Oh...

[Johnny Pneumatic]

I think I lost her. *sobbing*

[PamelaMe]

passing a handkerchief..........

[Johnny Pneumatic]

passing a handkerchief..........

Thanks. Hopefully I'll feel a little better in a few days. That's hopefully, I don't think I will. *sigh* No, please not back to my frustrated, grumpy self. I have to fight it.

[LadyShea]

What happened?

[PamelaMe]

passing a handkerchief..........

Thanks. Hopefully I'll feel a little better in a few days. That's hopefully, I don't think I will. *sigh* No, please not back to my frustrated, grumpy self. I have to fight it.
poooooor guy...... :( :( :(

OK~~~~~let me make you feel better!and wont back to your frustrated.......

when you feel bad you can transform your bad mood into eating!so peel some bananas or oranges and eat up them,then throw the peels in crowd or on stairs,just keep waiting until someone step on peels falling over oneself......that's very naughty and funnnnny!

[Johnny Pneumatic]

What happened?

I don't really know what happened. Maybe I haven't lost her totally, but I'm fearful.

[Crumb]

:manhug: Sorry, JP.

[maddog]

Oh, Johnny, I'm sorry.

And I can relate to the fear. something happens in intimate relationships, beyond your regular friends, that somehow makes ordinary things feel as if the whole relationship is at risk. I never did figure out how to solve that, but maybe it is wise to regard it, in that respect, just like your regular friendships. You don't totally lose your friends when you disagree or misunderstand. the relationship weathers it. so this relationship can, too. Ask her. don't assume you know what is going on. and don't not say something because of your fear. In a friendship you would speak up and say, something doesnt' feel right. what can I do? Don't keep silent here b/c of fear; that is deadly. This relationship is at least as important as your other friendships, so treat it as such. Just my :twocents:

#874

[godfry n. glad]

That's a pretty good :twocents:, maddog.

The whole point of a successful relationship is the ability to talk through the rough times. Every relationship will have them, the good ones tend to weather the situation with communication, tolerance and forgiveness.

[Dingfod]

Nevermind, nothing to see here.

[Johnny Pneumatic]

Oh, Johnny, I'm sorry.

And I can relate to the fear. something happens in intimate relationships, beyond your regular friends, that somehow makes ordinary things feel as if the whole relationship is at risk. I never did figure out how to solve that, but maybe it is wise to regard it, in that respect, just like your regular friendships. You don't totally lose your friends when you disagree or misunderstand. the relationship weathers it. so this relationship can, too. Ask her. don't assume you know what is going on. and don't not say something because of your fear. In a friendship you would speak up and say, something doesnt' feel right. what can I do? Don't keep silent here b/c of fear; that is deadly. This relationship is at least as important as your other friendships, so treat it as such. Just my :twocents:

#874



Thanks, I will do that, hopefully it's not too late.

[livius drusus]

So what actually happened to make you think she left you?

[Johnny Pneumatic]

So what actually happened to make you think she left you?

'Twas apparently a misunderstanding. We're still together.

[TomJoe]

So what actually happened to make you think she left you?

'Twas apparently a misunderstanding. We're still together.

An additional word of caution though, brought about through experience. Relax. Constantly fearing for the relationship isn't a good thing. If you're going to repeatedly worry about losing her, she'll eventually pick up on that and leave anyways. I'd rather be comfortable in a relationship and get dumped completely off guard and out of the blue, than knowing I forced the issue and brought it upon myself. People have a way of making true, their worst fears, subconsciously if need be. Don't fall into that trap.

Now you can tell me how wrong I am and how you're not going to listen to me. :P

[livius drusus]

'Twas apparently a misunderstanding. We're still together.
That doesn't answer my question. In fact, you've evaded everyone who's asked you the question. Oh well... Whatever.

[Johnny Pneumatic]

That doesn't answer my question. In fact, you've evaded everyone who's asked you the question. Oh well... Whatever.


She said something that I took to mean she wasn't interested in me anymore, but I misheard her. I still don't know what she really said, haven't asked her that yet. The power cut off just a few seconds after I heard it over the phone and so didn't ask her back what she meant. Does that answer your question?

[Johnny Pneumatic]

Well, I was wrong. We are broken up now. She got back with her ex- over the weekend. :( Yeah, it would be too much to ask for JP to have a lasting relationship. Happiness would be too much to ask. That's it..., I'm going to become that which I hate - a manipulative, amoral bastard. Nice guys finish last it seems. If I'm to be a moral relativistic nihilist, might as well enjoy the freedom from morality that this can entail. I don't know, maybe I shouldn't do that. I'm just so sad and angry. For the first time in....eight years or whatever I was starting to love someone again, and then she does this to me.

