Dem Bones

[livius drusus]

* Ymir's blood is easily amused.

Okay I have to admit that is just adorable. :skull2:

I should probably take this to another thread, but have you by any chance ever heard of a church in Rome called Santa Maria della Concezione? It's right next to the American Embassy and is famous for its crypt, the home of many a long-departed Capuchin brother. I bet you'd, um, dig the hell out of it.

[Ymir's blood]

* Ymir's blood is easily amused.

Okay I have to admit that is just adorable. :skull2:

I should probably take this to another thread, but have you by any chance ever heard of a church in Rome called Santa Maria della Concezione? It's right next to the American Embassy and is famous for its crypt, the home of many a long-departed Capuchin brother. I bet you'd, um, dig the hell out of it.
Is that the crypt where bodies naturally mummify?

[livius drusus]

Is that the crypt where bodies naturally mummify?

Nope. It's the crypt where they make wall art out of the disinterred skeletons of monks.

[Ymir's blood]

Ok, I've got Google on it.

[Ymir's blood]

Maybe a thread split would be appropriate?

Here are some interesting pages
Page on the history of the church (http://www.exseminarians.com/rome/Churches/Concezione.htm)
Some pictures of the crypt (http://www.stuardtclarkesrome.com/capuchin.html)
European relics (http://www.ricksteves.com/plan/destinations/europe/relics.htm)

[livius drusus]

Oh yeah, sorry. I have a link to some good pics here somewhere. Hold on.

Here you go (http://www.xo4.com/Capuchin/capuchin.html).

[livius drusus]

Maybe a thread split would be appropriate?

Maybe it would. This thread was inspired by Ymir's blood's new lighter (http://www.freethought-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?p=63153#post63153) as well as his general appreciation for the skeletal arts.

[SharonDee]

Wow, I didn't know there was such a place. I feel positively ghoulish for thinking this is... well, beautiful.

Is this wrong?

[livius drusus]

Not at all, Sharon. I've been entranced by that church since I was a very little girl. The inscription over the entrance archway says noi eravamo come voi e voi sarete come noi (we were like you and you will be like us). I found the whole atmosphere somehow warm and embracing even as it scared me.

Whenever people ask me about places to see in Rome I always point them to this church.

[Ymir's blood]

Wow, I didn't know there was such a place. I feel positively ghoulish for thinking this is... well, beautiful.

Is this wrong?
No, death is a part of life, not its opposite. Throughout history, most societies have accepted that. Things such as this were an attempt to come to terms with mortality, to realize that it is natural and unavoidable. An appreciation of such things is as healthy as understanding nutrition or sex. Not talking about these subjects makes them more likely to harm us, rather than less.

Twentieth Century (and now) Western culture has tried to remove most references to mortality from daily life. In the Victorian era, cemeteries were places of beauty with artistic monuments in celebration of the deceased. Today, many cemeteries have nothing above ground except the occasional vase for flowers.

The way that our society handles death doesn't remove it from view, just makes it illicit and cheapens it. Instead of a serious topic, it is reduced to lurid sensationalism. TV newsreaders cheerfully trot out the death toll from the latest diaster or terrorist attack while reporters searching for sound bites hound the bereaved.

[pescifish]

If by some chance I ever get to Rome, that crypt is definitely on the top of my list of things to do!

In one of the links Ymir's blood provided, I found this comment very interesting: During the French Revolution, Paris experienced a great church cemetery land grab. Skeletons of countless Parisians were dug up and carefully stacked along miles of tunnels beneath the city.

I miss the days when you could play Hamlet and pick up a skull in the dank dark privacy of your own stretch of an empty Parisian tunnel. I can still feel the skull I once held in my hand. Looking into its eye sockets, I pondered the ease at which I could pop that fellow right into my day bag and head home with the ultimate souvenir. I lost my nerve and returned the skull to its pile. The next year, having stored up enough nerve to actually go ahead and do the dirty deed, I returned to find the skulls wired together. A head in the bag is worth two in the tunnel.Now I am curious. This guy is talking about illegal theft of the bones, but is it illegal to have actual human bones in one's home or personal possession regardless of origin? I expect there would have to be some sort of careful trail as to who/what/when/how, but, for example, if I wanted to bequeath my skeleton (properly dessicated, of course) to someone could I? We can have cremation remains in our homes, can we have actual bones?

[SharonDee]

The way that our society handles death doesn't remove it from view, just makes it illicit and cheapens it. Instead of a serious topic, it is reduced to lurid sensationalism. TV newsreaders cheerfully trot out the death toll from the latest diaster or terrorist attack while reporters searching for sound bites hound the bereaved.I don't know how I missed YB's response to my post. Thinking about it, what you describe above is ghoulish, not this church.

That stuff bugs me on so many levels. "How does it make you feel to know your son is dead?" It feels like this! --grabs nuts and gives them a twist--

(Oh, and thanks to pesci for dragging this back up to the top. I was just thinking I wanted to find those links again. I have time to casually peruse them now that I'm at home instead of at work.)

[pescifish]

That stuff bugs me on so many levels. "How does it make you feel to know your son is dead?" It feels like this! --grabs nuts and gives them a twist---When I was a little kid and this sort of thing seemed to just start, my dad used to point it out every time a dumbshit reporter would sensationalize a personal tragedy in that way.

And, yeah, I had to wait until I had some time to look at the links and finally got to it this morning. Cool stuff!

[Legs]

I'll be in Rome next month, and I'll try to stop by Santa Maria della Concezione and pay my regards to the Monks.

The inscription over the entrance archway says noi eravamo come voi e voi sarete come noi (we were like you and you will be like us).

:shudder: + :vibes:

[maddog]

Is that the crypt where bodies naturally mummify?

I know of a crypt where that happens: it's at St. Michan's in Ireland, Dublin I believe. The Mummies of St. Michan's (http://www.irelandforvisitors.com/articles/mummies_of_st_michans.htm)
http://www.blather.net/blather/2007/08/the_mummies_of_saint_michans.html

#1430

[Ymir's blood]

Is that the crypt where bodies naturally mummify?

I know of a crypt where that happens: it's at St. Michan's in Ireland, Dublin I believe. The Mummies of St. Michan's (http://www.irelandforvisitors.com/articles/mummies_of_st_michans.htm)
Blather: Waking the Dead: The Mummies of Saint Michan's Church, Dublin (http://www.blather.net/blather/2007/08/the_mummies_of_saint_michans.html)

#1430
I hadn't heard of that place. Thanks. The one I was referring to was a monastery in Italy though.

Most likely the Irish ones aren't really mummified but were pickled. :wink:

[livius drusus]

Oh hey. It looks like the monks got themselves a website since I started this thread. The Crypt (http://www.cappucciniviaveneto.it/cappuccini_ing.html) :aww:

[Ymir's blood]

In the left-hand wall is preserved, at her request, the heart of Maria Felice Peretti (+1650), a grand-niece of Pope Sixtus V, who was very devoted to the Capuchins.Tony Bennett has nothing on her.