Why are you married?

[Bella]

Why did you and your spouse get married?

My significant other wondered out loud whether or not I'd consider getting married again. I said no, because after having been married once, I really don't understand what the benefits are. It seems that all marriage boils down to is the church's blessing on your union. Plus you get joint property, joint health insurance, and a tax deduction. Whoo-hoo.

Marriage doesn't guarantee the longevity of a relationship. People can break their promises, easy - promising to love someone until death do you part is no different. My significant other says, I know that marriage doesn't guarantee anything, and if at any point things weren't working out, it IS a good idea to just go your seperate ways.

So, I ask, what's the point? Can't people just live together in sin and be happy with that?

Am I just a cynical bitch?

[godfry n. glad]

Well, Bree...

I'm not married, but I used to be.

I also grew up in the tumultuous era of recent American history, becoming an adult in 1974. My college romance was based upon the "we'll never get married; marriage is an outmoded social tool" perspective. It was great until she decided to do some sampling and "let me down easy" by lying to me.

I got married because I, and my bride, both wanted to make it a bit more difficult to separate than just grabbing our stuff and splitting. We'd both been through troubling relationships prior to meeting. For us, the insurance benefits were the major financial benefit, as I was part of the "voluntary poor" doing environmental social work and had no coverage. By marrying, I gained medical coverage that I'm damned glad I have. By marrying, it allowed us to have one of us (my wife), claim her unused benefits (because I covered her) and thus gain extra income.

Other than that, we got married because it "felt right" to us. Both of us could well have gone with the "shacking up", but actually liked being married.

I was married 18 years. I had one misguided infatuation three years into it, but did nothing stupid and let it die a natural death from lack of proximity. Boy, am I glad I did. the remaining 15 years were filled with joy at my relationship with my wife. We were best friends. We were each other's counsellors. We were lovers. We were fellow travellers. We were each other's coaches. We were each other's best critics. We decided not to have kids. To this day, nearly three years after her death, I cannot think of her without tears welling up. My marriage was the best thing that EVER happened in my life to this point.

Marriage is commitment. It's a contract that makes those in it attempt to work through all the problems that come with relationships, before jumping ship.

I just think it's too bad it isn't as difficult to get married as it is to get divorced.

[BDS]

Good post, Godfry.

Of course the financial benefits of marriage that you mention are appealing, but unfair to single people.

I suppose making public vows has the benefit of making it more difficult to break those vows. Lovers all love making vows -- they whisper them across pillows; they carve them into trees; they write them in bad poems. But private vows whispered across a pillow are easier to violate than promises made not only to another person, but to "God and this company". Still, literature is filled with examples of unfortunate vows, that those who took their vows seriously later regretted. Charlemagne regretted dozens of his vows, if we believe the legends.

[Dingfod]

Why, back in my day, you didn't have sex without gettin' hitched. And, that's the way we liked it. After almost having sex a bunch of times, I met a gal I wanted to have sex with a whole bunch of times, so I askt her to marry me. She didn't know no better, said "Yeah, I guess.", so I married her. We been havin' sex ever since, me and her.

[godfry n. glad]

Why, back in my day, you didn't have sex without gettin' hitched. And, that's the way we liked it. After almost having sex a bunch of times, I met a gal I wanted to have sex with a whole bunch of times, so I askt her to marry me. She didn't know no better, said "Yeah, I guess.", so I married her. We been havin' sex ever since, me and her.

Geez, Warren, you're a younger old geezer than am I. I had every opportunity from age 19 17 on to have sex without "gettin' hitched". It was the "Sexual Revolution" in the wake of the ready availability of "the pill". Feminism was rampant and very anti-marriage (it was a tool of the exploiting paternalistic power structure). It was before the AIDS epidemic.

Y'know, I think that's what you missed out on by not going to college. Y'think?

[username]

Why did you and your spouse get married?


For me marriage meant a life long commitment to another person. It meant putting up with their shit, doing really stupid things we would regret, wanting to kill each other at times and still, remaining firmly committed to each other no matter what. Committed to making it work, to walking through life together until death.

Marriage isn't required for this kind of commitment, nor does marriage guarantee this kind of commitment, but for us marriage symbolized this commitment so we married.

[Anastasia Beaverhausen]

*sighs and wallows in her loneliness*

[Ensign Steve]

Plus you get joint property, joint health insurance, and a tax deduction.
:yeahthat:

[Veritas]

Why, back in my day, you didn't have sex without gettin' hitched. And, that's the way we liked it. After almost having sex a bunch of times, I met a gal I wanted to have sex with a whole bunch of times, so I askt her to marry me. She didn't know no better, said "Yeah, I guess.", so I married her. We been havin' sex ever since, me and her.

That's so romantic.