[fragment]

Sorry to hear it, JP. Love is a hard road, but it's better to keep travelling it than stop where you are and curl up in a ball forever. Having a rest can be necessary though...

I realise what you posted stems from your hurt & disappointment and isn't necessarily a real plan, but I must strongly advise against "becoming what you hate" - that sounds like just a way of hurting and hating yourself. I really doubt you'd get any enjoyment from becoming an amoral bastard in the long run.

Hang in there, things can get better...

[livius drusus]

You threatened to "become what you hate" when you complained about never having had a girfriend. Now you've had one, you had a good time while it lasted, it doesn't sound like she jerked you around particularly but just moved on and told you as much, so why revert to the childish I'm-going-to-eat-worms attitude?

I'm sorry you're hurting, but really, look back a couple of months when you had never kissed a girl or gone out on a date or in any way known the touch of a woman not your mother. You got what you so desperately craved. That it didn't last was pretty much a given from the beginning. On to round two.

[Johnny Pneumatic]

Sorry to hear it, JP. Love is a hard road, but it's better to keep travelling it than stop where you are and curl up in a ball forever. Having a rest can be necessary though...

I realise what you posted stems from your hurt & disappointment and isn't necessarily a real plan, but I must strongly advise against "becoming what you hate" - that sounds like just a way of hurting and hating yourself. I really doubt you'd get any enjoyment from becoming an amoral bastard in the long run.

Hang in there, things can get better...

I guess. - It can, I don't need or want one though. Now the long task on finding another person somewhat like me who *isn't taken already.....


Could be good advice. But I also know that one of my "friends" - not a true friend, really - is an amoral bastard and he has so much because of it. *If I were an amoral bastard I could just steal them away from who they're with.
Ugh, that's so terrible...


Yeah, it's what I hear.

[Johnny Pneumatic]

You threatened to "become what you hate" when you complained about never having had a girfriend. Now you've had one, you had a good time while it lasted, it doesn't sound like she jerked you around particularly but just moved on and told you as much, so why revert to the childish I'm-going-to-eat-worms attitude?

I'm sorry you're hurting, but really, look back a couple of months when you had never kissed a girl or gone out on a date or in any way known the touch of a woman not your mother. You got what you so desperately craved. That it didn't last was pretty much a given from the beginning. On to round two.

I had a somewhat good time. Actually she did - she'd put dates off that way she could hang out with one of her friends, which she could do on other days, making me miss out that week. We really didn't have that many dates - five. She'd also put me off so she could go see her ex-, or for whatever shit. I just put up with it because at least I was getting something, instead of nothing.
We didn't really kiss that much either. I should have been thinking cynically. I should have dumped her for all that.

'Tis true. - Actually, no, I didn't. If I had I might not be so sad. She wasted my time is how I see it now. - I didn't expect it to last forever, but more than a couple of months, and five dates? Yeah, I expected a bit more than that, and better treatment given the sacrifices I was making. - Yep. Now the great chore of finding another person who will even give me a chance.

At least I'm feeling a bit better now.

[livius drusus]

Just for the exercise value, why not try to describe this experience in positive terms? Same experiences, slightly different angle.

I'll get you started:

I had a good time. We went on five dates, which were good practice in making conversation and, most importantly, in figuring out what kinds of qualities are important to me: punctuality, reliability, a focus on only one potentially romantic relationship at a time.

[BDS]

Good advice, Livius.

The girl was not responsible for your expectations or desires, Johnny. She's not "wasting your time" if things don't work out precisely as you want them to. In fact, having precise expectations, you are bound to be disappointed, because nobody will ever be exactly what you think you want. Nor is she responsible for the sacrifices "you are making". You can make them, or not make them. It's up to you.

You pay your money and you take your chance. Nobody rolls seven every time.

[Johnny Pneumatic]

Just for the exercise value, why not try to describe this experience in positive terms? Same experiences, slightly different angle.

I'll get you started:

I had a good time. We went on five dates, which were good practice in making conversation and, most importantly, in figuring out what kinds of qualities are important to me: punctuality, reliability, a focus on only one potentially romantic relationship at a time.


