll try to clarify - my issue is that the thread has gotten waaaayyy off topic.
I have on rare occasion tried to steer one of my own threads back on topic, but in general, massive thread drift doesn't bother me. To me, conversations naturally drift all over the place, sometimes in very interesting directions. I don't see that as a bad thing. Perhaps I'm the one who's wierd.

[Skep]

HelenM: I'll try to clarify - my issue is that the thread has gotten waaaayyy off topic.
I have on rare occasion tried to steer one of my own threads back on topic, but in general, massive thread drift doesn't bother me. To me, conversations naturally drift all over the place, sometimes in very interesting directions. I don't see that as a bad thing. Perhaps I'm the one who's wierd.
Then I'm wierd too. I agree completely. Real life conversations drift. Many of the most interesting dialogs I've read or participated in occurred in threads that had drifted off topic. But to each his own; the government and social structure at iidb just ain't my bag. :shrug:

[Dragar]

Since I'm just chiming in, I'll drag it back on topic:

WTF?

livius, in my assessment you're one of the most patient, considerate and thoughtful posters I've met on any message board.

Oh, and I'm also hoping that you are easily bribed by flattery. :)

[viscousmemories]

You fishin' for a Dragar smilie or what?

[Dragar]

You fishin' for a Dragar smilie or what?

:fishing:

What a wonderful suggestion!

(Kidding ;) )

[livius drusus]

Thank you kindly, Dragar. I'm flattered pink. I wish I could claim you were entirely correct, but I really, really can't. Still, you give me something to strive for, and I don't just mean the smiley I'm feverishly trying to put together for you. :hug:

[Crumb]

I thought he had one: :feynman:

[livius drusus]

Skep made that one, free of flattery charge. I've got to provide value or nobody will ever bribe me again.

[HelenM]

HelenM: I'll try to clarify - my issue is that the thread has gotten waaaayyy off topic.
I have on rare occasion tried to steer one of my own threads back on topic, but in general, massive thread drift doesn't bother me. To me, conversations naturally drift all over the place, sometimes in very interesting directions. I don't see that as a bad thing. Perhaps I'm the one who's wierd.

No, I don't think that makes you weird; I suppose now I think about it, I'm happy to have conversations drift too. I was thinking more of discussion/debate sorts of threads which do have a specific topic. If a chat thread wanders all over the place, I suppose I don't mind that. But it's frustrating to me to click on a discussion thread with a specific topic indicated in the title and OP, expecting to see posts related to the title and find no trace of that topic in recent memory.

And I take the point that I may have taken this thread off-topic in spite of my issues with doing so :p (Ok, ok, add me to the list of hypocrites :blush: )

Helen

[mountain_hare]

Wow, never have I seen any of my opponents prove my points with such finality, livius drusus.

Let's look at what I stated about you on thread which was edited by the bunch of pussies on IIDB, with some commentary:


I'd just like to say that all the sophisticated, elegant phraselogy in the world doesn't disguise the fact that you're being an

insulting,

Livius drusus starts a thread on a board which he administrates with the sole purpose of running me down. What a big man he is. No really, I bet creating this thread was high up on his list of 'challenges I have overcome', right up there with 'find my dick so that I can take a piss', and 'scratch my ass without my fingers slipping up there'.

So far, 1 out of 3 of the characteristics I described on the thread at IIDB has been displayed by livius.


hypocritical

Note that on the thread I posted this in, Livius drusus was acting the hero by giving me a generic lecture on how I was being insulting towards OtI and the other idiots who were patting OtI on the back. Yet here he is on this thread, insulting me. In otherwords, he's a hyprocrite. Strike Two, livius. Not looking good for you, is it now?


asshole ...
At least I'm honest enough to say it up front,

That's right, livius, when I had a problem with your verbal diarrhea, I told you to your face (even though I knew it would result in editing and banning). When you had a problem with mine, you decided to talk about it behind my back with your buddies on this forum (where you can't get edited), while you all have a mutual masturbation session. *NEWSFLASH* You've proven my point... you're a thin-skinned, hypocritical asshole.

IAmMoose:


LOL I would be more than happy to expand on my feelings about MH here if he showed up

Oh, now I'm worried. What are you going to do, create a poll about me?

[Dingfod]

:popcorn:
This should be interesting.

[justaman]

Livius drusus starts a thread on a board which he administrates with the sole purpose of running me down. What a big man he is. No really, I bet creating this thread was high up on his list of 'challenges I have overcome', right up there with 'find my dick so that I can take a piss', and 'scratch my ass without my fingers slipping up there'.
You're going to have a REAL hard time finding Liv's dick.

So far, 1 out of 3 of the characteristics I described on the thread at IIDB has been displayed by livius.
Shall we have a party?

Note that on the thread I posted this in, Livius drusus was acting the hero by giving me a generic lecture on how I was being insulting towards OtI and the other idiots who were patting OtI on the back. Yet here he is on this thread, insulting me. In otherwords, he's a hyprocrite. Strike Two, livius. Not looking good for you, is it now?
Why can't liv insult you here? There's rules about it over there. I know of no such rules here. If you'd like to insult said member over here feel free.

That's right, livius, when I had a problem with your verbal diarrhea, I told you to your face (even though I knew it would result in editing and banning). When you had a problem with mine, you decided to talk about it behind my back with your buddies on this forum (where you can't get edited), all having a mutual masturbation session. *NEWSFLASH* You've proven my point... you're a thin-skinned, hypocritical asshole.
And yet the skin appears yet to be pierced by your rather meagre arrows...what does this say?

Some questions:

a) Why are you here.
b) What do you hope to achieve.
c) What do you think of the following Emerson quote which features prominently on this board:
"Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted."

Liv (elloquently) stated you were behaving like a bit of a dick. Is this not the case? Or were you being a dick and you just don't like that being pointed out to you?

[xouper]

:whoa:


warrenly: :popcorn: This should be interesting.
Gimme some of that popcorn.


:popcorn:

Thanks.

[mountain_hare]

You're going to have a REAL hard time finding Liv's dick.

Even if I had an electron microscope, I'd still have a hard time finding it. What's your point?


Why can't liv insult you here?

Liv is free to insult me all he/she/it wants. What you fail to realize is that Liv is a hypocrite.


And yet the skin appears yet to be pierced by your rather meagre arrows...what does this say?

That's debatable. If Liv wasn't insulted, then why did he start this thread with the sole purpose of belittling me? Clue: He was pissed that he didn't get the last word in IIDB, so he runs off to a forum which he administrates, where he can run me down. Yep, sounds like he doesn't hold a grudge...


Liv (elloquently) stated you were behaving like a bit of a dick. Is this not the case?

No, and even if it was, he shouldn't act like a spineless hypocrite. Understand?

[justaman]

Even if I had an electron microscope, I'd still have a hard time finding it. What's your point?
Liv is a female you fucking genius. :)

Liv is free to insult me all he/she/it wants. What you fail to realize is that Liv is a hypocrite.
And what you fail to realise is waving your hands about in a desperate fashion and babbling to me and the others on this board doesn't come over as particularly convincing. It makes you look like a dick. Which was all Liv was saying in the first place.

So yeah, good job, we're all on your side.

]
That's debatable. If Liv wasn't insulted, then why did he start this thread with the sole purpose of belittling me? Clue: He was pissed that he didn't get the last word in IIDB, so he runs off to a forum which he administrates, where he can run me down. Yep, sounds like he doesn't hold a grudge...
She probably finds your tantrums amusing. I know I do :) I don't want you to leave. There aren't enough self-confessed assholes around here, I've always said.

No, and even if it was, he shouldn't act like a spineless hypocrite. Understand?
Why shouldn't she do whatever she pleases? Because it aches upon your tender sensibilities?

Get over yourself dude. No one here is going to believe your version of events when you don't even know whether she's male or female. We've had rather a lot more experience with her, and I can say quite adamently she's one of the nicest online personalities I've ever met. I'm sure you would agree if you didn't think it so virtuous to attack anyone who has the gall to say something negative about you.

You can attack me all you like, incidentally. I'm an asshole too, and I already dislike you.

:handshake:

[Petra]

mountain_hare, I don't know you at all, but you were being an utter cock in that particular thread. All that shit about fundies and how you would be just as fundie back. I mean, tell me, what does that crap accomplish? I'll give you a clue...nothing. No Thing. Zippo, zilch, nada.


But that aside, welcome to here: Think what you like and say what you think, and all that.



