Deadwood I

[trillian]

Morning town!

2 votes on me because I have been devious in past games? Do you really think I'm evil yet again? Though I may have been a bit drunk and beat up someone last night :punch: .

I'm still keeping my vote on JA. He is acting cocksuckery.

[Crumb]

What about JA makes you suspicious?

[wei yau]

Seems to me that the Pinkertons got lucky with Adam. I couldn't discern any tells that he was Bullock, but then again it was only the first day and he hadn't gotten a chance to deliver a beatdown.

It also seems that the TGG bandwagon never really got underway. I don't know him at all, but I've not seem him participate elsewhere. So, if the only thing going against him is lack of participation, it doesn't seem to be lynch-worthy. There's something to be said, by the late Smilin, for his absence being a detriment to the town. But, the odds are he is townie and I'm thinking we shouldn't lynch him. Let the Pinkertons "waste" a hit on a non-participating member. Keeping a non-participating townie around wouldn't hurt the town.

But, of course, the big "IF" is whether or not TGG is truly a townie.

As for my suspicions, as asked by Nightson. Well, I don't have many, but Nightson, your very questions seem a little suspicious. Either you're trying to get people to reveal they are Pinkerton or you're a Pinkerton trying to get a special to out themself.

But, if I'm gonna suspect people for asking questions, I'm gonna have to suspect our Mr. Crub.

I see that trillian's reputation has earned her some suspicion. It's a tricky situation. Play enough of these games and we'll all have been "evil" at one point or another. I figure that anyone who's good at being evil is dangerous, but their experience is valuable if they are a townie. That being said, I'm gonna review Joshua Adam's posts. He's apparently done something to earn a vote from trillian. I'm going to see if I can figure out just what that may be.

I know, I know, I've not yet committed to any one suspect. That's because there just isn't enough for me to go on.

[Joshua Adams]

wei, if it helps, trillian opined that my post #209 seemed "phony." I do not really have anything to say in response to that. :shrug:

[wei yau]

Now I ain't normally a prayin' man, but I do have on question for God.

Now that hooples and townies are one-in-the-same, just how many beatings can be administered during the night? Is it really three, as everyone surmises (1 from Bullock, 3-1 from original hooples)? Or could there have been more? That is, does each hoople and townie (total of 5, after Smilin got lynched) administer their own beating? Would a beatee get informed that they got beaten twice?

The answers to these questions might not reveal anything as evidence, but like Crumb and Joshua Adams, I got beat last night. Me. A simple Chinaman sleeping in a flea-infested tent, beat like a dog.

[wei yau]

wei, if it helps, trillian opined that my post #209 seemed "phony." I do not really have anything to say in response to that. :shrug:


For ease of reference, I give you the post, in its entirety


This doesn't look good... I thought maybe I'd finally see a game where all the good specials are alive on day 2. Right now I don't have much to go on. I'm still trying to interpret thegoldglove's behavior, and vm's antagonism towards Smilin makes me wonder a bit... but then again his points did seem rather valid at the time.

I got beaten up last night, goddamn ruffians. :glare:


Well, since I got a beating myself, I'm gonna discount your beating as an indication of guilt. Them hooples get damned rowdy and heaven help anyone they cross in the Thoroughfare.

I don't share your suspicion of TGG, he might just not have been online as of late (as I said in my earlier post). As for vm, I'll review, but I don't recall his posts being particularly antagonistic (barring the generous use of fuck, cocksucker and the like) towards Smilin. The odds were we would hang a townie on Day 1.

While I also voted for Smilin, I did so because of his erratic gameplay. It was too distracting for me.

[Crumb]

liv seemed to imply that after the death of the violent hoople a previously "respectable" hoople has now turned violent. I could be wrong.
That is, does each hoople and townie (total of 5, after Smilin got lynched) administer their own beating?
If you were a hoople wouldn't you know whether or not you were administering beatings? :chin:

[livius drusus]

The supply of violent hooples will continue to be replenished as necessary. Beatees would be informed if they were beaten twice.

That's all the info on beatings you're going to get.

[wei yau]

Thanks liv, very informative.

Now to send out a secret mind message for Joanie to fetch me some unguent for my bruises.

[trillian]

What about JA makes you suspicious?

I guess it is just a vibe I got when reading through that seemed different than the last game. He seems to be trying to do analysis without garnering any enemies by doing it. Playing both sides of the fence methinks!

I would miss the work he does with the vote tallies so I'm not averse to taking my vote off him for a day if a better choice comes up.

[wei yau]

liv seemed to imply that after the death of the violent hoople a previously "respectable" hoople has now turned violent. I could be wrong.
That is, does each hoople and townie (total of 5, after Smilin got lynched) administer their own beating?
If you were a hoople wouldn't you know whether or not you were administering beatings? :chin:

My question had more to do with how the townies got involved in the beatings. Both you and liv have sufficiently answered the question. I am making the distinction between hooples and townies.

[Joshua Adams]

Right now I don't have the grounds to come on very strongly. I have no desire to overstate the case against anyone and wind up leading everyone into a mistake. I blew it in Mafia 3 by getting NC Kev lynched instead of my other top suspects who were all actually scum.

I do have a few suspicions but it's just little vibes, nothing solid, I'd rather keep them to myself for the time being because people tend to modify their behavior if attention is called to it.

[wei yau]

Is TGG the only one to have not yet checked in "today"? I'm only around for about two more hours today. And mornings are rough for me at work, so I feel the Nightfall deadline breathing down my neck.

By my (admittedly sloppy) count, there are two votes for trillian (cast by vm and Crumb) and one vote for Joshua Adams (cast by trillian). I'm not convinced of either of them being Pinkerton. Instead, I am concerned by attempts to get information that might benefit Pinkertons and be of little use to the town.

So, vote: Crumb

[wei yau]

Right now I don't have the grounds to come on very strongly. I have no desire to overstate the case against anyone and wind up leading everyone into a mistake. I blew it in Mafia 3 by getting NC Kev lynched instead of my other top suspects who were all actually scum.

I do have a few suspicions but it's just little vibes, nothing solid, I'd rather keep them to myself for the time being because people tend to modify their behavior if attention is called to it.

So, is this a modification of your behavior now that trillian has called attention to it?

[Sock Puppet]

Ooh! Ka-zing!

You go, girl!
:cheer:

[Crumb]

My question had more to do with how the townies got involved in the beatings. Both you and liv have sufficiently answered the question. I am making the distinction between hooples and townies.
Ok. Let me rephrase. If you are a townie, wouldn't you know if you were now able to administer beatings? You seem to have asked your question as if you were not a townie. But since that leaves hoople and other pro-camp special roles it doesn't make you a Pinkerton.

So why are you voting for me?

[livius drusus]

http://www.freethought-forum.com/livius/tally.gif

~~ 7 votes needed to lynch ~~


CocksuckerX voted for :rarrow: CocksuckerY


Crumb :rarrow: trillian
viscousmemories :rarrow: trillian
thegoldglove07
Sock Puppet
MonCapitan2002
cappuccino
Leesifer
wei yau :rarrow: Crumb
Joshua Adams
Nightson :rarrow: thegoldglove07
godfry n. glad
trillian :rarrow: Joshua Adams


Smilin (hoople) - lynched, day 1
Adam (Bullock) - killed, night 1

Total votes for:

trillian - 2
thegoldglove07 - 1
Joshua Adams - 1
Crumb - 1

[wei yau]

You just answered your own question. Since not knowing townie behavior doesn't necessarily make me a Pinkerton, I was concerned that your question was an attempt to get a special to out.

Also, your defense of TGG was either ambivalent or deliberately written to be ambivalent. But, that's not that solid of a hunch because the two of you know each other outside of the FF, so that might one of the reasons for the ambivalence.

Granted, I may be overly suspicious, but all of you cocksuckers are untrustworthy right now.

[MonCapitan2002]

What about JA makes you suspicious?

I guess it is just a vibe I got when reading through that seemed different than the last game. He seems to be trying to do analysis without garnering any enemies by doing it. Playing both sides of the fence methinks!

I would miss the work he does with the vote tallies so I'm not averse to taking my vote off him for a day if a better choice comes up.
He just seems more cautious this time around. That does not necessarily indicate that he is scum. It just indicates that he is trying to be more careful in how he pins guilt and suspicion on others.

[Leesifer]

What about JA makes you suspicious?

I guess it is just a vibe I got when reading through that seemed different than the last game. He seems to be trying to do analysis without garnering any enemies by doing it. Playing both sides of the fence methinks!