Ok. That does make it seem a little better. Anyway, I already knew what qualities I value. Actually it wasn't the fact that she went with her ex- instead of going on a date with me, it's that she broke off our already semi-planned date to do so. It's not like she wasn't free during the week - on a day I had to work - to go and see him then. I wouldn't mind dating her even if she had strong feelings for her ex- at the same time. Open, poly relationships don't bother me. In fact, I think those are what I'm going to do for a long time. I'm not going to get tied down to one person and when they dump me I'm all alone again. It's that I was slighted that bothers me.

[Johnny Pneumatic]

The girl was not responsible for your expectations or desires, Johnny. She's not "wasting your time" if things don't work out precisely as you want them to. In fact, having precise expectations, you are bound to be disappointed, because nobody will ever be exactly what you think you want. Nor is she responsible for the sacrifices "you are making". You can make them, or not make them. It's up to you.

You pay your money and you take your chance. Nobody rolls seven every time.

Correct, she wasn't. I'm not referring to that. I'm referring to when she'd string me along for several weeks at a time. That's time wasting. My time. She could just tell me ahead of time, but didn't. I'm not asking for my dreams to be fulfilled, just some social courtesy. Correct, she wasn't. I made them of my own free will. I had to make them or there'd have been no good dates though. Hypothetical: If you took someone out to dinner - or whatever - and they were a jerk to you and/or another of your friends and you paid the jerk's way would you not be miffed that they couldn't show some courtesy for your effort? It was your freewill to take them out to dinner, but still, I have a point, don't I? She didn't do anything like this, of course, I'd have dumped her, but she slighted me at times, both on and off dates, given what I put out. Looking back I shouldn't have put up with it. I won't with the next person, I'll leave them. Of course I'm wrong/ at fault though, so never mind.

[ceptimus]

If you are the one to break the relationship, even if you suspect your partner is about to do the same, that doesn't make you a winner.

Breaking a relationship is something either party can do at any time, for any reason. The reason doesn't have to be logical or sensible. Anyone entering into a relationship has to understand this right at the outset - these are the rules of the game.

Feeling miserable when a relationship ends is normal, This is not a good reason to avoid future relationships - though it's a good idea not to rush into the next one, until the miserable feeling wears off a bit.

[maddog]

Fear of being alone. I hear you, JP.

For myself, I have concluded ultimately that I am alone. Even when I am with others. Even when I have a relationship. And that's not necessarily a bad thing. But I understand the fear and the pain.

{{{Johnny Pneumatic}}}

Some phoenixes arose out of the ashes for me.

My therapist told me, for instance, that I tend to attract that which I am ready for. When I evolve into a mentally more healthy person, the people I attract to me are consequently also healthier happier people. Oddly, that seems to be true. You've had some good experience now. What you attract next will be better.

I also had an "aha" or insight moment a while ago when watching Dr.Phil of all things. He said, "A relationship is not 50-50. It's 100-100." A nonsensical statement, really, but in other ways it helped me restore myself to balance, when I think I'm getting the short end of the stick in a relationship. A relationship is not arithmetic.

In terms of "god answers prayer," or "be careful what you wish for," Rev. Terry Cole-Whittaker used to say that the universe will give you what you desire. What you manifest, what your intentions are, the universe will support you in that, and will reflect that back to you. livius gave you an example: you could approach this experience positively or negatively. even you recognize that it feels better and seems better with the positive approach. You said, "Ok. That does make it seem a little better." then you added a little "but,..." Even that "but ..." can be a positive. You don't like to be slighted. that's information you can take to your next relationship. You can choose more wisely about the other person's qualities, and you can also choose more wisely about what you emphasize in yourself. "the best way to have a friend is to be a friend." similarly, the best way not to be slighted is (1) not to slight someone else, and (2) choose what you will emphasize in your feelings about it if it does happen. "no one can make you feel inferior without your consent." Same thing. Perhaps it's also true that no one can make you feel slighted without your consent.

Good luck Johnny. Sounds like a really interesting first experience. Keep on. Don't worry, be happy.

#913

[Johnny Pneumatic]

If you are the one to break the relationship, even if you suspect your partner is about to do the same, that doesn't make you a winner.

Breaking a relationship is something either party can do at any time, for any reason. The reason doesn't have to be logical or sensible. Anyone entering into a relationship has to understand this right at the outset - these are the rules of the game.

Feeling miserable when a relationship ends is normal, This is not a good reason to avoid future relationships - though it's a good idea not to rush into the next one, until the miserable feeling wears off a bit.

Can be true, but not necessarily. If you break a relationship with someone with something wrong with them - mentally wrong - say like the girl out of the movie 'Swimfan' or breaking a relationship off with an abusive boyfriend or husband would most certainly make them the winner, instead of a victim that just takes it up the ass.
When breaking relationships off with former friends I find it feels better to be the one doing it, than them me. Doesn't make me a winner, but feeling goodish instead of like tossed away garbage feels better.