So... popcorn. ....can I have some wine instead? :gnoshing:

[Dingfod]

Yes, I've got a fine pinot noir here, would you care for a glass?

[mountain_hare]

Liv is a female you fucking genius.

It's not my fault she comes across as a man. I think she needs to take a double dose of her estrogen pills.


So yeah, good job, we're all on your side.

Now I'm worried. Having idiots like you on my side would make me a laughing stock.


I'm an asshole too, and I already dislike you.

Don't worry, the feeling is mutual. :) At least you're not a self-righteous hypocritical asshole like Liv.

[Dingfod]

There aren't enough self-confessed assholes around here, I've always said.No, only self-absorbed ones like me.

[justaman]

It's not my fault she comes across as a man.Fairly indicative of precisely the accuracy of your judgement of character, isn't it?

Now I'm worried. Having idiots like you on my side would make me a laughing stock.
Yes an entire board of people are all idiots because they think your opinion is stupid. I'm sure it's very comfortable for you to think that. Whatever you do do not consider the alternative...

Don't worry, the feeling is mutual. :)
Good.

But you didn't answer my question. If we are all idiots - as we apparently are - why are you here? What do you hope to convince us about? Clearly we are far too inferior to assimilate the message you hope to pass on. So what?

Do you feel validated imagining yourself as a martyr standing up against the hordes of ignorant detractors? It's quite a fantasy world you've got going there. :yup:

[Petra]

Yes, I've got a fine pinot noir here, would you care for a glass?

Oh, plea-ease! :thankee:

I've a fine organically-grown recently-stickily-harvested Waiheke-Island doob here. Would you care for a toke? :bonghit:



...maybe I will have some of that popcorn.

Cheers. :gnoshing:

[xouper]

mountain_hare: It's not my fault she comes across as a man. I think she needs to take a double dose of her estrogen pills.
That unoriginal retort gets a

1.6


:popcorn:

[Dingfod]

Yes, I've got a fine pinot noir here, would you care for a glass?I've a fine organically-grown recently-stickily-harvested Waiheke-Island doob here. Would you care for a toke? :bonghit: Yeppers.
/me inhales deeply through the bong.
That's... some... good... shit... there.
/me coughs slightly before exhaling
Whew! The room is spinning.

Want a refill on that wine?

[Petra]

Want a refill on that wine?

Yeppers. :yup:

:gnoshing:





:bonghit:

[Dingfod]

Ooops. I drank the rest of it. Sorry.

Got some Corona Extra in the fridge, want a Mexican beer?

[mountain_hare]

justaman:

Fairly indicative of precisely the accuracy of your judgement of character, isn't it?

No, it is rather indicative of Liv's true gender.


Yes an entire board of people are all idiots because they think your opinion is stupid.

You're not idiots for saying that my opinion is stupid. You're a bunch of idiots for patting the self-righteous Liv on the back when she acts like a hypocritical asshole...


But you didn't answer my question. If we are all idiots - as we apparently are - why are you here?

Why, Liv and her cohort were boasting about how they'd love to 'own' me if I happened to venture in here, so I decided to visit for my evening entertainment. So far, I haven't been in impressed. Just a bunch of wimps who couldn't tell their mouths from their anus. I had hoped for some more challenging competition, but what was I to expect from a bunch of pussies who applaud when a theist and atheist hold hands?


Do you feel validated imagining yourself as a martyr standing up against the hordes of ignorant detractors?

Do you feel orgasmic taking part in a thread designed to run me down? I doubt you would dare take me on one to one, considering what a little bitch you are.

xouper:


That unoriginal retort gets a

What is ironic here is that perhaps the most unoriginal comeback is labelling a perfectly valid insult 'unoriginal'.

What's the clicking noise? Oh, it's just xouper's two brain cells clicking together. What amazes me is that someone with your IQ can (just barely) manage to type a coherent sentence.

Honestly, why don't you try to respond when you have some better material? Perhaps then I wouldn't continue to pawn you and your little friends.

[MooseIBe]

It's not my fault she comes across as a man. I think she needs to take a double dose of her estrogen pills.

ROFL! That's the best you can do?

MH, if I were you, I'd quit whilst you're far behind. You made a total ass of yourself on that thread and deep down, you probably know it. You made anyone who had a vestige of respect for you lose it instantly and write you off as a childish, immature fundy jerk who uses too many words to say nothing at all.

Well come on, I am sure you can work in another crack about polls here! The thing you don't seem to realise, boy, is that you're the only one who finds em insulting.

[Petra]

Ooops. I drank the rest of it. Sorry.

Got some Corona Extra in the fridge, want a Mexican beer?


Hell, yes! Can I have a slice of lemon with mine?

[Dingfod]

justaman:

Fairly indicative of precisely the accuracy of your judgement of character, isn't it?

No, it is rather indicative of Liv's true gender.Great. Now comes the "post proof or retract" bit. It's deja vu all over again.

So far, I haven't been in impressed. Just a bunch of wimps who couldn't tell their mouths from their anus.Nice. Does your mother know you write stuff like that? Besides, its the middle of the fucking night here, asshole. Yes, that was hypocritical of me, but then, I've never claimed I wasn't. Also, not everyone is up 24 hours a day like me, give them a break.

I had hoped for some more challenging competition,Is everything supposed to be a contest? Are we on different sides? Who chose who gets to be on what team? Where was I when you guys went "One potato, two potato...?"

... but what was I to expect from a bunch of pussies who applaud when a theist and atheist hold hands?Better to be a tolerant pussy than being an intolerant asshole.

Ohhh, what's the clicking noise? Oh, it's just xouper's two brain cells clicking together.How novel. I've never heard that one before. Not.

Honestly, why don't you try to respond when you have some better material? Perhaps then I wouldn't continue to pawn you and your little friends.I sure hope you get more for pawning them than I did. Damn pawnbroker said they weren't worth much of anything.

[Dingfod]

Ooops. I drank the rest of it. Sorry.

Got some Corona Extra in the fridge, want a Mexican beer?


Hell, yes! Can I have a slice of lemon with mine?

/me rummages around in the fridge

I can't find a lemon, but I do have a lime. Is that okay?

[seebs]

Woot! (http://www.freethought-forum.com/forum/showpost.php?p=34120&postcount=36) Livius is insulting, I'm dishonest, and we're both hypocritical assholes! Hypocritical asshole twin powers... ACTIVATE!

[Dingfod]

/me suddenly realizes that wine and doob has turned him from a spectator into a participant

Oops.

[MooseIBe]

Better to be a tolerant pussy than being an intolerant asshole.

Actually, just to make a serious point here - not that I am not enjoying the trading of unoriginal insults or anything :D - the reason i was so disgusted by MH's responses on the ICR thread was because he was apparently unable to see that not all fundamentalists wear a cross. Now, I've seen some BAD behaviour from Xian fundies over the years, some of which makes me very angry. But I don't think I've ever seen anything like Hare produced ... ranting responses to the point that most of us thought that he must be mentally ill simply because someone disagreed with him. Hare is apparently totally unaware that he IS a fundamentalist, someone who expresses nothing but hate and bigotry towards anyone who disagrees with him. And that is really pretty sad. I can only hope that when he grows up a bit, or when this current mental crisis passes, he might be big enough to acknowledge that and retract his statements here and elsewhere... as OtheI was big enough to do. But I do not believe, from observing Hare's behaviour closely lately, that he yet has the strength of character to be able to do that. Maybe one day.

[Petra]

I can't find a lemon, but I do have a lime. Is that okay?

Bliss.


Cheers! :cheers2:

[mountain_hare]

But I do not believe, from observing Hare's behaviour closely lately, that he yet has the strength of character to be able to do that.

While we are on the subject of 'strength of character', haven't you been warned in the past for laughing when one poster insulted another? In fact, from memory, you were warned by the admins (so it must have been pretty serious, since they are pretty lax at disciplining their friends).

Also, are you having fun 'ranting' about posters behind their back in the Moderator's Conference forum? Don't pretend it doesn't happen, I was a moderator once, remember?

And remember when a certain moderator was under fire by the admins, and despite your (pretense) of friendship, you refused to put in a good word for him?

And then, better yet, you join a thread to insult a certain poster, behind his back. It's not enough that he is edited/banned, YOU must have the last word. Sounds like a symptom of fundamentalism.

Strength of character? If I need to build 'strength of character', I won't be taking a lesson from you. That's for sure.