I would miss the work he does with the vote tallies so I'm not averse to taking my vote off him for a day if a better choice comes up.

I agree!

vote: Joshua Adams

[Nightson]

Mafia? What's a mafia? Ya talking about Pinkertons, sir?


Fucking cocksucker, you bet your ass I was. Or as Sock put it, WWPD?

[Nightson]

I assume I was left off your list, Nightson, due to my suspicion of wei and capp?

No, you were left off because I wanted to see how you would react to being left off. The assumptiion told be alot.

[wei yau]

Er, Lees...well, first things first....:gromp:

Now, onto bidness. Do you mean that you agree with trillian's "vibe" of JA or with her allowance that it might be better to keep him for his vote counting analysis?

I'm assuing the former, since you voted to lynch the cocksucker. But, frankly, it was trillian's caveat that kept me from voting for him. Although, he's still on my radar.

[Crumb]

Also, your defense of TGG was either ambivalent or deliberately written to be ambivalent. But, that's not that solid of a hunch because the two of you know each other outside of the FF, so that might one of the reasons for the ambivalence.
I was ambivaletn because I was affraid to over state my defense. I am pretty sure he is away for a valid reason and not playing via email. Defending another player though is often seen as quite a tell, which is why I backed away from my defense. Vote for him if you want. I don't think he is a Pinkerton though.

So Leesifer, do you have a better reason to vote for JA other than a "vibe"?

[Crumb]

Has JA posted any vote information this game? I haven't seen any, I don't think. :scratch:

[wei yau]

I don't think he has in this game, but he's certainly done so in prevous games. Possibly another modification in behavior?

Crumb, I understand what you're saying about your defense of TGG. Frankly, I don't think he's Pinkerton either, just away from the Internet. As such, I can't honestly see your defense of him as a defense of a fellow Pinkerton.

But, I'm just not 100% certain about that...hell, I'd accept 60% certain, but I just don't have anything to go on.

[Leesifer]

No, you were left off because I wanted to see how you would react to being left off. The assumptiion told be alot.

:think: That sounds a bit fishy to me Nightson.

Now, onto bidness. Do you mean that you agree with trillian's "vibe" of JA or with her allowance that it might be better to keep him for his vote counting analysis?

I'm assuing the former, since you voted to lynch the cocksucker. But, frankly, it was trillian's caveat that kept me from voting for him. Although, he's still on my radar.

Right on the first count, wei.

So Leesifer, do you have a better reason to vote for JA other than a "vibe"?

Not really, Crumb.

Although now, I'm itchin' towards that Nightson cocksucker due to his reason for leavin' me off the list.

[Nightson]

Let the Pinkertons "waste" a hit on a non-participating member. Keeping a non-participating townie around wouldn't hurt the town.

Why would they do that? Keeping him if he doesn't participate will indeed hurt the town in the endgame.

As for my suspicions, as asked by Nightson. Well, I don't have many, but Nightson, your very questions seem a little suspicious. Either you're trying to get people to reveal they are Pinkerton or you're a Pinkerton trying to get a special to out themselves.

Questions equal discussion, and discussion is drastically needed in a deadlined game like this. The questions won't reveal specials. The have a tiny chance of revealing Pinkertons.

[Nightson]

No, you were left off because I wanted to see how you would react to being left off. The assumptiion told be alot.

:think: That sounds a bit fishy to me Nightson.



Not even curious what it told? I'm about 80% sure your town. Pinkertons/mafia either celebrate the fact that they didn't get asked a question and don't mention it, or they point out they're not on the list and ask for a question in order to blend in with the town better.

You got picked because I was pretty much picking people at random and you were the last one. :P

[wei yau]

Let the Pinkertons "waste" a hit on a non-participating member. Keeping a non-participating townie around wouldn't hurt the town.

Why would they do that? Keeping him if he doesn't participate will indeed hurt the town in the endgame.

True, but we're not at the endgame. I'm willing to given allowances that TGG is unable to participate simply because he's not online for now. I think it'd be a shame to lynch a non-participant who hasn't even logged onto the FF lately.

Now, someone who's been quiet, but active in other parts of the FF, that'd be suspicious.

I guess I'm simply saying that TGG lack of participation isn't a Pinkerton tell for me.

As you say, I don't think the Pinkertons will kill TGG anytime soon, but I just don't feel that we should do their dirty work for them today.

Questions equal discussion, and discussion is drastically needed in a deadlined game like this. The questions won't reveal specials. The have a tiny chance of revealing Pinkertons.

As you can see from my posts following the one you quoted, I have developed an appreciation for the discussion your questions have engendered. My suspicious nature makes me think questions can lead to reveals of specials, but it might be too soon for that.

[Leesifer]

Nightson: :glomp:

I did assume it was 'cause I'd poked wei and capp. Therefore you weren't trying to draw me out. Then I felt a bit left out.
You got picked because I was pretty much picking people at random and you were the last one
Cocksucker! You didn't mention me at all!

unvote

Vote: Nightson

[Crumb]

He picked you to be left out, Lees.

[Nightson]

He picked you to be left out, Lees.

Exactly, you were the only one I chose for that honor. :yup:

[Leesifer]

:narrow:

Goddamn you all to hell.

unvote

[Sock Puppet]

Well, piss up a rope. I've been reading back, trying to make the barest pretext of a case for hanging any of you cocksuckers, and there's barely enough evidence to prosecute a violation of the spitting ordinance.

I thought I had something with vm, with his picking an almost clichéd "townie" strategy of lynching the erratic player. I figured, since such had been discussed at length recently, it was an easy enough thing to give up if he were scum. But I can find nothing to undermine the townieness (hooplishness? hooplism? hooplescence?) of his play.

I'm not sure what to make of Nightson's mafia midterm essay questions. I agree we need more discussion, since we've got so little to go on, but they could be a way to steer the discussion, as well.

[Joshua Adams]

So, is this a modification of your behavior now that trillian has called attention to it?Well, no, I don't think so. Trillian described my behavior as "trying not to make any enemies" (probably in response to my expressing a slight suspicion of vm and tgg, all the while refraining from committing to it completely). The post you quoted functions more as an explanation of that behavior than a reversal of it.

The rest of my thoughts are just vibes based on how people are acting in general. I didn't mean to say that changing your behavior is evidence of guilt, it's just a psychological reaction to being under scrutiny.

As for the vote records, I generally don't post them unless someone asks for them directly or otherwise expresses that they are analyzing vote patterns, in which case the records would be useful. Do you want the them?

[thegoldglove07]

I was away from the computer for the weekend. I'm back and ready to play. I apologize.

[Leesifer]

I'm having big problems even getting :ff: to load at the moment.

[thegoldglove07]

I have read the previous pages and I now have my ideas. Crumb was correct. I was away from the internet. Laying low is something I shall not do.

I agree, you must have had suspicions of me. I wasn't trying to glide through and read the posts, I was simply gone and I see that most of you noticed this. My gameplan is still the same and it hasn't changed but I can see who my next vote is going to.

[godfry n. glad]

So, is this a modification of your behavior now that trillian has called attention to it?Well, no, I don't think so. Trillian described my behavior as "trying not to make any enemies" (probably in response to my expressing a slight suspicion of vm and tgg, all the while refraining from committing to it completely). The post you quoted functions more as an explanation of that behavior than a reversal of it.

The rest of my thoughts are just vibes based on how people are acting in general. I didn't mean to say that changing your behavior is evidence of guilt, it's just a psychological reaction to being under scrutiny.

As for the vote records, I generally don't post them unless someone asks for them directly or otherwise expresses that they are analyzing vote patterns, in which case the records would be useful. Do you want the them?

You bet yer mutherfuckin' ass I want them. You got evidence, show it.

[Crumb]

but I can see who my next vote is going to.
Care to enlighten us?

[thegoldglove07]

but I can see who my next vote is going to.
Care to enlighten us?

Vote: Godfry Him suddenly wanting to see the vote records make me feel he is trying to hide something. Trying to find the person that is the most threatening and he is trying to take them down.

[Joshua Adams]

I haven't been able to connect to ff in hours. Here is the history which I hope is correct.