You're still gay, though. :glare:

[inland wave]

Yup, he's a true romantic.... and yeah, I would have to agree he's still gay..

[viscousmemories]

We been havin' sex ever since, me and her.
Is it hard to post while you're doing that?

[MonCapitan2002]

*sighs and wallows in her loneliness*
I know how you feel.

[inland wave]

We been havin' sex ever since, me and her.
Is it hard to post while you're doing that?
Please, don't give him any ideas.....hmmmm on second thought

[wildernesse]

Well, I think godfrey said it best. I'm married to my best friend and we're a wonderful family together. We don't really have any financial benefits--not having a whole lot of "finance" laying around, so we don't get insurance benefits and don't own any property together--well none that you can't own with a nonmarried person. So getting married was saying formally "Here's the one and only--I love him!"

Plus, he'll love me even if I fail out of law school and go to work on a farm. So he says. heehee.

[Petra]

Godfry's post does indeed rule, and although I'm not married and never have been (commitment shy, y'know), I can totally dig where he's coming from, and envy him a little for finding that one person who is "worth it".


Wildernesse, easy for you to say - you're married to a very cool dude! :vibes:

[godfry n. glad]

Well, to be frank, we were both in our early thirties, she being two years older an all. She was a New York Jewess, who'd moved out here from Miami to go to state cow college (because of friend she'd met in high school), did the hippy-dippy "back to the country" scene with acreage outside of rural Philomath, before moving to the big city for work and to be part of the folk music scene. I was a native son, worker in a worker-owned cooperative recycling and refuse hauling business. I was her garbage man...

(not your usual "knight in shining armour" picture, eh?)

After several years, she, hardened cynic and skeptic that she was, became convinced it was all "kismet". That we were fated to be together. Even then, she knew she would die of cancer. Then, losing her brother and mother both to cancer in two horrendous years sealed her conviction. I'm just happy I got to be a really positive part of the last years of her life. We were happy together. We had come to that point where we could finish each other's sentences. We were very, very in tune with each other. Many of her friends from earlier years have told me how content she had become after I became part of her life.

I have a WASP friend who goes in for Native American "woo-woo" and he is convinced that there are people who are "couplers" and those who are not. He is one and he and is third wife have now been together for more than 25 years. He knew me from the recycling coop; from before I knew Ivy. He told me I'm a "coupler". From my personal experience, it's something which makes me very comfortable, so I guess I am.

(so....when does lisarea burst in and call me a stinkin' hippy?) :shiftier:

[Petra]

I'll call you a hippy, you beast!

I think you might have made me cry. I don't know why I keep doing that lately. :doh:


Godfry, you've no idea how much I miss beauty. Thank you for bringing a little. :hug:

[godfry n. glad]

Wildernesse, easy for you to say - you're married to a very cool dude! :vibes:

So... Clue me in. Anybody we know?

thanks for the compliments, all >:bowing:

[Petra]

Anybody we know?



Rufus Atticus at IIDB. Bloody nice guy. Smart, too.

[godfry n. glad]

Does he muck about in the Bib Crit forum at all? The name sounds familiar.

[Petra]

Does he muck about in the Bib Crit forum at all? The name sounds familiar.

Dunno. Wouldn't have a clue about that one, sorry. :shrug:

[godfry n. glad]

I'll call you a hippy, you beast!

Actually, I think that's a misnomer for me. I never did psychadelics and I never "went back to the land". Although I'm known to like incense, I think crystals are hokum, as are pyramids, the Illuminati, and Atlantis and the rest of that New Age woo-woo. I eat meat; and enjoy it. I passed through Zen on my way from the Beats to philosophical Taoism. I was a political activist. An art activist. An environmental activist. A neighborhood activist. An anti-war activist. I was arrested for painting "shadows" on sidewalks to commemorate Hiroshima Day. I was a blue-collar college economics student with grandiose ideas about how we could change the world for the better. I almost always had a job.

That's not hippy. I was closer to being a Yippie than I ever was a hippy.

Now I'm just Jackson Browne's 'Pretender.'

[Petra]

As long as you weren't a hippy yuppie, g. Thems were the worstest kind.

And as for your Jackson Browne's Pretender, I'll see you that, and raise you a John Hiatt's Have a Little Faith In Me.

Heh. That'll teach ya. :smugnod:

[godfry n. glad]

As long as you weren't a hippy yuppie, g. Thems were the worstest kind.

Nope. I never had enough money to qualify as a yuppie. The curse of working for non-profits...or no profits.

I'm still an activist. Trees, parks, city government, hostelling.

I saw an intriguing poster at a nearby coffee place. "End Corporate Personhood" series of interactive lecture/discussions. (Held at the Unitarian church, of course.) It looks like good stuff.