[MooseIBe]

I really am not entirely sure what you're talking about, Hare .. though I am starting to become seriously embarrassed for you. For that reason I have made the decision to no longer address you, as I don't believe, at this moment, that you're capable of rational thought. PMs will not be opened and IMs, should you choose to send any, will not be addressed. Your behaviour towards people who have never done anything to you is really disgusting.

[mountain_hare]

will not be opened and IMs, should you choose to send any, will not be addressed.

Wow, aren't you self centred, assuming I would waste time sending PM's to you!

I assume I just made everything I stated in the previous post up, huh? You have never been warned for laughing when one poster insulted another. You have never insulted posters behind their back in the Moderator's Conference room? You have never posted in a thread to insult someone after they were edited/banned from another forum?

Don't respond. The fact that you do not openly deny the claims sure tells us a lot.

[Gurdur]

Livius drusus starts a thread on a board which he administrates with the sole purpose of running me down.
Bollocks. She invited you here for the sole reason of fairness and to let you have your say.
What a big man he is.
She's a woman. But then, whho the fuck are you again ? Not too big yourself, yes ? Note that on the thread I posted this in, Livius drusus was acting the hero by giving me a generic lecture on how I was being insulting towards OtI
You whine far too much. What are you going to do, throw your teddy bear at us ?(where you can't get edited),
Neither will you. You're all mouth and no balls or brain, but you won't get edited here.
Oh, now I'm worried. What are you going to do, create a poll about me?
No. Simply let you have your say, then .... reply to you.

[Gurdur]

assuming I would waste time sending PM's to you!
Since you sent Moose PM's, then this playacting of yours is bizarre and childish.

[MooseIBe]

Yes .. as is the assumption that it's somehow news that I was spoken to by the admins for conduct in one particular thread. As that was made public knowledge on the P and C thread, it is beyond me how Hare apparently thinks he's making some big dramatic revalation here. And, erm, what does it have to do with anything, in any case?

[Gurdur]

It's not my fault she comes across as a man. I think she needs to take a double dose of her estrogen pills.
Don't worry, you don't come across as a man yourself, but instead like a young teenager with a severe case of the hormonal sulks.
Why don't you try lecturing us again on the Fight Against Fundies ?
I would like the laugh.

[mountain_hare]

Bollocks. She invited you here for the sole reason of fairness and to let you have your say.

Bullshit. I wasn't invited here by Liv, and if it was indeed her, then it merely highlights her deception (she posed as someone apart from herself).

Letting me have my say? Oh yeah, the posters here didn't want to lay into me as soon as I put my foot in the door. Ummm

IamMoose said:

LOL I would be more than happy to expand on my feelings about MH here if he showed up


Gurdur said:

I'm well-aware this is a public board, and well-aware that mountain_hare (or anyone else) could easily see my comments; I'm prepared to expand on them.


These two comments display the nature of this thread. I was baited to come here so that you could all have a go at me. Satisified? I guess not, since I bite back.


You whine far too much. What are you going to do, throw your teddy bear at us ?

I'm not the one who started a thread in my own forum, with my own cheerleaders, to bitch about a poster from an entirely separate forum. Another example of hypocrisy from an asshole. Go home, you're severely outgunned...


Neither will you. You're all mouth

Hey dipshit, my mouth isn't involved when typing messages on a forum.


Why don't you try lecturing us again on the Fight Against Fundies ?
I would like the laugh.

Nahh, it's a little too sophisticated for you. Perhaps when you're older.

[mountain_hare]

Yes .. as is the assumption that it's somehow news that I was spoken to by the admins for conduct in one particular thread. As that was made public knowledge on the P and C thread, it is beyond me how Hare apparently thinks he's making some big dramatic revalation here. And, erm, what does it have to do with anything, in any case?

You were giving me a lecture about my 'poor character', so I felt it was necessary to point out that you aren't the angel that you pretend to be. You giving me a lecture on how to act is real rich.

[HelenM]

mountain_hare, I apologize for my participation in insulting you here. :(

Helen

[Gurdur]

Bullshit. I wasn't invited here by Liv,
She was planning to, and it all amounts to the same, kid.
Letting me have my say? Oh yeah, the posters here didn't want to lay into me as soon as I put my foot in the door. Ummm
Oh, you poor, poor diddums, kid ! :stunned:
Oh you poor, poor little thing !
You go off your head ranting about people in your sulky little way, and then you're ever so ........ discombulated when they reply !
Yes, yes, we know you think the world owes you a living, and you should be free to rant without the terrible distress of people replying to you, but hey, kid, even you will have to grow up one day.´
:yup:
These two comments display the nature of this thread. I was baited to come here so that you could all have a go at me. Satisified? I guess not, since I bite back.
OOoooooooo, you poor diddums, and you get ever so upset when other people bite back.
Tsk, tsk, and tsk !

. Go home, you're severely outgunned...
Come on now, kids like you are ten a penny. We two haven't even started yet.
:yup:

Hey dipshit, my mouth isn't involved when typing messages on a forum.
Since neither your brain nor balls are either, being nonexistent, that only leaves us with the question of just what is involved from your side.
:yup:

Nahh, it's a little too sophisticated for you. Perhaps when you're older.
Oh, come on now, kid, hit me with your brilliance. Educate me, since you say you out-gun me.
:yup:

[mountain_hare]

She was planning to, and it all amounts to the same, kid.

And I'm planning to donate a million dollars to charity.

She can say whatever she likes. The fact that she did NOT invite me here tells me a hell of a lot.


[snips irrelevant bullshit]
You go off your head ranting about people in your sulky little way, and then you're ever so ........ discombulated when they reply !

*sighs*
Please take the time to actually read what I post (or perhaps you did, but your reading comprehension isn't up to par). I could care less whether Liv and her goon squad are insulting me. What sticks in my craw is her HYPOCRISY. She lectures me for being insulting (while being insulting in that very lecture), and then posts a thread in this forum with the sole purpose of insulting me.

Once again, I could care less about your juvenile insults. I've been called far worse in my lifetime, by people a hell of a lot wittier than you. You're child's play. But don't go belittling me for being insulting, and then do exactly the same.


Since neither your brain nor balls are either, being nonexistent, that only leaves us with the question of just what is involved from your side.

Wow, you weren't complaining about my balls last night. :(


I see that HelenM has apologized (there was no need to, she isn't really the 'main' culprit). I think she has suddenly realized that by insulting me, you are merely sinking to my level, and thus supporting my argument that you are all a bunch of hypocrites. At least someone has caught the clue train. :yup:

[Gurdur]

*sighs*
Please take the time to actually read what I post
Oh, I do, it amuses me. :yup:
Liv and her goon squad
You're so melodramatic, kid.
What next, you gonna claim the Black Helicopters are after you too ?
are insulting me.
Naaaaaw, I'm the only one here apart from you going for the deliberate insult, kid.
Wassamatta, son ? You can give it but you can't take it ?
What sticks in my craw is her HYPOCRISY.
You must have a hard time with yourself then.
Once again, I could care less about your juvenile insults.
Yes, yes, you poor little baby, that's why you've come onto this board and you stamp your little booties at everyone.
Wow, you weren't complaining about my balls last night. :(
Because they were nonexistent. I should complain about nonexistent things, kid ?
Come on now, surely even you can do better. :wave:
by insulting me, you are merely sinking to my level,
I never claimed otherwise, but I love the way you whine when I sink to your level.
:D

[mountain_hare]

Because they were nonexistent

That's because you bite off more than you can chew.


I never claimed otherwise, but I love the way you whine when I sink to your level.

Premise 1: Gurdur claims that I am an asshole for being insulting.
Premise 2: Gurdur then admits that he is sinking to my level by insulting me.
Conclusion: Hence, Gurdur is a hypocrite.

Try refuting that logic. ;)

Time to take your dolly and go home, little girl. :D

[Gurdur]

That's because you bite off more than you can chew.
You poor little diddums, you just have to keep on praising yourself because no-one else will. Tsk³.
Premise 1: Gurdur claims that I am an asshole for being insulting.
Premise 2: Gurdur then admits that he is sinking to my level by insulting me.
Conclusion: Hence, Gurdur is a hypocrite.

Try refuting that logic. ;)

Time to take your dolly and go home, little girl. :D
Wrong again, kid.

1) Gurdur says you are simply wrong, for the reasons given previously in thread, plus you're a pathetic drama-queen.
2) Gurdur doesn't mind fighting fire with fire sometimes.
_______

Conclusion: Gurdur can be a real asshole sometimes, but he's no hypocrite, and he can't stand drama-queening kids with a fit of the sulks.