Day 1:

Adam....................MonCapitan2002(18), unvote(35)
cappuccino..............thegoldglove07(9), Crumb(24), unvote(33), Smilin(39)
Crumb...................Sock Puppet(2), trillian(13), unvote(14), viscousmemories(16), Smilin(30)
godfry n. glad..........thegoldglove07(11)
Joshua Adams............viscousmemories(6), MonCapitan2002(28)
Leesifer................cappuccino(29)
MonCapitan2002..........beyelzu(12), unvote(26), Crumb(27)
Nightson................godfry n. glad(25), Smilin(38)
Smilin..................viscousmemories(4), Crumb(31), unvote(32), godfry n. glad(34), thegoldglove07(36)
Sock Puppet.............Crumb(3), wei yau(22)
thegoldglove07..........cappuccino(10), Smilin(37)
trillian................MonCapitan2002(8)
viscousmemories.........Joshua Adams(1), unvote(7), Crumb(15), unvote(20), Smilin(21)
wei yau.................godfry n. glad(5), Adam(17), unvote(19), Smilin(23)

Day 2:

cappuccino
Crumb...................trillian(7)
godfry n. glad..........thegoldglove07(2), unvote(8)
Joshua Adams............thegoldglove07(4), unvote(9)
Leesifer................Joshua Adams(11), Nightson(12), unvote(13)
MonCapitan2002
Nightson................thegoldglove07(3)
Sock Puppet
thegoldglove07..........godfry n. glad(14)
trillian................Joshua Adams(1)
viscousmemories.........thegoldglove07(5), trillian(6)
wei yau.................Crumb(10)


Not sure how useful it is until we have a confirmed Pinkerton, but analyze away.

[thegoldglove07]

Thank you, JA.

[Sock Puppet]

By the way, tgg, if godfry were a woman, he'd be traveling with a circus someplace.

I haven't been able to get on the site for 3 hours, and now I have to leave. I'll get a vote in for somebody by early tomorrow morning.

[thegoldglove07]

Damn, I always do that. I know Godfry is a male, I just always think of a female when I hear Godfry.

[Crumb]

Godfry seems very sincere to me TGG. Analyzing the voting records is a good way to find someone to vote for.

Thanks JA for posting what you have. I think information is good for the camp.

[godfry n. glad]

vote: trillian

'Cuse me. TGG? Wanting to look at evidence is some kind of crime? I'll keep that in mind, greenhorn. I'll ignore your stupidity for the time being and see if you come to your senses. Go on out there and sees if'n you can get my mule to fuckin' kick you in the head. It'd probly do you some good, cocksucker. Greenhorns are getting a bye this time around, thanks to the discussion and the posting of the voting records.

I'd like to hear from that Frenchie, too...Where is that gallic jackass? He's on my suspect list, le cock sucquer.

How long 'til sundown?

[Crumb]

Damn, I always do that. I know Godfry is a male, I just always think of a female when I hear Godfry.
You know a female named godfry? Poor girl...

ETA: Oh and just 'cause godfry is male doesn't mean he does not belong in a freak show.

[godfry n. glad]

http://www.freethought-forum.com/forum/gallery/files/7/0/IMGP0269.JPG

[Crumb]

I rest my case.

[Crumb]

I do think that Utter should out himself today if he used his view last night. If he did not use his view last night he should use it tonight and out tomorrow.

[livius drusus]

Utter only gets a view after Bullock is killed.

[godfry n. glad]

And we've had only one night.

As I understand it, Utter has Bullock's look and has his coming up tonight.

tomorrow is when Utter should out with what he knows.

On with today, cocksuckers! Everybody's gotta work their claim.

[Crumb]

Ah got it. I was thinking Utter had a night to view. :dopey: I guess it is only day two.

[trillian]

Godfry....care to explain that vote for me? It seems you have forgotten to provide any explanation whatsoever.
Since you are already on my suspicious list, this vote just moved you up a notch.

[livius drusus]

http://www.freethought-forum.com/livius/tally.gif

~~ 7 votes needed to lynch ~~


CocksuckerX voted for :rarrow: CocksuckerY


Crumb :rarrow: trillian
viscousmemories :rarrow: trillian
thegoldglove07 :rarrow: godfry n. glad
Sock Puppet
MonCapitan2002
cappuccino
Leesifer
wei yau :rarrow: Crumb
Joshua Adams
Nightson :rarrow: thegoldglove07
godfry n. glad :rarrow: trillian
trillian :rarrow: Joshua Adams


Smilin (hoople) - lynched, day 1
Adam (Bullock) - killed, night 1

Total votes for:

trillian - 3
thegoldglove07 - 1
Joshua Adams - 1
Crumb - 1
godfry n. glad - 1

[godfry n. glad]

Godfry....care to explain that vote for me? It seems you have forgotten to provide any explanation whatsoever.
Since you are already on my suspicious list, this vote just moved you up a notch.

Jes' fishin'

unvote

[Nightson]

Godfry, why shouldn't we lynch you?

[MonCapitan2002]

What has he done that makes you think he is scum? I am willing to listen to what you have to say about him. As for me, I am going to vote for trillian seeing as how she was scum in the last game.

Vote: trillian

[godfry n. glad]

Godfry, why shouldn't we lynch you?

Because I'm just as much a hoople as any cocksucker standing around here.

So...I got a big mouth. What are you gonna make of it Nightson, ya bastard? Why shouldn't we string you up?

[MonCapitan2002]

I notice that while you are being belligerant towards Nightson, your vote is on trillian.

[Crumb]

I know you are playing a hooplehead godfry, but if you aren't a baddie I'd tone it down.

Nightson: I don't know how someone is suppose to answer a question like that. Would you expect different answers from Pinkertons?

[trillian]

I notice that while you are being belligerant towards Nightson, your vote is on trillian.

Actually he unvoted. But I do notice that your vote for me has nothing to do with the game we are now playing. Have you nothing better to go on after a few days wandering Deadwood? That is seriously lame.

[Crumb]

Yeah that is lame gameplay, MonCap. I'll unvote: trillian for now.

[trillian]

I didn't realize that our deputy Utter actually got the view from last night--nice. The only way to ensure that we get the second identity would be for him to out himself now and get protected from our still living and breathing Doc Cochran.

If he stays silent, there is the chance that we lose him in the night to either a Pinkerton or the Vigilante. So why didn't he come out yet? Did I miss something?

[MonCapitan2002]

I notice that while you are being belligerant towards Nightson, your vote is on trillian.

Actually he unvoted. But I do notice that your vote for me has nothing to do with the game we are now playing. Have you nothing better to go on after a few days wandering Deadwood? That is seriously lame.
You are indeed right. I was being an ass. I should not vote for you based on your actions on an earlier game.

Unvote

The problem is that I have no clue who could be cocksucking scum. Godfrey might be a candidate considering how he is employing a much lower profile, but that could have to do with how he got burned last time.

[Nightson]

Godfry, why shouldn't we lynch you?

Because I'm just as much a hoople as any cocksucker standing around here.

So...I got a big mouth. What are you gonna make of it Nightson, ya bastard? Why shouldn't we string you up?

Ohh the exact same reason.

>.>


<.<



Nobody is giving any scum tells! *weeps softly*

Except maybe capp, he might be a Pinkerton. We'll see.

[Nightson]

1. Feel free to ask me questions too.

2. Sock, MonCap, capp, Lees. and JA who should get lynched?

3. vote: capp Everybody vote capp. Reasons are not required.



Also, Utter should contact swearnagen tonight, to insure that the person he plans to view and the one that Bullock viewed don't get vig killed.

[MonCapitan2002]

The only person I can think of who might warrant closer scrutiny is Crumb. He has posted a such a great volume of posts thatI wonder if he is posting so frequently to make it too much of a chore to track his behavior. If you had to wade through 60 or so of his posts would you be willing to do so?

[Joshua Adams]

Sock, MonCap, capp, Lees. and JA who should get lynched?
The Pinkertons. But seriously, I can't get a firm read on anybody right now. I have a feeling that on day 3 there will be more information to go on, because identities of a few more people will be revealed and we can analyze their interactions.


Does the day end in a few hours? It's 7:30 now, I have class from 8:00 until 11:30 and then from 12:30 until 4:00.

[Joshua Adams]

Alright guys. After reading a few posts I've come to a decision...

I'm Charlie Utter. Thanks to our wonderful sheriff Bullock we know that viscousmemories is a Pinkerton cocksucker. The reason I sounded "phony" is because I didn't want to come on too strongly, get vm killed, and then be murdered out of revenge tonight. But since I'm outing myself now, on the suggestion of a few, I can be protected by Doc.

I will contact Swearengen tonight with the identity of my target, since Adam never did so. If I do not out them in the thread tomorrow that means they were a good special.

vote: viscousmemories

[livius drusus]

Does the day end in a few hours?

The day ends at noon.

[cappuccino]

Ugh, the internet gods haven't been kind to me lately. Everything's been loading so slowly including FF which takes forever to display the thread. But I'm finally caught up for the time being.