[Dingfod]

Geez, Warren, you're a younger old geezer than am I. I had every opportunity from age 19 17 on to have sex without "gettin' hitched". It was the "Sexual Revolution" in the wake of the ready availability of "the pill". Feminism was rampant and very anti-marriage (it was a tool of the exploiting paternalistic power structure). It was before the AIDS epidemic.

Y'know, I think that's what you missed out on by not going to college. Y'think?Ya damn hippy. I lived in staid Texas Panhandle and Northern Oklahoma. They have yet to experience the sexual revolution. As liberal as I am about other people's behaviors, I'm actually quite conservative in my own, a little old-fashioned.

[ManM]

This thread needs a good strong dose of nomarriage.com.

[NotLou]

I guess I wanted to have a traditional life: wife, kids, house. And I fell in love with someone who also wanted that. So there we are.

[inland wave]

Godfry baby, you just rule......Have a wonderful day!!!

[LadyShea]

As I explained in other threads, in the US marriage also conveys certain legal rights that are difficult to obtain/give to non-spouses. I think this is wrong, personally, but it is the way things are.

That being said, I like having our committment recognized by society. I could have done that with any kind of ceremony though and been just as happy...for example if handfasting were recognized.

[Beth]

I married because I was young, idealistic, and in love. I am not quite sure if I would have married back then if I knew what I knew now, but somehow we are still together. Because we both saw the vow as a permanent one, we cannot just break apart the relationship and have been forced to mire through the bad times, survive the caustic times, and rebuild to create times of harmony and peace. Sometimes marriage is so very lonely and crushing, and othertimes it is such a joy and a sense of accomplishment.

All that I can say is that when I think about my future, all that I can see is one with my husband and myself enjoying the rest of our lives together. I think we are both now on this same page and seem to be striving to reach this goal together.

[wildernesse]

Does he muck about in the Bib Crit forum at all? The name sounds familiar.

Well, right now he's kinda retired from iidb because of school and working on other things. I don't think he would have been in the Bible Criticism forum much--but he was a mod in Evo/Creation, and that's where he ran around mostly. And Politics?

I don't know--it's been a while.

[epepke]

Am I just a cynical bitch?

It's appropriately cynical.

The first time I got married, it was because the fairy tale was the only thing in my experience. Didn't work.

The second time I got married, it was because it made it easier to travel in Mexico. Didn't work.

The third time I might get married, it's probably just because my fiancee wants it, and her father gets on her ass for the fact that we aren't married yet. I hope it doesn't fuck things up again.

[Miss Shelby]

So, I ask, what's the point? Can't people just live together in sin and be happy with that?You can do whatever you want. My husband and I lived in sin for years before we got married, the only real reason we got married is because we wanted kids. That was nine years ago and since then my opinion on things has changed dramatically. I used to think relationships were just about keeping the other person happy. Being happy. Having a smile on our faces all the time and being content. But I don't think that when you're talking about relationships you can realistically have that expectation. If you do they aren't going last. And if that's what you want I suppose that's fine. But staying together over a long period of time (lifetime) requires more just the desire to be happy. It requires, I'm already learning from experience, staying committed even when the desire to leave is overwhelming. Because love is action, it's not a feeling. IMO. I think it's doing the right thing even when the right thing isn't want we want to do. I know I am generalizing, and I know that there a very valid reasons why relationships do not work out, and I am NOT making judgement. I am saying, generally, that we are a me-centric people. Committed to our own contentments. And I think that in my case, had I left my husband a few years ago when I really wanted to, any other subsequent relationship would have resulted in my doing the same thing. My attitude of what love is had to change. That's just speaking for myself. (well I guess I spoke for the genralized population, too.. :D )

Michelle

[Miss Shelby]

godfry, I want to tell you--and have wanted to in the past but never have--that it's very inspiring for me to hear you speak about your marriage. I hope that the day will come, if either myself or my husband should pass, that the other of us can look back on the life we had together the way that you do when you speak of your marriage. I am sorry for the pain you've endured in losing her. I hope that you take comfort in knowing the example that you have given others -- because to hear you tell it, your and your wife were very committed to one another. I'm not sure that enough people know what that feels like, and as I have said, I hope I do some day.

Michelle

[RevDahlia]

As I explained in other threads, in the US marriage also conveys certain legal rights that are difficult to obtain/give to non-spouses. I think this is wrong, personally, but it is the way things are.

That being said, I like having our committment recognized by society. I could have done that with any kind of ceremony though and been just as happy...for example if handfasting were recognized.
:yeahthat:

We'd both shacked up before (with other partners) and hated it. My husband and I are both commitment-minded souls, and shacking up felt like we were just playing the waiting game until our more fancy-free SOs got sick of us. Kinda soured us both on the whole deal.