And I would never take your dolly, kid; you cling to that sense of resentment ever so badly.

[livius drusus]

Let's start with some up front apologies. I apologize for not alterting you that I would be starting this thread, mountain_hare. I was lazy, frankly, and figured I could invite you any time. I didn't actually realize your blow-up would get you banned quite so promptly. Besides, the memberships of FF and IIDB overlap a great deal so we all pretty much know that the grapevine will get the news out. I know, I know... Lazy.

I also apologize for throwing in that dig at you under the guise of a general comment. Your bizarre "Why exactly?" reply to my post about how out of line you were seemed disingenuous and even more petulant than the rest of your posts on that thread, so I got snarky. The right thing would have been to ignore that aspect and make my point clear. I just knew you already understood my point, is all, what with you being a former moderator and all, so I wasn't inclined to restate it plainly when you were being such a cock about it.

I do not apologize for starting this thread. My intent wasn't even remotely to insult you or get my, erm, goon squad (which I suppose is the entire membership?) to attack you. You calling me names was just funny as hell, and given IIDB moderation, I thought this was a unique chance to share the amusement of a crackling flame before the admins shitcanned it.

I remember you were a PD mod and then you were self-banned. I remember you came back almost immediately. I didn't realize until recently that you were one of the rabid anti-theists, which is weird, really, if you actually live in Australia. I don't recall encountering any Aussies with that particular baggage. Other than that, I don't know you from Adam.

I don't know what possessed you to call people names like that. Setting aside entirely what you said to me, what operating principle drove you to call OTI a pussy and Ty Sixtus an asshole? Is it that thing about fundamentalists being retarded toddlers? Is that the principle? Because if so that makes even less sense to me than anything else you've done.

Not that making sense to me is anything you need concern yourself with. You can continue to flame or whatever to your heart's content here.

Meanwhile, I remind everyone that if you click on "Ignore this post", all the replies to it will be put on ignore as well so anyone who wants to avoid this segment of the discussion can do so by ignoring mountain_hare's first post. Moosie, if you click on his name you'll see an option to disallow contact. That way you can block him from using the board private contacting features (PM and email) without ignoring his posts, although right now he doesn't seem inclined to contact you at all.

Welcome to FF, mountain_hare. Even if you didn't think ill of me, I doubt you'd enjoy it here much. We hold hands with theists on occasion, you see, and thanks to Roland, we don't use antibacterial soap. If you got over that hangup though, you'd probably have a good time.

Oh, that reminds me. Hey seebs, hose down your Wondertwin ring sometime, would you? It gets gross after a while.

[HelenM]

I see that HelenM has apologized (there was no need to, she isn't really the 'main' culprit). I think she has suddenly realized that by insulting me, you are merely sinking to my level, and thus supporting my argument that you are all a bunch of hypocrites.

I won't speak for anyone else; I know I am! :mirror:

At least someone has caught the clue train. :yup:

Does it stop in fundyland? :eyebrow: :cool:

Helen

[Sweetie]

Livius is insulting, I'm dishonest, and we're both hypocritical assholes! Hypocritical asshole twin powers... ACTIVATE!

:melo:

I want to be something too!

Always a bridesmade, never a bride. :sadcheer:

:P

[beyelzu]

Even if I had an electron microscope, I'd still have a hard time finding it. What's your point?
Liv is a female you fucking genius. :)

Liv is free to insult me all he/she/it wants. What you fail to realize is that Liv is a hypocrite.
And what you fail to realise is waving your hands about in a desperate fashion and babbling to me and the others on this board doesn't come over as particularly convincing. It makes you look like a dick. Which was all Liv was saying in the first place.

So yeah, good job, we're all on your side.

]
That's debatable. If Liv wasn't insulted, then why did he start this thread with the sole purpose of belittling me? Clue: He was pissed that he didn't get the last word in IIDB, so he runs off to a forum which he administrates, where he can run me down. Yep, sounds like he doesn't hold a grudge...
She probably finds your tantrums amusing. I know I do :) I don't want you to leave. There aren't enough self-confessed assholes around here, I've always said.

No, and even if it was, he shouldn't act like a spineless hypocrite. Understand?
Why shouldn't she do whatever she pleases? Because it aches upon your tender sensibilities?

Get over yourself dude. No one here is going to believe your version of events when you don't even know whether she's male or female. We've had rather a lot more experience with her, and I can say quite adamently she's one of the nicest online personalities I've ever met. I'm sure you would agree if you didn't think it so virtuous to attack anyone who has the gall to say something negative about you.

You can attack me all you like, incidentally. I'm an asshole too, and I already dislike you.

:handshake:


:glomp:

I am giving you a manly glomp.

badass post, from one self confessed asshole to another.

of course, I am more of a dick than an asshole.

:tmgrin:

[beyelzu]

fucking flamefest baby.

I have been looking for a dipshit to really unload on, it has been many moons since I was able to fuck with someone righteously, without remorse.

Ill be your fucking huckleberry, hill bunny.


on the other hand, there is a long queue, do I have the patience.

[MooseIBe]

you wanna put that cigarette out before you fuck anybody with that thing :D

[Dragar]

We've had rather a lot more experience with her, and I can say quite adamently she's one of the nicest online personalities I've ever met.

Geez, now everyone's trying to bribe liv with flattery...

Funny post, dude. :)

[godfry n. glad]

:popcorn:

Well... That was fun. Can we do it some more?

I mean, after all, bub just got here.

[livius drusus]

Geez, now everyone's trying to bribe liv with flattery...

I know, really! I've been searching for an Abba smiley all morning.

Speaking of, did you see the :atom: I uploaded for you yesterday, Dragar? It's a little fancier than :hydrogen: and I thought you might dig the orbital action. :)

[viscousmemories]

People, do I have to say "I told you so?" I'm more surprised by how long it took for someone to run to tell him than the fact that it happened. Either way I'm glad it did.

:welcome: to the FF, mountain_hare.

I know it's not exactly the red carpet treatment, but who knows, you might actually come to enjoy it here if you stick around.

[Dragar]

I know, really! I've been searching for an Abba smiley all morning.

Justamn is such a dancing queen. :yup:

Speaking of, did you see the :atom: I uploaded for you yesterday, Dragar? It's a little fancier than :hydrogen: and I thought you might dig the orbital action. :)

I love orbital action. :D

I really should put the next part of that quantum thread together though, or you'll all keep thinking this really is what an atom is like! :atom:

:feynman:

He's still my favourite. :)

[Dragar]

Oh, yes, and er...hi to mountain_hare!

Please don't insult liv any more, okay? :) (You can keep arguing with justaman though, his insults are funny. :) )

[seebs]

Livius is insulting, I'm dishonest, and we're both hypocritical assholes! Hypocritical asshole twin powers... ACTIVATE!

:melo:

I want to be something too!

Always a bridesmade, never a bride. :sadcheer:

:P

Oh, that's easy. You're a sanctimonious, hypocritical, asshole. And we all love you very much. :P

[godfry n. glad]

Livius is insulting, I'm dishonest, and we're both hypocritical assholes! Hypocritical asshole twin powers... ACTIVATE!

:melo:

I want to be something too!

Always a bridesmade, never a bride. :sadcheer:

:P

Oh, that's easy. You're a sanctimonious, hypocritical, asshole. And we all love you very much. :P

Hey!

Sanctimonious is MINE!

LadyShea told me so!

[seebs]

Hey!

Sanctimonious is MINE!

LadyShea told me so!

And you believed her? That makes you a credulous, dishonest, asshole. :P

[viscousmemories]

Sorry posers, the real sanctimonious prick (http://www.freethought-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=760) is here now.

[godfry n. glad]

Hey!

Sanctimonious is MINE!

LadyShea told me so!

And you believed her? That makes you a credulous, dishonest, asshole. :P



Credulous, huh?

Well... If you say so.

[seebs]

Sorry posers, the real sanctimonious prick (http://www.freethought-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=760) is here now.

Oh, that's fine. You and Sweetie can be united in holy sanctimony, and Sweetie and Liv can be united in being hypocritical assholes. See? There's enough adjectives and nouns for EVERYONE!

I wonder what it would take to impose adjective/noun sets as legal names for everyone everywhere.