Nightson, why you voting for me? You haven't given any reason whatsoever. Awfully suspicious, or shall I say, very Pinkertonish of you.

Actually right now I'm wondering about two certain players, based on what they've said. I'm going back and rereading their posts, albeit as fast as my connection allows me.

[livius drusus]

http://www.freethought-forum.com/livius/tally.gif

~~ 7 votes needed to lynch ~~


CocksuckerX voted for :rarrow: CocksuckerY


Crumb
viscousmemories :rarrow: trillian
thegoldglove07 :rarrow: godfry n. glad
Sock Puppet
MonCapitan2002
cappuccino
Leesifer
wei yau :rarrow: Crumb
Joshua Adams :rarrow: viscousmemories
Nightson :rarrow: cappuccino
godfry n. glad
trillian :rarrow: Joshua Adams


Smilin (hoople) - lynched, day 1
Adam (Bullock) - killed, night 1

Total votes for:

trillian - 1
Joshua Adams - 1
Crumb - 1
godfry n. glad - 1
cappuccino - 1
viscousmemories 1

[livius drusus]

http://www.freethought-forum.com/livius/god.gif

Right. We are two hours from nightfall and the tally is fucking embarassing.

The moment permits interest in one thing and one thing only: are you, the people of Deadwood, to be more than just a target for ass-fucking? Stop grabbing ankle and get fucking busy, hoopleheads.

[wei yau]

Well, given Joshua Adams' reveal, it seems foolish of me to keep my vote on Crumb. And with the clock ticking away, I suppose the town has nothing to lose by voting for vm. Unless another "Charlie Utter" comes to the fore, I feel that I have to take Joshua at his word.

I can't believe no one else in the town has reacted to Joshua's revelation. It makes me second guess my own reaction now. I've no reason to believe that Joshua is lying, but since no one else has reacted, I'm wondering if I might be missing some information.

I'll keep a close eye for the next hour or so, but for now unvote

[godfry n. glad]

vote: viscousmemories

That's good enough for me.

[cappuccino]

Shit, I totally missed Joshua's reveal. Since we've got nothing to lose by voting for vm...

vote: viscousmemories

[trillian]

VM was on my list from day 1 so I have no trouble believing JA (even though he acted suspicious too!)

unvote; vote: viscousmemories

capp totally missed the revelation (or did he?) and wei yau is acting conservative for not really any good reason.

eta: OK, so Capp really did just miss it.

[Sock Puppet]

I just now got here. I had some tentative suspicions of vm already, I just didn't think I had enough to make a case to lynch him. I don't see the upside of JA faking a reveal at this point in the game if he were scum, so I'm going to trust him here.

vote: viscousmemories

... and dammit, I've been trying to post this for 10-15 minutes.

[cappuccino]

yeah, I did, sorry about that. It took 15 minutes to load this thread so I was skimming, and then I went back to look at specific players which also took forever to load their post history pages. In addition I was also multitasking with personal errands and work, trying to get as much done with this fucked up connection. So I completely overlooked Joshua's post.

[wei yau]

Well, alright then. Apparently, I had nothing to worry about, you just all had better things to do than read JA's post.

vote: viscousmemories

[viscousmemories]

Well I can't say I blame y'all for accepting Joshua's accusation; as trillian says you don't really have anything to lose (but a helpful hoople). But since I know I'm fuckin' innocent I can't imagine what game he's playing. Cappuccino, on the other hand, would have to be face down in a bucket of hooch to have missed the accusation, so if he's not in on Joshua's game he's runnin' one of his own.

So not that I'll live to see this tree bear fruit, but I'll plant it anyway.

vote: cappuccino

[Sock Puppet]

Well, alright then. Apparently, I had nothing to worry about, you just all had better things to do than read JA's post.
Like drag my fleabag burro up off the ground and get my tired ass into town. It's only seven fucking thirty here in the real Gold Country, Virginny boy.

[godfry n. glad]

Well, it seems that if that's the case, vm, then the next cocksucker to swing is the false accuser. That means that, regardless, Joshua would swing. That's a pretty big gamble, I'd say. That would be pretty ballsy play for a scuzbucket Pinkerton mutherfucker.

[wei yau]

Sock is one ornery cockscuker in the morning. I recommend you have some coffee and a stiff shot before you open your mouth again. That kinda talk can get a man killed.

I suppose I was overly conservative or cautious as per trillian, but the fact that NO ONE responded to a weighty revelation threw me off. Hell, y'all needed for me to point you in that direction to even respond.

[Sock Puppet]

Sock is one ornery cockscuker in the morning. I recommend you have some coffee and a stiff shot before you open your mouth again. That kinda talk can get a man killed.
Sorry, was I s'posed to call you Mister Northern Virginny Boy? And what's with the death threat, speakin' of ornery cocksuckers? Sounds like an odd overreaction to a little piss-talk.

[wei yau]

Not so much a death threat, but more of an observation on the fragrant quality of your outhouse breath.

[Sock Puppet]

BTW, that's 6 for vm if I read it right. It'd be nice if bey said his piece before Nightfall, if he gets here in time (cf. the Peanut Gallery, and subject to livian proclamation that he's a player again).

[Crumb]

Vote:vm

I hope you are not lying, JA. I doubt a Pink would at this point.

Regarding why I didn't respond until now is because it is only 8am here now.

Regarding my 60+ posts here, have you seen the other two mafia game I played?

[Sock Puppet]

Well, it seems that if that's the case, vm, then the next cocksucker to swing is the false accuser. That means that, regardless, Joshua would swing. That's a pretty big gamble, I'd say. That would be pretty ballsy play for a scuzbucket Pinkerton mutherfucker.
Exactly. A one-for-one trade just isn't favorable to the Pinkerton scum at this point in the game, and I don't see what else they would get out of it, unless maybe JA was sure he'd be targetted by Swearingen tonight. But I don't see how he would know.

EDIT - Well, fuck, that's Nightfall, I think.

[wei yau]

Crumb, I'm convinced that JA isn't lying. There's very little gain. He'd be an automatic deadman the next day. And it's not like we were even close to lynching anyone before his reveal.

[livius drusus]

The sun is high in the sky again, and the gibbet creaks and moans to be put to some goddamn use.

The Pinkertons daring to kill Deadwood's very own sheriff under cover of darkness, experience suggests you'd not be wrong to think the hooples would wrap a rope around the nearest neck and pull tight. Maybe it's the liquor in need of less watering, or Wu's dope being from a feeble batch, but whatever is at the root of it, the hooples seem downright cautious for a while there.

As swinging time fast approaches, they rally, and this time it's viscousmemories being pointed at.

That's how it starts anyway. After the pointing comes the muttering, after that the rumbling comes, and then, finally, the demands to see his neck doubled in length after that.

They wrap the rope around his neck before he even gets to the scaffold stairs, but not before he gets a chance to point the accusatory finger at cappuccino.

"That you cocksuckers won't believe me now don't make me no neverfuckingmind. Fuck all y'all anydamnway."

The hooples pulling the rope don't take too kindly to that kind of talk, so they stop pulling him up the scaffold by the rope and start pulling him by the balls instead.

"Fuck all y'all? How you going to fuck us without balls, cocksucker?"

The hooples are into it now, stringing him up good and hard, yanking on his tortured balls everytime they get a taste to hear him scream, a taste they get pretty fucking often.

The drop when it comes is nothing but a relief.

viscousmemories, the Pinkerton motherfucker, is dead.

http://www.freethought-forum.com/livius/nightfall.gif

[livius drusus]

http://www.freethought-forum.com/livius/pioneer.gif

http://www.freethought-forum.com/livius/n.gifNighttime yet again strikes Deadwood with deadly fists of iron, powder and steal. The devastation wreaked on our beloved town last night was even more agonizing, if such comparisons of loss can ever be honestly made, than the previous.

Not only have a variety of people been thrashed for reasons known only to the mysterious perpetrators, but much more severely, in the dark of the moonless night, an unknown assassin wielding what witnesses who came across the grisly scene after the fact describe as "a knife the size of Paul Bunyan's cock" assaulted godfry n. glad as he staggered out behind Nutall's #10 to head the call of nature.

Whether that call was of a micturating or emetic variety we can only speculate, but whatever task it was complex enough to perform in his inebriated state that the attack took him entirely by surprise. The lake of blood in which he was found was as quiescent as a pond on a windless day.

godfry n. glad, aka Calamity Jane, the half-male fall-down drunk who nursed so many during the plague, has been brutally murdered before having a chance to save us again.