Also, we're both impatient with the hipster-PC take on commitment and marriage that is shared by most of our peer group -- the idea that the only good relationships are ephemeral, that commitment is death, and the only way to demonstrate integrity is through nonmonogamy or the serial fuck n'chuck. Most of our friends are so rigid and self-satisfied when it comes to that value system that it was fun to shock them by getting married -- kinda like it must have been fun to shock people by not getting married, back in the day. That was by no means our primary motivation, of course, but it was a perk.

I don't think marriage is a good or bad thing -- it's a neutral thing which becomes good or bad depending on the people, and/or combination of people, involved. I don't think it does much good to generalize about the utility of the institution in general.
This thread needs a good strong dose of nomarriage.com.
No thank you. I won't sit still for sanctimonious lectures about how much of a manipulative, avaricious bloodsucker I am, and how men should avoid me at all costs. I am actually a human being, despite having the dreaded ovaries.

[SharonDee]

My reasons for marrying are lost in the mists of time. (Translation: I ain't telling!) The reason I stay married is because I don't know how to live the alternative anymore.

[godfry n. glad]

Wow... Thanks for all the props, guys.

Everybody is hitting all the major spots about marriage, for sure. It's not for everybody; it is a working relationship. You do have to work at it. Both my wife and I avoided a lot of the "idealism" or "misguided hopes" of what marriage should be like. We married late, with both of us in our early thirties. Neither of us was particularly a romantic, although there must have been some underlying desire for a permanent mate. We were both cynics and both tinged with counter-culture attitudes. We knew we'd have to get through tough times together because we were both slightly depressive personalities.

We were also both children of divorced parents, which colors any relationship.

We lived together...shacked up...for a year, a month and a day before our wedding day. That period was where we determined whether we could actually live with the other for an extended period of time. There was no proposal, we just decided to see what it would take to get married in another country, and did. Her advice to prospective brides and grooms was to take a long, overseas trip together; she felt that is the true test of a relationship.

I'd say that the other thing which made our marriage work was the mix of complementary and similar attitudes. We shared many attitudes and opinions on things, while in others one of us had more strength, skill or aptitude that the other could appreciate. It was a fair distribution of labor, with lots of good-natured snide comments from the sidelines. And, yes, we shared the same snide sense of humor.

I think there was also a lot of acceptance of each other, as we were. We didn't try to change each other in any significant way. We fought, we disagreed, but we set a ground rule that we never went to bed angry. We never slept apart, except when one of us was traveling or contagious.

After fifteen years together, she loved to sing me the words to Trisha Yearwood's 'Fairytale', which she'd taught herself to pick out the tune on her ukulele. That was gratifying.

[freemonkey]

godfry, I love hearing you tell about Ivy, you two had a mutually loving and respectful relationship, something that takes a lot of work that it seems so many people don't know how to do. :huggle:

[Sweetie]

Why am I married?

Well, I'm not sure if these statements ultimately contradict or not, but all I can say is:

I didn't marry him just because he fathered my child and the one I was pregnant with at the time.

We probably wouldn't have married at least so soon without the kids and then possibly, not at all.

It was at the time, mostly about the kids but not necessarily because of the kids per se.

[godfry n. glad]

Actually, I misspoke. We got married a year, a month and a day after our first date. First date was Shakespeare-in-the-Parks production of "Two Gentlemen of Verona" at Mt. Tabor Park in mid August. I moved in with her on Thanksgiving Day weekend, and we got married in Victoria, British Columbia, the following September. She got a great deal of joy out of the fact that our wedding license refers to her as a "spinster".

She was my "sticks and strings" girl. She knitted, spun, tatted, made bobbin lace, played the Irish harp, mandolin and ukulele. My home is still filled with fleece and yarn. She loved working on her bungalow home...remodeling was a chronic illness with her. When I moved in, I was given free rein with the garden and exterior, with her veto, while she maintained the interior, with my veto. I never promised her a rose garden, but she got one anyway. I built her a brick patio and moved my entire rose garden so she could put French doors out to a low balcony, overlooking the rose garden and the quiet back yard. She even convinced me to put an awning over the balcony.

We agreed that I would endeavor to put the toilet seat down if she would remember to move the car seat back. I often got to ask her whether I had left the toilet seat down, or was my punishment undeserved. During her last days, she encouraged me to find somebody new....and it shouldn't be too hard, 'cause I was "housebroken".

[seebs]

I think there's a lot to be said for commitment, and the mere fact that it's not a perfect guarantee doesn't mean it's not a big improvement over not having a formal commitment at all.

Spouse and I are about as happy together as can be expected; spouse is bipolar, so there are times when it's mostly inertia, but if that's what it takes to get us back to the good times, I can live with that.