[viscousmemories]

Oh, that's fine. You and Sweetie can be united in holy sanctimony, and Sweetie and Liv can be united in being hypocritical assholes. See? There's enough adjectives and nouns for EVERYONE!

I wonder what it would take to impose adjective/noun sets as legal names for everyone everywhere.
Does this mean you're not gonna hold my hand anymore? :sadnana:

[Skep]

Sorry posers, the real sanctimonious prick (http://www.freethought-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=760) is here now.
You're not a sanctimonious prick, you're a holier-than-thou one trick pony who also happens to be a self-righteous prick. :wave:

Oh, and you're mean.

[viscousmemories]

Ouch. It's like you're inside my very head! :shudder:

[Sweetie]

You and Sweetie can be united in holy sanctimony, and Sweetie and Liv can be united in being hypocritical assholes.

:cheer:

[livius drusus]

I do not apologize for starting this thread. My intent wasn't even remotely to insult you or get my, erm, goon squad (which I suppose is the entire membership?) to attack you. You calling me names was just funny as hell, and given IIDB moderation, I thought this was a unique chance to share the amusement of a crackling flame before the admins shitcanned it.

I've said this in another thread, but I thought I should post it here in case mountain_hare isn't in a browsing mood.

Although it's true that my intent was not to savage you but to share what I thought was an amusingly incongruous insult, it's also true that as admin I should have been more careful to ensure you would receive fair treatment -- not to mention a genuine welcome -- if and when you registered.

I therefore now recant my non-apology and apologize for starting this thread in such a careless manner. Ideally, I should have invited you over to duke it out, or even, dare I hope, talk it out. Man to man, as it were. ;)

[Skep]

You're a classy broad, liv. :cool:

[justaman]

No, it is rather indicative of Liv's true gender.
Do you enjoy sounding trivial? :D


You're not idiots for saying that my opinion is stupid. You're a bunch of idiots for patting the self-righteous Liv on the back when she acts like a hypocritical asshole...
Ok I'm going to assume for just a moment that you have an ounce of sense. Perhaps that's a stupid assumption to make, I'm not sure, but I'll try it anyway.

We've all seen the thread. Jesus what do you think Liv linked us to in the OP? We've seen both sides of your story. We've seen your initial brain-explosion when you decided to attack any and all atheists who talk in any kind of civil manner to Christians. We've seen Liv's reaction.

There is no way she was behaving like 'a hypocritical asshole'. The fact that you suggest this - apparently in all seriousness - quite simply makes you look stupid.

FYI the 'asshole' is currently trying to convince everyone to be nice to you and give you a chance. You are the single worst judge of character I think I've ever met.

]
Why, Liv and her cohort were boasting about how they'd love to 'own' me if I happened to venture in here, so I decided to visit for my evening entertainment. So far, I haven't been in impressed. Just a bunch of wimps who couldn't tell their mouths from their anus. I had hoped for some more challenging competition, but what was I to expect from a bunch of pussies who applaud when a theist and atheist hold hands?
So you do enjoy sounding trivial? :laugh:

Do you feel orgasmic taking part in a thread designed to run me down? I doubt you would dare take me on one to one, considering what a little bitc you are.
Would you prefer to continue this via PM? I'll message you directly.

[justaman]

I know, really! I've been searching for an Abba smiley all morning.

Justamn is such a dancing queen. :yup:


Yeah that'd be real funny you pair of hypcritical asshole hill bunnies. :fuming:

[livius drusus]

:giggle: Hey, at least I was going to go for Bjorn instead of Agnetha.

[mountain_hare]

I do not apologize for starting this thread.

That's OK Liv, I apologize as well...




















Hahahah, just kidding, tool! You can stick your apology up your rotund ass. While I acknowledge your right to attempt to make an insincere apology, you must accept my right to not accept it. I'll believe your not bullshitting when you actually follow through.

[viscousmemories]

Jesus, are you like 12?

[Skep]

Yeah, like 12 asshats.

:asshat: :asshat: :asshat: :asshat: :asshat: :asshat:

:asshat: :asshat: :asshat: :asshat: :asshat: :asshat:

[livius drusus]

Follow through how, exactly?

[justaman]

Hahahah, just kidding, tool! You can stick your apology up your rotund ass. While I acknowledge your right to attempt to make an insincere apology, you must accept my right to not accept it. I'll believe your not bullshitting when you actually follow through.
Are you going to answer my PM you little weasel? Or was all the "one-on-one" bravado as much fluff as the rest of what you have to contribute?

You're a pathetic individual.

[Sweetie]

Hahahah, just kidding, tool! You can stick your apology up your rotund ass. While I acknowledge your right to attempt to make an insincere apology, you must accept my right to not accept it. I'll believe your not bullshitting when you actually follow through.

You can see that this and anything after this is all a bit silly, yes? Snot stew and all that?

is not
is too
is not
is too
snot
stoo
snot
stoo

:D

[Sweetie]

So, where ya from mountain_hare?

[Crumb]

I'll believe your not bullshitting when you actually follow through.

Follow through means do what?

[mountain_hare]

Follow through means do what?

When someone apologizes for acting like an asshole, you expect them to follow through and stop acting like an asshole. Apologizing means jack shit in my book...

[livius drusus]

What does not acting like an asshole mean in your book?

[Sauron]

Can anyone play at this game? Or is it by-invitation only?

[Crumb]

When someone apologizes for acting like an asshole, you expect them to follow through and stop acting like an asshole. Apologizing means jack shit in my book...

One would imagine you would at least tentatively accept their apology before you assume that they will not improve their behavior. If you really wanted to resolve things, that is.

[mountain_hare]

justawoman:


Are you going to answer my PM you little weasel? Or was all the "one-on-one" bravado as much fluff as the rest of what you have to contribute?

Oh yeah, I'm too chicken to converse with you on PM, despite willingly coming onto this board and taking the flak of Liv and her buddies. Yeah, there's a dose of logic for you.


You're a pathetic individual

ROFL. You dare me to respond to your PM, huh? Do ya double dare meh, huh, huh?
Have fun conversing with people you term 'pathetic individuals' (aka. anyone whose viewpoint differs from yours). While you may converse with pathetic individuals in private, I definitely do not. Hence, do not expect a response to your PM.

While you may take the posts on this message board seriously, I regard them as a source of humour. A bunch of pussies who can't stand it when their buddy is shown up on another forum, hence they run around bitching.

Don't like my attitude? Stiff shit, I'm not going to change to please a bunch of morons. You can't please everyone.

Sauron:

Can anyone play at this game? Or is it by-invitation only?

If you want. It's quite fun, but you get tired of the same lame old comebacks spouted at you by 30 year old, bald, impotent computer geeks.

[viscousmemories]

Well maybe not quite 12, but I'm definitely guessing anyone who uses "30 year old" as an insult hasn't made it to 16 yet. That actually explains a lot.

[Skep]

Yikes! I just realized that I like latinijral more than I like this guy. :shudder:

[livius drusus]

Oh no! Poor Skep. Let me hold you. :badday:

[Sweetie]

Who wants to diffuse something like this when in reality, conflict is like the spice of life, the main motivating factor? :D

Seriously though, either one has to define asshole and then we have to test livius' responses to see if it fits or skip this entire line of thought because it's useless:

liv is acting like an asshole
is not
is too
is not
is too

Well, snot stoo and what good is that, hmmm, hmmm? :P

[Skep]

Give me a sponge bath, liv. I feel so dirty.

[justaman]

Oh yeah, I'm too chicken to converse with you on PM, despite willingly coming onto this board and taking the flak of Liv and her buddies. Yeah, there's a dose of logic for you.
Quite, considering how much 'flak' Liv has been dishing out here. So far it appears to have consisted of an apology.

You're so brave!
ROFL. You dare me to respond to your PM, huh? Do ya double dare meh, huh, huh?
Who started the PM game, genius? Did I dare you to discuss this 1-on-1? Or did you dare me to discuss this 1-on-1? Fuck you're dumb. :D

Have fun conversing with people you term 'pathetic individuals' (aka. anyone whose viewpoint differs from yours).
No people who disagree with me are hypocritical assholes. All of them.

While you may take the posts on this message board seriously, I regard them as a source of humour. A bunch of pussies who can't stand it when their buddy is shown up on another forum, hence they run around bitching.