Unfortunately that is not the end of last night's misfortunes. Another fellow traveller was dispatched to the great beyond by a person or persons unknown.

trillian's dead body was found in her room by Mr. Shaughnessy, who entered her room pursuing a small matter of back rent owed him by the victim, shot through the heart.

The worst that could be said of her in life was that an excessive appreciation for the drink led on occasion to unseemly outbursts of violence, craps, and sundry other depravities, no better or worse than any other hoople of our acquaintance.

The motivation for this heinous act too is murky beyond our meager abilities to elucidate, buffeted as we are by the large and terrifying events of our times.


http://www.freethought-forum.com/livius/daybreak.gif

[MonCapitan2002]

Damn! We lost the nurse. :( At least the doc is still with us.

[cappuccino]

Wow, there goes the two top suspects on my list. At least that saves me the effort of collecting evidence on them.

That's too bad for godfry but at least the doc is still among us. It's a bit puzzling about vm's very transparent attempt with his vote for me. It's rather a weak strategy for a Pinkerton.

liv, a bit of clarification needed, is trillian just a regular hoople or one of the hooples with beating privileges? Or we not allowed to know that?

[Joshua Adams]

Couple of things:

Swearengen didn't kill anyone on the first night. In case you were wondering.

To the person who beat me up the first night: A little birdy told me I'd engaged in a bit of turnabout. I investigated you and will corroborate any claims to innocence if you so desire. If you'd prefer not to be murdered soon, I suppose I'll respect that. Let me know.

Two of my top suspects turned out to be wrong (godfry was the other), so now I need to rethink them in what may be my brief time remaining with you all. Let me hang back and see what develops.

edit: trillian was the Pinkerton hit, since Swearengen told me who Dan was going to kill. That might help analysis, or maybe not.

[Crumb]

I was beaten last night, hooplehead bastards! :shakefist: Two nights in Deadwood and two beatings. Rough fuckin' town!

[Nightson]

I got beat up too. Someone must not have liked me.

[Crumb]

They were probably just drunk.

[thegoldglove07]

Drunken bastards. Beating up everyone in town. I fear someone....

[MonCapitan2002]

I got beat up myself last night. Would it be wrong of me to say that I enjoyed it?

[Nightson]

So current standing is 8 town and 2 Pinkertons. Lynch today will likely leave us at 7 town and 2 Pinks. Nightkills have a strong possibility of taking it down to 5 to 2. At that point, their odds of avoiding a lynch become much worse so lets say we get one then, it'll be 5 to 1. Night kill leave it at 4 to 1 (3 to 1 is a much worse number for town, so we'll assume the vig doesn't kill). After this the town has two lynches to try and get things right (and potentially a final vig kill if the vig isn't dead by this point). The chances really, really, favor the town.

Basically, we win as long as we kill a Pink ( :whup: ) in the next two days. When I log on later today, I'll reread the thread and place a vote.

[MonCapitan2002]

There are only nine people left. Here is a list of the dead.

Smilin (Lynched)
Adam (Murdered)
VM (Lynched, the fucker got what he deserved)
godfrey (Murdered)
trillian (Murdered)

Since we started with 14, there are nine left. Seven are hooples and two are Pinkerton scum. While we have an edge over the Pinkerton scum, things are still too early to call. We must not become overconfident.

[beyelzu]

i vote cappucino, cuz vm voted for him. now it seems like a vm pinkerton move to do. thoughtful and all. we have to wonder why he did it. it does clear capp to some degree and the wifom tells me to vote for him. and if capp is innocent which is probably likely then he wont be a distraction later. anyway thats my vote right now.

im not getting much of a read on capp in general ill need to reread the thread.

as an aside. there are 7-2 one has been cleared by utter, we know who utter is and if the vigi steps forward we will know 3 innocent people.

making the pool of suspects only six. hmmm.

something to think about. contrariwise, utter dies tonight probably and i assume dan wont be sent after that innocent. so that might be the better way to play it.

i just worry though if utter and swearengen both die over the next two days, not having a declared innocent, hurts our chances.

[beyelzu]

I was beaten last night, hooplehead bastards! :shakefist: Two nights in Deadwood and two beatings. Rough fuckin' town!
interesting, pinkerton?

you only been in camp for two night hmmm???

just kidding. i dont actually think its that much of a tell. damn poor choice of words though.

[livius drusus]

http://www.freethought-forum.com/livius/tally.gif

~~ 5 votes needed to lynch ~~


CocksuckerX voted for :rarrow: CocksuckerY


Crumb
thegoldglove07
Sock Puppet
MonCapitan2002
cappuccino
beyelzu :rarrow: cappuccino
wei yau
Joshua Adams
Nightson


Smilin (hoople) - lynched, day 1
Adam (Bullock) - killed, night 1
viscousmemories (Pinkerton) - lynched, day 2
godfry n. glad (Calamity Jane) - killed, night 2
trillian (hoople) - killed, night 2

Total votes for:

cappuccino - 1

[beyelzu]

cap never really listed anyone as a suspect. and now he says his top two suspects are dead, i think that maybe he is just leary of posting suspects after tomjoe noticed that he was just spreading the shit around. so i feel pretty decent about my capp vote currently.

as an aside right now i think the two pinkerton cocksuckers are capp and thegoldglove, i think capp threw that singular vote on tgg so later they would have distance.

anyway, thats what im thinking currently.

[livius drusus]

TomJoe? :confused:

[beyelzu]

previous game, tomjoe listed it as his reason for investigating capp, i think capp is thus leary of spreading too much shit around although he does strike me as hearstesque at the moment.

[Joshua Adams]

For all of day two, I kept a close eye on vm's interactions with others, and formed some speculations based on who he voted for, who he left alone, etc.

We know he voted for me, Smilin, and trillian, who all are of course innocent. He also voted for Crumb and thegoldglove07 so based upon that they seem preliminarily innocent too. He voted for capp once he knew he was fucked, so that falls into a different category. I resisted outing vm for most of the day so he wouldn't change his behavior, but I'm not convinced he did.

I had assumed MonCapitan2002 beat me up night 1, but that turns out to be false. I don't have much of a read on beyelzu or Sock Puppet. wei and Nightson seem innocent to me, based on things they've said, but I could be wrong.

bey, why are you voting for capp if he's probably innocent, as you said?

Edit: Actually, I wonder about wei. In his exchange with Crumb, he made it clear he had some kind of role, claiming it to be a helpful town role... why didn't the Pinkertons kill him?

[wei yau]

A shame to lose godfry, as well as trillian. To be honest, I had my suspicions about both of them, but then again I have my suspicions about everyone save myself and Joshua Adams.

To the person who beat me up the first night: A little birdy told me I'd engaged in a bit of turnabout. I investigated you and will corroborate any claims to innocence if you so desire. If you'd prefer not to be murdered soon, I suppose I'll respect that. Let me know.

Well, I didn't get beat last night. It looks like Crumb and Nightson got beat. And I'm assuming that one of them was beat by Joshua. I'm not sure how Joshua knows who beat on him on the first night. When I got beat on the first night, I wasn't told the identity of the culprit.

[cappuccino]

Well bey, the reason why I haven't really been listing any suspects was because I noticed odd behavior from trillian and godfry so I didn't want to tip them off by posting my suspicions about them. Also I didn't have much else to go on considering it was early in the game. So in my opinion, it's better to keep the suspects(which pretty much is everybody in this game) to yourself during the early phase and observe rather than posting every single thought you have. :shrug:

[Joshua Adams]

I'm not sure how Joshua knows who beat on him on the first night. When I got beat on the first night, I wasn't told the identity of the culprit.I investigated the person who beat me up, and liv's way of informing me that he was a hooplehead was to mention that he'd beaten me up on the first night. I asked her if it was okay to say that, and she was alright with it. I wasn't told who it was initially, either.

[wei yau]

Thanks for the clarification, Joshua.

As to why the Pinkertons didn't kill me, I have no blessed idea. The Pinkertons are behaving oddly this game, so I can't even hazard any guesses on their reasoning. Maybe if they eased up on the whiskey, they'd be more clear-headed.

[Sock Puppet]

I don't have much of a read on beyelzu or Sock Puppet.I haven't been beaten either last night or the night before. So I'm obviously not the one cleared, but on the bright side, I won't have to decide whether to give myself up to the Pinkertons as a means of limiting the suspect pool. But I was the one who poked at vm's cover by pointing out how easy it would be for a Pinkerton to adopt his "let's lynch the erratic player" strategy, as a means of appearing innocent.