Yeah. Nice rules they are, make one reticent to open up.


Yeah.

[TomJoe]

Ok. That does make it seem a little better. Anyway, I already knew what qualities I value. Actually it wasn't the fact that she went with her ex- instead of going on a date with me, it's that she broke off our already semi-planned date to do so. It's not like she wasn't free during the week - on a day I had to work - to go and see him then. I wouldn't mind dating her even if she had strong feelings for her ex- at the same time. Open, poly relationships don't bother me. In fact, I think those are what I'm going to do for a long time. I'm not going to get tied down to one person and when they dump me I'm all alone again. It's that I was slighted that bothers me.

You have every right to be bothered about it. You know your worth, and you value your time. You've been through the gauntlet once now, excellent. You've matured through the experience, you know what you can expect. You're still young Johnny, you have plenty of time. Learn from this, take from it what you can. Then move on. So you didn't get to dump her. So what? The end result is the same.

Hey, you got the first one out of the way. The first one is always the most difficult.

[BDS]

Correct, she wasn't. I'm not referring to that. I'm referring to when she'd string me along for several weeks at a time. That's time wasting. My time. She could just tell me ahead of time, but didn't. I'm not asking for my dreams to be fulfilled, just some social courtesy. Correct, she wasn't. I made them of my own free will. I had to make them or there'd have been no good dates though. Hypothetical: If you took someone out to dinner - or whatever - and they were a jerk to you and/or another of your friends and you paid the jerk's way would you not be miffed that they couldn't show some courtesy for your effort? It was your freewill to take them out to dinner, but still, I have a point, don't I? She didn't do anything like this, of course, I'd have dumped her, but she slighted me at times, both on and off dates, given what I put out. Looking back I shouldn't have put up with it. I won't with the next person, I'll leave them. Of course I'm wrong/ at fault though, so never mind.

Good point. I'll agree that someone who doesn't show up somewhere on time and as promised has wasted your time -- I didn't read your earlier posts carefully enough.

Also, I don't quite understand the "dumping" part. After five dates, no "dumping" is necessary (I think). Just don't go out any more. "Dumping" involves some sort of statement like, "I no longer want to keep the real or implied commitments I've made to you." It doesn't seem to me like you or she have made any such commitments that need be revoked.

[Shake]

Hey, you got the first one out of the way. The first one is always the most difficult.
Exactly. Sure, it hurts a lot. If it didn't, that would be a sign that you didn't care. Your time has not been wasted. You'll learn from this and later on you'll be able to apply what you've learned. If nothing else, it will make future breakups — yes, there will most likely be more, so expect them — easier to deal with.

Dating helps you learn about yourself as much as the ones you date. Don't beat yourself up over this, perhaps she wasn't ready to leave her ex yet. She may have some things to work out. There's also the possibility that sometime down the road she'll decide that going back to him wasn't the right thing. But I wouldn't necessarily hold out for this option if I were you.

And don't change to something you're not. Nobody likes a fake.

[pescifish]

:hug:
I'm sorry it didn't work out, Johnny Pneumatic, but I'm really glad you were able to have the fun you did. It's good that you know more what you will want in a relationship and I believe there will plenty more to come. Maybe when schools starts up again...

[Johnny Pneumatic]

:hug:
I'm sorry it didn't work out, Johnny Pneumatic, but I'm really glad you were able to have the fun you did. It's good that you know more what you will want in a relationship and I believe there will plenty more to come. Maybe when schools starts up again...


Yeah, plus I got a new friend out of it, can be glad about that with how vanishingly rare my friends are.
And being told I'm gorgeous, even after we've broken up, makes me feel pretty good. Wow, when did I become so shallow?

[ceptimus]

When breaking relationships off with former friends I find it feels better to be the one doing it, than them me. Doesn't make me a winner, but feeling goodish instead of like tossed away garbage feels better.
Have you actually ever done this? In my experience, both methods suck, though in different ways.

[Johnny Pneumatic]

Have you actually ever done this? In my experience, both methods suck, though in different ways.

Yes.

If your former friend mistreated you it might not feel like it sucks so much, save for actually loosing the friend, but when they mistreated you that's already happened anyway. I'd rather not go into what happened all those years ago with this, so please nobody out there ask me, you won't get a reply.

[Johnny Pneumatic]

Maybe when schools starts up again...

Ha, you are wrong - I've four interested in me already! Didn't take long at all.