Don't like my attitude? Stiff shit, I'm not going to change to please a bunch of morons. You can't please everyone.
It's so cute how you try to make yourself look tough. :P

[livius drusus]

Give me a sponge bath, liv. I feel so dirty.
:bath::nurse:

[Skep]

Ahhhh.... :bliss:

[Sweetie]

:bath::nurse:

:voyeur:

Bad mountain_hare! :P

[Sauron]

Let me say this one thing in mountain hare's defense: I understand his point, regardless of how it was delivered. Speaking as an ex-fundie, I can say that the "gentle persuasion" method did not work for me. I needed to have the blast of cold water from the firehouse shot right at my face, to shock me into realizing that the beliefs I had were wrong. Easy coaxing was just a sign of uncertainty in the 'enemy', so I did not respond to it.

If you've never been there, then it may be hard to understand. But ships built out of faith don't founder on gentle shoals; a boat that springs little leaks can be patched - or the leaks can be ignored. No, such ships founder on great huge rocky reefs. I don't know if that works for everyone. It worked for me; it might work for others.

I also know one other thing. Moderators at IIDB will castigate members for using ad hominems, and yet break that same rule - either in forum, or out of it. There is some hypocrisy there. That's one of the reasons that a moderated forum is so dangerous, if it isn't carefully balanced against such abuse. And thats one of the reasons that I like the way that livius has set up FF. The only guidelines for behavior are those we place upon ourselves - and generally speaking, the quality of behavior here is higher than in a moderated forum.

Funny how that works out. :tiphat2:

[Sweetie]

the quality of behavior here is higher than in a moderated forum.

Funny how that works out. :tiphat2:

You must admit though, the smilies are quite disarming. :D

[Sauron]

Smilies are like candy for the mind.....hard to concentrate on anything else.....must have smilies.......... :dancin:

[viscousmemories]

And thats one of the reasons that I like the way that livius has set up FF.
I actually helped her a little bit.

[Sauron]

And thats one of the reasons that I like the way that livius has set up FF.
I actually helped her a little bit.

Yes, sorry. Omission was my oversight. The Great Eye is tired. :)

You both deserve due recognition.
:oscarwin:

[mountain_hare]

Well said, Sauron.

To be honest, I'm pleased with the way this forum (appears) to be run. Flame fests are allowed, as are personal insults.

The moderation policy on boards such as IIDB is condescending in itself. It basically treats posters like little kids. If they aren't getting along, if they get a bit snippy, the posters aren't allowed to sort it out between themselves. The 'big daddy' mod/admin steps in like some sort of psuedo-god, and censors to their hearts desire. What arbitrary, magical measuring stick they use to decide what is 'offensive' is unknown to me.

You can't claim to promote freedom of speech while censoring it. And you can't use the lame excuse 'I promote free speech, but you are using it in a way I don't like'.

[livius drusus]

I actually helped her a little bit.

An entirely collaborative project, in fact, and not just in the sense that we'd be using notepads and carrier pigeons if it were just me, but in terms of policy, structure and anything else you can think of too. Just for the record.

Edit: Jeez I'm slow. Bedtime.

[justaman]

Sauron, are you telling me that you changed faith because someone insulted you? Or did they have a really strong argument?

This guy is not brandishing the latter from what I've seen.

[viscousmemories]

Yes, sorry. Omission was my oversight. The Great Eye is tired. :)

You both deserve due recognition.
:oscarwin:
Thanks. :)

I hate to beg for recognition, but I'm obviously not above it.

[Sauron]

Well, I think it's important to recognize what we have here: a community that is, by and large, self-policing. Moderators are free to participate, to comment, or to sit back and eat popcorn. Members are free to be contributors, or pricks - as long as they are prepared to deal with the consequences of either decision.

Everyone here puts themself under a higher burden of responsiblity that a moderated forum would. The net result is a level of courtesy similar to a professional colloquium. I just think it's cool that this is precisely what the internet was intended to be.

It might be like pure communism - workable on a small scale but prone to abuses on larger scales. I don't know. But for the time being, this is a special place.

[justaman]

I hate to beg for recognition, but I'm obviously not above it.
Yeah I don't get that. I always assumed you did more of the work, simply because Liv is a chick and all. :shrug:

[Sauron]

Sauron, are you telling me that you changed faith because someone insulted you? Or did they have a really strong argument?

This guy is not brandishing the latter from what I've seen.

No, not because of an insult. But also not entirely because of the argument. It was a combination of really pointed and blunt arguments, delivered in the same volume and intensity that I was defending myself with.

Volume and tenacity do make a difference, especially in someone who uses those same tactics to defend themselves. The opponent didn't "wither" - if that makes any sense.

[Sauron]

I hate to beg for recognition, but I'm obviously not above it.
Yeah I don't get that. I always assumed you did more of the work, simply because Liv is a chick and all. :shrug:

Crap.

Liv is a chick?

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

:D :P

[viscousmemories]

From what I saw of that other thread it didn't seem to be a question of forceful vs. gentle persuasion, but respectful vs. you'reabraindeadfuckingmoron "persuasion". I don't know about you but I've never been persuaded by someone calling me a braindeadfuckingmoron.

[Sweetie]

Crap.

Liv is a chick?

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

:D :P

Or so they'd have us believe. *suspicious*

Nah, just kidding, I believe it but I wouldn't mind seeing the visage of the infamous livius drusus, just thought I'd sneak that in while I could. :P

[justaman]

No, not because of an insult. But also not entirely because of the argument. It was a combination of really pointed and blunt arguments, delivered in the same volume and intensity that I was defending myself with.

Volume and tenacity do make a difference, especially in someone who uses those same tactics to defend themselves. The opponent didn't "wither" - if that makes any sense.
I don't think I've ever seen a convincing rant. I don't mind a healthy flaming for fun's sake, but I've never seen a point driven home effectively by one.

I remember the one time I've been absolutely slaughtered was when I was a kid and was fuck fuck fucking ever second sentence and the other guy just leaned back and elloquently decimated me, my argument and my entire livelihood with a few carefully chosen words :P Much more effective.

[Sweetie]

"Words as weapons
sharper than knives"

INXS - "Devil Inside"

The careful selection of le rapier, lol.

[Sauron]

From what I saw of that other thread it didn't seem to be a question of forceful vs. gentle persuasion, but respectful vs. you'reabraindeadfuckingmoron "persuasion". I don't know about you but I've never been persuaded by someone calling me a braindeadfuckingmoron.

Two comments:

[1]
Braindeadfuckingmoron is in the eyes of the beholder. If I started out by saying that you were deliberately decieved by your own sinful lust and desires, and it was your fault that you were going to hell and taking your husband/wife and family with you, that might sound pretty rough.

And someone hearing the above might be tempted to respond with "braindeadfuckingmoron", because they felt they were intentionally insulted, and their parenting skills belittled or demeaned.

But to the fundie preaching to you, the comments above would be sincere and quite honestly intended to help you avoid eternal torment. Absolutely sincere. The fact that you were offended is (a) proof that your conscience is being convicted; and (b) something you need to resolve, not the fundie. How you receive something is not necessarily the same as how it was given.

[2]
Also, I only saw part of the thread - it was heavily redacted by the mods.

Edited to add: I just love using the word "redacted". :)

[Sauron]

No, not because of an insult. But also not entirely because of the argument. It was a combination of really pointed and blunt arguments, delivered in the same volume and intensity that I was defending myself with.

Volume and tenacity do make a difference, especially in someone who uses those same tactics to defend themselves. The opponent didn't "wither" - if that makes any sense.
I don't think I've ever seen a convincing rant.

Argumentum ad personal incredulity.

Because it didn't happen to you, or doesn't work for you, therefore it can't happen to anyone and doesn't work anywhere.

Q.E.D.

[Gurdur]

I guess the Kumbaya party is over, as is any attempt to pretend mountain_hare can be rehabilitated.
Ah well, back to work on the relationship scene with mountan_hare.
:popcorn:
...The moderation policy on boards such as IIDB is condescending in itself. It basically treats posters like little kids.
Considering that you, mountain_hare, behave like one, and one with definite problems, I can't really fault SecWeb on that one.So, where ya from mountain_hare?
I would guess the USA, since while Australia was mentioned previously, all his phrasing and attitudes seem directly USA.
Let me say this one thing in mountain hare's defense: I understand his point, regardless of how it was delivered.
There's a huge problem with that -- mountain_hare is attacking anyone but fundies.
Judging from mountain_hare's behaviour, looks like he's just a very young, very typical sulky adolescent who wants to mouth off at people, regardless of whom, and who just likes to use excuses for doing so (the "fundy" bit).
I also know one other thing. Moderators at IIDB will castigate members for using ad hominems, and yet break that same rule - either in forum, or out of it. There is some hypocrisy there.
Oh, agreed, agreed, and I could and often do say far more on that.
:yup:
However, it has bugger all to do with mountain_hare's sulks and tantrums. And thats one of the reasons that I like the way that livius has set up FF.
livius is quite an inspiration to me too. Mind you, we're all learning from experience, and over 3 years I've changed my own mind on matters, as has livius. I like stealing the smilies from here (joke: before I actually did steal any smilies, I'ld ask first).