Edit: Actually, I wonder about wei. In his exchange with Crumb, he made it clear he had some kind of role, claiming it to be a helpful town role... why didn't the Pinkertons kill him?I just reviewed wei's posts, and I still didn't find this. Maybe I'm just too hung over again. I also, by the way, don't see anything in there that gives me a strong town vs. Pinkerton feeling from him.

But right now, I'm mulling bey's reasoning re: capp. I think a scum calling another player scum has fewer layers of ambiguity than a scum calling another player innocent (as capp did last game). As bey said, it looks more like simple wifom. But on the other hand, I still don't think it makes sense for an outed scum to call attention to a fellow scum in any way. The less a Pink shows up on the town's short list, the better it is for them.

[cappuccino]

Hmm, nevermind, I'm working on figuring out something odd I noticed. I'll get back to you guys later with my suspicions.

[Joshua Adams]

I am not sure that the Pinkertons are behaving oddly. trillian was an early target in Mafia I, so apparently if she isn't one of them then she is considered dangerous. As for Adam, I can think of a way in which he may have blown his cover. However, I knew he was the sheriff when I read his posts, so perhaps nobody else picked up on it.

[Sock Puppet]

What do you see that's odd in the Pinkertons' behavior, wei? Do you see something odd in their kill pattern, or are you just talking about vm's actions?

[Joshua Adams]

Sock, you need to read in context, Crumb's posts as well. Just showing posts by wei will not give you the gist.

[beyelzu]

im not sure that capp is innocent joshua. wifom says he isnt which is of course a bullshit reason. i suspect that capp is indeed innocent as he is playing differently than he was last game. but i think the accusation of capp by vm could be pretty good cover by a pinkerton for another.

[wei yau]

The Pinkertons have killed Adam and trillian to date. I'm inclined to believe that they got lucky with Adam, as I couldn't pick up any sherriff tells from him. But, now that Joshua Adams has stated that he was able to do so, then perhaps I'm just thick.

As for trillian, she's certainly not one of the more active posters in this particular game. I would have expected the Pinkertons to target one of the more active posters, as the quiet posters probably hurt the town more than they do the Pinkertons.

Until Joshua revealed that Swearegen had Dan kill godfry, I figured the Pinkertons had done him in for his big mouth.

As for vm, I kinda have to side with Sock. I don't see vm fingering another Pinkerton once he knew he was doomed. It's a risk with little gain, especially since there are far more pro-townie roles than Pinkertons.

[Crumb]

What about my posts? :chin:

Anyway, my top two suspects at this point are Nightson and Sock Puppet. I have read through their posts and I know that that tends to be an exercise in confirmation bias, but what I saw was them both posting very little and not saying much of any use for the camp. I am not sure of their guilt. There is no way to be. Just voicing my opinion.

vote: Nightson

[beyelzu]

as to people's suspicion of wei yau, i dont see it. the stress of being mafia was pretty hard on our celstial friend.

i dont get the same feeling at all from him that i did in mafia.

im still open to suspicion for wei but he just isnt setting off my alarm bells currently.

[beyelzu]

and right now looking through crumbles posts he doesnt look very suspicious to me either.

[thegoldglove07]

My suspicions lead me to believe that MonCap is a god damn pinkerton! Acting so innocent is pretty much a crime in my book. Why else would MC keep making comments about all the other baddies. Unless, MC, truely is innocent. Well, it's just a hunch and an opinion but for now I'll stand here.

Vote: MonCap

[Joshua Adams]

Well, bey, I don't exactly trust you either at the moment, so I don't think I can take your analysis of wei at face value.

For the record, I didn't finger Crumb, I just meant that you need to read some of his questions to wei in order to understand what that conversation was about (wherein wei strongly implied that he's not a normal townie). I'm not sure if it'd be in the Pinkerton's interest to kill someone just for being a hoople with beating priviledges at this point, since they no longer serve a useful function and just get replaced upon death anyway. But the fact that he wasn't taken out argues against his innocence, even if just a little.

[thegoldglove07]

We must not become overconfident.

Just to inform you. This is what got me thinking.

[wei yau]

I was kinda suspicous of Crumb in the early game, as you can tell based on my exchange with him. But, I can't be certain, as there are two factors that are confounding the issue for me.

First, I can't figure out TGG. His style of play is just strange to me. Votes with little reasoning, periodic absences and Crumb keeps defending him. Originally, I gave TGG the benefit of the doubt, but now I'm not so sure. As we near endgame, I think I'll have to become a little less generous in my thinking.

Second, my review shows that both Crumb and vm tried to lynch trillian early on in the game. Now that trillian has been Pinkered and I know that vm was scum, I have to wonder why Crumb voted for her.

As I said earlier, I can't figure out why trillian was targeted since she was so quiet. And after reading the past posts, I can't figure out why either vm or Crumb would target her.

And to be honest, I'm a little reluctant to defend myself. Plenty of people have been lynched for doing just that, but I will say that I tried very hard to reveal any hints about my possible role during my exchange with Crumb. I didn't want to end up a target for the Pinkertons and was concerned that Crumb was trying to do just that.

So, once again, I'm back to being suspicious of Crumb.

vote: Crumb

[wei yau]

If you can expand on that, thegoldglove07, then it'd be helpful. As I said in my earlier post, I worry about both you and Crumb right now.

[livius drusus]

http://www.freethought-forum.com/livius/tally.gif

~~ 5 votes needed to lynch ~~


CocksuckerX voted for :rarrow: CocksuckerY


Crumb :rarrow: Nightson
thegoldglove07 MonCapitan2002
Sock Puppet
MonCapitan2002
cappuccino
beyelzu :rarrow: cappuccino
wei yau :rarrow: Crumb
Joshua Adams
Nightson


Smilin (hoople) - lynched, day 1
Adam (Bullock) - killed, night 1
viscousmemories (Pinkerton) - lynched, day 2
godfry n. glad (Calamity Jane) - killed, night 2
trillian (hoople) - killed, night 2

Total votes for:

cappuccino - 1
Nightson - 1
MonCapitan2002 - 1
Crumb - 1

[Sock Puppet]

I've now read over that conversation between Crumb and wei, and it makes me even more suspicious of wei. I really wonder about why it would be important to the town to "make a distinction between hooples and townies," but I can see why a Pinkerton would want to get as much info as he could on who beats whom -- to figure out whether he'd been investigated, or just beaten.

vote: wei yau

Bey, I see what you're saying, but in the first game, wei and Adam nearly had the game pulled out from under them by Smilin's unexpected spying on their PM activity. Wei had to get out from under that, which was an extra layer of stress on top of hiding his scummitude. The Pinkertons don't have that this game. Also, his Deadwoodian lingo could also be a good smokescreen against what's really going on in his melon.

Crumb, I see that I'm on your suspect list, but I'm determined not to get defensive about my gameplay. It is what it is. But check my posts on vm again, and ask yourself why a Pinkerton scum would've made them.

[wei yau]

My conversation with Crumb was generated from my question as to just how many beatings were administered. I needed that information just to see if everyone who was beat would reveal. And maybe if there was a discrepancy, we'd know that someone who didn't cop to a beating would be a Pinkerton.

When god changed the hoople and townie status, I wasn't quite sure just how many beatings would be dealt on a given night.

Also, I've back away from the Deadwood-speak because I find that it is too hard for me to get a read on people through all the "cocksuckers" and "motherfucks". Using your rationale with regards to a "smokescreen", I had pegged godfry as a Pinkerton. Turns out he was just really into roleplaying the foul-mouthed Calamity Jane.

[Crumb]

Second, my review shows that both Crumb and vm tried to lynch trillian early on in the game. Now that trillian has been Pinkered and I know that vm was scum, I have to wonder why Crumb voted for her.

As I said earlier, I can't figure out why trillian was targeted since she was so quiet. And after reading the past posts, I can't figure out why either vm or Crumb would target her.
Trillian plays a lot like you and Adam did in Mafia I, whether she is a baddie or not. Meaning she is good at being a bad guy that lays low. Here she was in this game not saying shit. She has quite the reputation at the IIDB games for being a very skilled baddie. I was trying to bring her out and make her say something. I don't think I ever crusaded for her lynching. That's never been my style.

[thegoldglove07]

If you can expand on that, thegoldglove07, then it'd be helpful. As I said in my earlier post, I worry about both you and Crumb right now.

Well, I understand your thinking. My absence is accidental and I hope it doesn't affect the thoughts of others but on another note I could see what you mean. I show very little reasoning because really, I don't understand most of it, to be honest. Your suspicions of me could be right or they could be wrong, but again, my absence is very accidental and I'll try my best to be here and follow.

[Crumb]

If you can expand on that, thegoldglove07, then it'd be helpful. As I said in my earlier post, I worry about both you and Crumb right now.
I defended TGG because it was in the first two days and it was his first game and I am the one who got him playing. I didn't want to see him lynched right off the bat. He may very well be a pinkerton, but I don't think so based on my knowing that he was away from the FF all night during the first nightfall. Could I be wrong about that? yes I could be, it was a very long nightfall after all and maybe he was the reason. I don't know enough to defend him further so I won't.

[wei yau]

I've gotta say, TGG, it is your sincerity that keeps me from voting for you.

Crumb, I certainly didn't meant to imply that you crusaded for lynching trillian. To tell the truth, I simply looked at Joshua Adams' vote history post and noted that both you and vm had cast for trillian.

[Joshua Adams]

My reason for not voting for thegoldglove07 is that vm tried to finger him.

The same's true of Crumb. vm's overall pattern which I can see is that he was fingering innocents. Hopefully there weren't one or two curve balls thrown in there.

[Crumb]

So that's why you voted for me? I happened to vote with vm and not anyone else once? Everyone else wasn't voting for a Pink were they?

[Crumb]

Hopefully there weren't one or two curve balls thrown in there.
I hate to argue against my own interests, but it seems inevitable that there was some misdirection in his voting. That is standard Pinkerton practice.

[Joshua Adams]

Well, I don't see it as inevitable that he'd try to get his own lynched. I have other reasons for not suspecting you, mainly that you're being all Crumbesque.

[wei yau]

vm's finger didn't stay on Crumb for very long.

Crumb had already voted for trillian on the first day, ostensibly to draw her out. As I was trying to do the same on that day, I didn't think anything of it.

However, on the second day vm had already voted for trillian which would probably have been enough to draw her out, yet Crumb stated he voted for her to draw her out further.

This is the reasoning behind my vote. Though, I'm far from positive.

I'm ambivalent about others who have votes against them right now. Nightson and MonCap both have posting hours that differ from the majority, so I can't get a good read on them and am hesitant to bandwagon when they are unable to defend themselves.

I've got a vote and I certainly have no interest in being lynched today.

That leaves capp, who I've not yet looked at and will do so as soon as I'm able.

[Sock Puppet]

My conversation with Crumb was generated from my question as to just how many beatings were administered. I needed that information just to see if everyone who was beat would reveal. And maybe if there was a discrepancy, we'd know that someone who didn't cop to a beating would be a Pinkerton.That seems reasonable, although it's not a foregone conclusion that only a Pinkerton wouldn't cop to a beating. With all the hoopleheads roaming about, it's not much danger to scum to say they've been beat, while even an innocent could be paranoid about revealing it.

Still, it's enough to unvote for now.

Edit - After reading the Gem thread, I'm going to vote: MonCapitan2002. I haven't ruled him out, and I'd like to see if he will now respond to the late Calamity Jane's accusations.

Double edit - Now that I reread wei's post, I realize that MonCap is probably not online. I've been reading everybody's posts so much this morning that I got it into my head that everybody was here. I won't keep the vote if it looks like he's headed for a lynch before he arrives.

[beyelzu]

Well, bey, I don't exactly trust you either at the moment, so I don't think I can take your analysis of wei at face value.

For the record, I didn't finger Crumb, I just meant that you need to read some of his questions to wei in order to understand what that conversation was about (wherein wei strongly implied that he's not a normal townie). I'm not sure if it'd be in the Pinkerton's interest to kill someone just for being a hoople with beating priviledges at this point, since they no longer serve a useful function and just get replaced upon death anyway. But the fact that he wasn't taken out argues against his innocence, even if just a little.
well, ja, it really hurts me to hear you say that you dont trust me, actually i dont really give a fuck suspicion is part of the game. one thing which has been largely true in these games is that mafia dont defend other players very often and never defend other mafia. so from your perspective it should be very unlikely that both wei and i are evil.

but the reason i made the post is that i mostly try to get a feel for a persons posts, their town, and if you look at when wei was mafia he acted alot different from now. perhaps the same can be said of capp. but i suspect that cap could have changed his play after being burned by it.

and

[Joshua Adams]

andWhat?

[Joshua Adams]

Sock, doesn't that just give MonCap an incentive to never show up? He is always on invisible mode so we would not know whether he is here.

[wei yau]

That seems reasonable, although it's not a foregone conclusion that only a Pinkerton wouldn't cop to a beating. With all the hoopleheads roaming about, it's not much danger to scum to say they've been beat, while even an innocent could be paranoid about revealing it.


Yeah, well it certainly wasn't the best idea I ever had, given how much suspicion that conversation garnered. Then again, vm didn't cop to being beat and he most certainly suffered one at the hands of our dearly departed Bullock.

But, it's not like I'm ungrateful for the unvote.

/me slides a shot of whiskey towards Sock

[beyelzu]

vm's finger didn't stay on Crumb for very long.

Crumb had already voted for trillian on the first day, ostensibly to draw her out. As I was trying to do the same on that day, I didn't think anything of it.

However, on the second day vm had already voted for trillian which would probably have been enough to draw her out, yet Crumb stated he voted for her to draw her out further.

This is the reasoning behind my vote. Though, I'm far from positive.

I'm ambivalent about others who have votes against them right now. Nightson and MonCap both have posting hours that differ from the majority, so I can't get a good read on them and am hesitant to bandwagon when they are unable to defend themselves.

I've got a vote and I certainly have no interest in being lynched today.

That leaves capp, who I've not yet looked at and will do so as soon as I'm able.
i find this post to be very very suspicious, as you talk about who to vote, you dont seem to talk about guilt at all rather just the people that others have already voted for. thats a pinkerton thought process. shit.

im not ready to change my votes or anything but i will be thinking about it. also are you claiming hoople?? and if you did it outright how the fuck did i miss it

[Sock Puppet]

Sock, doesn't that just give MonCap an incentive to never show up? He is always on invisible mode so we would not know whether he is here.
I meant, within reason. I'm a morning poster, he's apparently not. I would be surprised if he didn't show up at all today; he posts an awful lot in the Atrium, so he'd have to hold off completely if he wanted to pretend he was away.

[wei yau]

I've been reluctant to address bey's defense of me because that kinda thing can get an innocent man lynched. But, to be honest, I've not decided on bey yet. The switch between lees and bey makes it difficult for me to get a read on whatever role they might have shared.

On the one hand, I have to read lees posts in the context of her playing a Pinkerton role. On the other, I have to do the same for bey.

But, if I thought that lees played like guilty scum and bey didn't, then I'm stuck in a quandry.

[beyelzu]

andWhat?
sorry didnt mean to leave you hanging, but that and was changed to but and i guess i accidentally didnt delete it or some such shit.

[beyelzu]

I've been reluctant to address bey's defense of me because that kinda thing can get an innocent man lynched. But, to be honest, I've not decided on bey yet. The switch between lees and bey makes it difficult for me to get a read on whatever role they might have shared.

On the one hand, I have to read lees posts in the context of her playing a Pinkerton role. On the other, I have to do the same for bey.

But, if I thought that lees played like guilty scum and bey didn't, then I'm stuck in a quandry.
yeah, it would be funny if i get kilt over somethin that english lass said :tmgrin:

if it makes you feel better, i dont like your last post, it seems suspicious to me. altand this one isnt much better the oblique self reference to yourself strikes me as suspicious.

hmm.

unvote, vote wei

sorry, but you just seem the most suspicious to me right now.

[livius drusus]

http://www.freethought-forum.com/livius/tally.gif

~~ 5 votes needed to lynch ~~


Cocksucker X voted for :rarrow: Cocksucker Y


Crumb :rarrow: Nightson
thegoldglove07 :rarrow: MonCapitan2002
Sock Puppet :rarrow: MonCapitan2002
MonCapitan2002
cappuccino
beyelzu :rarrow: wei yau
wei yau :rarrow: Crumb
Joshua Adams
Nightson


Smilin (hoople) - lynched, day 1
Adam (Bullock) - killed, night 1
viscousmemories (Pinkerton) - lynched, day 2
godfry n. glad (Calamity Jane) - killed, night 2
trillian (hoople) - killed, night 2

Total votes for:

MonCapitan2002 - 2
wei yau - 1
Nightson - 1
Crumb - 1

[beyelzu]

liv i edited in a vote change sorry.

and you caught it, are you sure you arent omnimax?

omnicool, omniscient and omnivocal or some such?