[viscousmemories]

Two comments: <snip>
Oh I definitely understand that. But another important angle to that whole thing was that we aren't supposed to treat only fundamentalist evangelicals who tell us we're going to burn in hell like braindeadfuckingmorons, but anyone who answers "yes" to the question, "Do you believe in God?" That's where my biggest disagreement lies with certain atheists. It's hatemongering as near as I can tell, not importantly different from what we criticize in certain fundie evangelicals.

Redacted is a good word. That's one I'd have to look up before I used it.

[Sweetie]

I don't think I've ever seen a convincing rant.

Argumentum ad personal incredulity.

Because it didn't happen to you, or doesn't work for you, therefore it can't happen to anyone and doesn't work anywhere.

He said he's "never seen," not that it was "impossible that it happen."



But see now the thread is boring.

You guys can pick on me if you want. :P

j/k, forcing me to go to bed, you dumb-ass motherfucking *^%$#%.

:P

[John Carter]

I also know one other thing. Moderators at IIDB will castigate members for using ad hominems, and yet break that same rule - either in forum, or out of it.

Arggg. Pardon me for the derailment, but you just hit on one of my pet peeves. ad hominem is a specific logical fallacy; it is not a synonym for insult, nor does it necessarily even involve an insult. For example, if I were debating viscuousmemories on some topic, and I said "You have spent time in jail, therefore your argument is incorrect," I have committed an ad hominem fallacy, yet I have not insulted him.

Now back to your regularly scheduled flame fest.

[viscousmemories]

Arggg. Pardon me for the derailment, but you just hit on one of my pet peeves. ad hominem is a specific logical fallacy; it is not a synonym for insult, nor does it necessarily even involve an insult. For example, if I were debating viscuousmemories on some topic, and I said "You have spent time in jail, therefore your argument is incorrect," I have committed an ad hominem fallacy, yet I have not insulted him.

Now back to your regularly scheduled flame fest.
I'm glad you picked that nit, John. That's one of my pet peeves too and I'm so poisoned by the frequent misuse of it at IIDB I didn't even notice it this time. (Okay true, I never even heard of an ad hominem until I started going to IIDB, but you get what I mean.) :)

[Crumb]

Another :1thumbup: to John Carter. I get annoyed at that too. What is worse is that I used to use the word that way, but now I hate it.

[Gurdur]

...Arggg. Pardon me for the derailment, but you just hit on one of my pet peeves. ad hominem is a specific logical fallacy; it is not a synonym for insult, nor does it necessarily even involve an insult.
True, all very true, and I plead guilty myself to misuse of the phrase --- corrupted by usage on SecWeb, I am.
I will try to avoid it.
Now back to your regularly scheduled flame fest.
I think that's one of the few certainties of life.

[justaman]

Argumentum ad personal incredulity.

Because it didn't happen to you, or doesn't work for you, therefore it can't happen to anyone and doesn't work anywhere.

Q.E.D.
No, I think objectively speaking it just can't work. It's a universal law. Like special relativity. :cool:

[Gurdur]

I actually helped her a little bit.

An entirely collaborative project, in fact, and not just in the sense that we'd be using notepads and carrier pigeons if it were just me, but in terms of policy, structure and anything else you can think of too. Just for the record.
True, true, and the FF is definitely an inspiration to those of us like me who are not above plagiarizing or nicking good ideas.

[Crumb]

No, I think objectively speaking it just can't work. It's a universal law. Like special relativity.

You are a big fat poo-poo head, so you're wrong! :ptht:

/me demonstrates an ad hominim. :bowing:

[justaman]

Shut up jizzhead. :glare:

[Crumb]

Shut up jizzhead.

eww... :shudder:

[justaman]

Arggg. Pardon me for the derailment, but you just hit on one of my pet peeves. ad hominem is a specific logical fallacy; it is not a synonym for insult, nor does it necessarily even involve an insult. For example, if I were debating viscuousmemories on some topic, and I said "You have spent time in jail, therefore your argument is incorrect," I have committed an ad hominem fallacy, yet I have not insulted him.

Now back to your regularly scheduled flame fest.
hehe John you're the best but you are so the android:

http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/Assets/android.jpg
Android doesn't anger, nor does he engage in actual combat, rather he will merely point out the logical inconsistencies of other Warriors. Irony and sarcasm are completely lost on Android, and being impossible to insult or injure in any way, he is invulnerable to conventional attack. If, for example, someone were to call him a pinhead, he would get out a tape measure and after finding that his cranium falls within normal size specifications Android would dismiss the comment as erroneous. Android's circuits are not equipped to process ambiguous or aesthetic input, consequently any extensive discussion involving personal feelings, intuition, art and metaphorical allusions will quickly drive Android from the field of battle.

[Gurdur]

I don't think that's fair to John Carter --- as I understand it, he's deliberately suppressing a whole lot of his opinions and feelings in order not to alienate people. I don't know at all the story here, but I think it would be fair to recognise the effort he makes and why he feels he has to.

[viscousmemories]

Pay no attention to justaman. He's just pinin' for the fjords 'cause he's afraid the flaming is gonna stop.

I'm going to bed. Treat each other with love and tenderness.

[seebs]

When I was on staff at CF, I took advantage of a rule which was written to prohibit insults, but which actually said "ad hominems", and smacked people for any variety of ad hominem. Hah! It was fun.

[justaman]

Man learn to laugh, hey.

[viscousmemories]

Man learn to laugh, hey.
The last time I looked at that Flame Warriors site I identified with the first like five or six I looked at, so I had to stop looking. I hate the idea that I can be characterized so easily in so many different ways. But the next time someone accuses me of being too serious I will kill you all.

[justaman]

I know, me too! It's gay. And I was talking to gurdur :P

[John Carter]

I appreciate the defense, Gurdur. However, I found Justaman's post amusing. Given the context and my last post in this thread, it was perfect.

[justaman]

:smugnod:

[Petra]

Baby's on fire
Better throw her in the water
Look at her laughing
Like a heifer to the slaughter

Baby's on fire
And all the laughing boys are bitching
Waiting for photos
Oh the plot is so bewitching

Rescuers row row
Do your best to change the subject
Blow the wind blow blow
Lend some assistance to the object

Photographers snip snap
Take your time she's only burning
This kind of experience
Is necessary for her learning

If you'll be my flotsam
I could be half the man I used to
They said you were hot stuff
And that's what Baby's been reduced to...

Juanita and Juan
Very clever with maraccas
Making their fortunes
Selling second-hand tobaccoes

Juan dances at Chico's
And when the clients are evicted
He empties the ashtrays
And pockets all that he's collected

But Baby's on fire!
And all the instruments agree that
Her temperature's rising
But any idiot would know that.


I only posted that 'cos I felt like it. It's what I'm listening to right now, and the lines "Baby's on fire
Better throw her in the water
Look at her laughing
Like a heifer to the slaughter" made me think of our lovely livius drusus and the laughing, on fire heifer that she is. :D

:tease:


:cowdance:

[pescifish]

I'll come running to tie your shoes...

[HelenM]

Arggg. Pardon me for the derailment, but you just hit on one of my pet peeves. ad hominem is a specific logical fallacy; it is not a synonym for insult, nor does it necessarily even involve an insult. For example, if I were debating viscuousmemories on some topic, and I said "You have spent time in jail, therefore your argument is incorrect," I have committed an ad hominem fallacy, yet I have not insulted him.

I understand your general point, but I disagree that the example you gave above is not an insult. Asserting that someone's argument must be incorrect because of some personal characteristic of them is inherently insulting, in my opinion.

Helen

[Godless Dave]

I don't think you're hypocritical, liv.

[Gurdur]

I appreciate the defense, Gurdur. However, I found Justaman's post amusing. Given the context and my last post in this thread, it was perfect.
true, I thought it was bloody funny too. But even so, I was a tad worried about your own state of mind, which is why I wrote what I did; however, I see that I had no such need to worry.

So.......... all I gotta do now is find out if mountain_hare stil wants to dance with me. I suspect he's found the Ignore button, judging from the way he hasn't answered my last two posts to him, but if he's using the Ignore button, then that only disproves his statements (him stating how tough he is, yada yada yada).
Either way I win ? heh.
:popcorn:

[viscousmemories]

And I was talking to gurdur :P
Yeah, yeah. I knew that. But it was just such a good opening I stole it. :D

[mountain_hare]

.......... all I gotta do now is find out if mountain_hare stil wants to dance with me. I

I'm sorry, Gurdur, but I'm not that sort of guy. Perhaps you should try finding a guy who's, ummm, a little gayer?

[justaman]

I'm sorry, Gurdur, but I'm not that sort of guy. Perhaps you should try finding a guy who's, ummm, a little gayer?
http://redwing.hutman.net/%7Emreed/Assets/enfantprovocateur.jpg
Enfant Provocateur likes to stir up trouble because...because, well...just because. This species of Flame Warrior is almost always young and male - it could be just a hormone thing.

[mountain_hare]

Why justaman, thank you for posting a picture of Gurdur. Not only does he have his pants down, it appears that he is bending over to be sodomized. Apparently my comments hinting that he is gay might have some substance after all. ;)

[Gurdur]

I'm sorry, Gurdur, but I'm not that sort of guy.
True, you have all the balls of an amoeba.
Perhaps you should try finding a guy who's, ummm, a little gayer?
That would be difficult, if not impossible, judging from you.
____________

Enfant Provocateur ...
Spot on.
But mountain_hare is even more useless than the usual run.

[justaman]

Why justaman, thank you for posting a picture of Gurdur. Not only does he have his pants down, it appears that he is bending over to be sodomized. Apparently my comments hinting that he is gay might have some substance after all. ;)
Wow. I'm kinda embarrassed I've been talking to you at all now! There's really not much substance to you is there? :pat: Simple little guy.

[mountain_hare]

Gurdur:

True, you have all the balls of an amoeba.
Now, now, there is no need to get bitchy just because I didn't react favourably to your come-ons. I can understand why you are upset about having to sleep alone (again) tonight, but that is really not reason to make fun of the one thing you wanted the most.

[Gurdur]

Now, now, there is no need to get bitchy just because I didn't react favourably to your come-ons
You're doing very nicely now.
:giggle:
... but that is really not reason to make fun of the one thing you wanted the most.
I got you, dweeb. You're reason enough for anyone to make fun of you.
:rofl:

[livius drusus]

Well, I think it's important to recognize what we have here: a community that is, by and large, self-policing. Moderators are free to participate, to comment, or to sit back and eat popcorn. Members are free to be contributors, or pricks - as long as they are prepared to deal with the consequences of either decision.

That's pretty much what we were going for when we set up the place, Sauron. It's really good to hear that for now and for the most part at least, it seems to be workingly as planned.

I will differ slightly with you, though, and say that the admins (who are the sole moderators) aren't exactly free to participate, comment or sit back and eat popcorn because we impose certain strictures on ourselves. Hence my apologies in this thread and bey's.

Everyone here puts themself under a higher burden of responsiblity that a moderated forum would. The net result is a level of courtesy similar to a professional colloquium. I just think it's cool that this is precisely what the internet was intended to be.

I think it's even cooler that you would say such a lovely thing about us. Thank you very much. :thankee:

It might be like pure communism - workable on a small scale but prone to abuses on larger scales. I don't know. But for the time being, this is a special place.

Oh man, that's not just another whole thread, but a huge concern we've had since the beginning. Perhaps it's time for another long, detailed metadiscussion which bores the crap out of everyone but we forum nerds. :D

[godfry n. glad]

Well, I think it's important to recognize what we have here: a community that is, by and large, self-policing. Moderators are free to participate, to comment, or to sit back and eat popcorn. Members are free to be contributors, or pricks - as long as they are prepared to deal with the consequences of either decision.

That's pretty much what we were going for when we set up the place, Sauron. It's really good to hear that for now and for the most part at least, it seems to be workingly as planned.

I will differ slightly with you, though, and say that the admins (who are the sole moderators) aren't exactly free to participate, comment or sit back and eat popcorn because we impose certain strictures on ourselves. Hence my apologies in this thread and bey's.

Everyone here puts themself under a higher burden of responsiblity that a moderated forum would. The net result is a level of courtesy similar to a professional colloquium. I just think it's cool that this is precisely what the internet was intended to be.

I think it's even cooler that you would say such a lovely thing about us. Thank you very much. :thankee:

It might be like pure communism - workable on a small scale but prone to abuses on larger scales. I don't know. But for the time being, this is a special place.

Oh man, that's not just another whole thread, but a huge concern we've had since the beginning. Perhaps it's time for another long, detailed metadiscussion which bores the crap out of everyone but we forum nerds. :D


I'm impressed so far. If you do the discussion, tell me, I'd like to at least lurk.

[wei yau]

Oh man, that's not just another whole thread, but a huge concern we've had since the beginning. Perhaps it's time for another long, detailed metadiscussion which bores the crap out of everyone but we forum nerds. :D

:fflove: :posting: :nerdy:

Reporting for duty!

[viscousmemories]

I will differ slightly with you, though, and say that the admins (who are the sole moderators) aren't exactly free to participate, comment or sit back and eat popcorn because we impose certain strictures on ourselves. Hence my apologies in this thread and bey's.
Amen to that. And a large part of the reason I wanted to start a forum is because I wasn't happy with the moderation elsewhere, and people told me if I didn't like it I should start my own forum where I could say whatever I want.

Ah, irony.

Overall, though, as much as I hate not being able to say the first thing that comes to my mind, I think I feel better, learn more and get a lot more respect by trying to put myself in other people's shoes and respond respectfully even when it's not returned. Of course I've never claimed to be above attacking people, so I do still slip from time to time (here and elsewhere) but I think I do a fairly good job of it these days. Certainly much better than a year ago.

[godfry n. glad]

I think I do a fairly good job of it these days. Certainly much better than a year ago.

Likewise, I'm sure.

[viscousmemories]

Likewise, I'm sure.
Hmm... do you mean that you agree that I do a good job of it these days or that you also do a good job of it these days?

[godfry n. glad]

Likewise, I'm sure.
Hmm... do you mean that you agree that I do a good job of it these days or that you also do a good job of it these days?

Actually, the latter...I think.

But, now that you note it, both.

[viscousmemories]

Actually, the latter...I think.

But, now that you note it, both.
Cool. I didn't want to thank you or agree until I knew.

But thank you, and I agree. :)

[HelenM]

Overall, though, as much as I hate not being able to say the first thing that comes to my mind, I think I feel better, learn more and get a lot more respect by trying to put myself in other people's shoes and respond respectfully even when it's not returned. Of course I've never claimed to be above attacking people, so I do still slip from time to time (here and elsewhere) but I think I do a fairly good job of it these days. Certainly much better than a year ago.

I think the best position to be in is to have a choice how we respond. Only the people who have ignored an insult or walked away from the computer when they read one know from experience that they have that choice. Others may assume that they are choosing to respond to an insult by insulting back, however, if they always respond that way perhaps that's all they're able to do. Perhaps they're at the mercy of those who insult them because once insulted, they cannot not take the bait.

Helen

[viscousmemories]

I think the best position to be in is to have a choice how we respond. Only the people who have ignored an insult or walked away from the computer when they read one know from experience that they have that choice. Others may assume that they are choosing to respond to an insult by insulting back, however, if they always respond that way perhaps that's all they're able to do. Perhaps they're at the mercy of those who insult them because once insulted, they cannot not take the bait.

Helen
I agree, Helen. Very good point. :yup:

[Dragar]

Yeah that'd be real funny you pair of hypcritical asshole hill bunnies. :fuming:

I think he loves us! :)

It might be like pure communism - workable on a small scale but prone to abuses on larger scales. I don't know. But for the time being, this is a special place.

Agreed.

[godfry n. glad]

Yeah that'd be real funny you pair of hypcritical asshole hill bunnies. :fuming:

I think he loves us! :)

Indubitably. Watch out, though, he can be rough on the trouser-cuffs.

It might be like pure communism - workable on a small scale but prone to abuses on larger scales. I don't know. But for the time being, this is a special place.

Agreed.

So... How are we going to know that it's being abused? Will there be indicators? What might they be?