[wei yau]

i find this post to be very very suspicious, as you talk about who to vote, you dont seem to talk about guilt at all rather just the people that others have already voted for. thats a pinkerton thought process. shit.

I'm not sure I'm parsing your sentence correctly. My post was presenting the reasons for why I voted for Crumb. My reasons are why I find Crumb to be suspicious (or guilty, if you prefer).

I'm afraid I have to rely on voting history and I'm not very adept at reading people. Like how I thought godfry was scum.

How would you describe someone's guilt? Unless I am reading you wrong, your vote for capp is based on vm's vote for him. How is that different than my reasoning for voting for Crumb?


also are you claiming hoople?? and if you did it outright how the fuck did i miss it

I never made any such claim. And as addressed by Crumb in that ever-increasingly regrettable conversation I had with him, if I were hoople I wouldn't need to ask that question.

[livius drusus]

Definitely omnicool.
:cthulhu3:

[beyelzu]

i find this post to be very very suspicious, as you talk about who to vote, you dont seem to talk about guilt at all rather just the people that others have already voted for. thats a pinkerton thought process. shit.

I'm not sure I'm parsing your sentence correctly. My post was presenting the reasons for why I voted for Crumb. My reasons are why I find Crumb to be suspicious (or guilty, if you prefer).

I'm afraid I have to rely on voting history and I'm not very adept at reading people. Like how I thought godfry was scum.

How would you describe someone's guilt? Unless I am reading you wrong, your vote for capp is based on vm's vote for him. How is that different than my reasoning for voting for Crumb?


also are you claiming hoople?? and if you did it outright how the fuck did i miss it

I never made any such claim. And as addressed by Crumb in that ever-increasingly regrettable conversation I had with him, if I were hoople I wouldn't need to ask that question.

the thing is wei, you list everyone who is being voted for and discuss their guilt which is kind of interesting, its something mafia does. rather than just discussing people you are guilty of in general or just your thoughts on the game in general like i do.

it seems suspicious.

and i just wanted to be clear that you are claiming to be a purebred townie no hoople at all right?

[beyelzu]

Definitely omnicool.
:cthulhu3:
:bow: :bow:

i mean whats cthulhu without some worshippers.

:tmgrin:

[Joshua Adams]

vote: beyelzu

I dunno, I think at least one of you is scum. Gotta pick somebody I guess. I haven't forgotten how scum-bey lured everyone into lynching innocents based on specious analysis, and I'm getting vibes of that sort from his argument against wei right now.

I still haven't revealed who the innocent is. So I dunno if I should do that before nightfall or what. I might not die tonight anyway, if the doc didn't actually bother protecting me yesterday, knowing the Pinkertons would aim elsewhere.

[wei yau]

the thing is wei, you list everyone who is being voted for and discuss their guilt which is kind of interesting, its something mafia does. rather than just discussing people you are guilty of in general or just your thoughts on the game in general like i do.

it seems suspicious.

Interesting. Since I don't play like you, I must be guilty?

At any rate, I listed my reasoning for all others who have garnered a vote as a response to Crumb as to why I selected him and not others. My reasoning for picking from that list as opposed to all available players is simply because the list was available to me and because Crumb remains suspicious in my eyes.

and i just wanted to be clear that you are claiming to be a purebred townie no hoople at all right?

You've already got me to admit that I'm no hoople. How about you give a little and admit something yourself?

[beyelzu]

im a hoople, originally a townie, became a hoople yesterday and beat crumb last night.

[Sock Puppet]

I was about to ask why you'd reveal whom you beat, but then I realized that Joshua has already said he investigated an innocent last night. In that case, I wonder if the beating smokescreen works against us rather than for us, since one of the beatees is innocent and the rest might get a little more trust than they deserve.

[Crumb]

You cocksucker!

[beyelzu]

vote: beyelzu

I dunno, I think at least one of you is scum. Gotta pick somebody I guess. I haven't forgotten how scum-bey lured everyone into lynching innocents based on specious analysis, and I'm getting vibes of that sort from his argument against wei right now.
well im sorry you feel that way, ja, just trying to play the game. i can see where i will look guilty anytime i accuse anyone of anything cuz i did it quite well as an aside, ja, i also almost never changed my vote in that game. course you can wifom that away if you like. and i imagine at some point i might also be charged with being wishywashy. and a big difference between when i was scum and now is that im trying to reread everyone's posts and get an overall feel for them. first time through reading wei yau's he struck me as being innocent and i said as much, then his recent posts just smack of suspicion with artificial constructions and not an overall look at people. what can i say he looks like scum.

I still haven't revealed who the innocent is. So I dunno if I should do that before nightfall or what. I might not die tonight anyway, if the doc didn't actually bother protecting me yesterday, knowing the Pinkertons would aim elsewhere.

well hopefully the doc did that but who knows for sure, unless you have a way of knowing or unless you know swearengen can come forward tomorrow with that info then i think you should tell us who the innocent is. narrow our search as much as possible.

[beyelzu]

You cocksucker!
dont be that way crumbles, i beat you out of love.

[beyelzu]

Interesting. Since I don't play like you, I must be guilty?

At any rate, I listed my reasoning for all others who have garnered a vote as a response to Crumb as to why I selected him and not others. My reasoning for picking from that list as opposed to all available players is simply because the list was available to me and because Crumb remains suspicious in my eyes.

a very effective mafia ploy something i did quite well when evil is to exploit the current suspicions of the town. instead of giving new and interesting suspects, focus on the list of suspects that others give. that is what i was saying. hell ja plays alot different from me so does slimshady and soubrette will if we ever get her to play. its not about playing the same way its about taking current suspicions only.

[wei yau]

Crumb copped to a beating and bey admitted he dealt it.

Both MonCap and Nightson copped to getting beat. And they are absent given their posting hours.

Shouldn't there be one more beating? My only beating was on Day One.

Crumb getting beat revealed nothing, so I can't clear my vote off of him based on bey's reveal.

I'll agree with bey, we need to know who got beat by Ja last night.

[wei yau]

a very effective mafia ploy something i did quite well when evil is to exploit the current suspicions of the town. instead of giving new and interesting suspects, focus on the list of suspects that others give. that is what i was saying. hell ja plays alot different from me so does slimshady and soubrette will if we ever get her to play. its not about playing the same way its about taking current suspicions only.

So, where does that leave me if I only suspect one person? If I were to fabricate reasons for suspecting others, when I truly don't, then I'd be accused of making artificial constructions.

Let's see just who is left in the game:

1. Crumb
2. thegoldglove07
3. Sock Puppet
4. MonCapitan2002
5. cappuccino
6. beyelzu
7. wei yau
8. Joshua Adams
9. Nightson

- I've already voted for Crumb.
- I talked about TGG consistently because of his absence from being online.
- I talked about MonCap and Nightson because their schedule keeps them from defending themselves in "real time", making me hesitant to bandwagon during their absence.
- I talked about you and how that player switch makes it difficult for me decide
- I admitted that I had not looked at capp and would do so, though to be honest most of my posting time has been taken up with conversation with you.
- There's no reason to suspect Joshua Adams for obvious reasons.

Who does this leave me with?

Sock.

Sock seems to be flying under everyone's radar, myself included.

[Sock Puppet]

Jesus fuck. I'm not flying under anybody's fucking radar. For one, your sometime prime suspect, Crumb, listed me as one of his two suspects.

[wei yau]

Allow me to clarify, I certainly didn't mean to imply that Sock is guilty of anything. While he is certainly under my radar (and obviously not Crumb's), that's simply because I've seen nothing from Sock that makes me question his guilt.

[Crumb]

:yup:

[Sock Puppet]

Okay then. You might wanta get a rope around those metaphors, 'cause they can wreak havoc on a man when you turn 'em loose like that. "Flying under radar" implies conscious intent, if I understand this newfangled technology right.

[wei yau]

Noted and accepted, Sock. Poor choice of words on my part, as I didn't mean to cast any aspersions on your intent.

[Sock Puppet]

But that Crumb cocksucker does. :shakefist:

I don't see how you (Crumb) can conclude I haven't tried to help the town, but I will say that I'm determined not to blurt every damnfool thing that occurs to me, as that got me lynched last time.

[Joshua Adams]

Alright bey. If anybody else wants to take credit for Crumb's beating then we'll talk.

unvote

[Crumb]

I don't have it out for you either Sock. But it does seem like you are trying to fly under the radar. You are doing better today though... a little.

[livius drusus]

http://www.freethought-forum.com/livius/tally.gif

~~ 5 votes needed to lynch ~~


Cocksucker X voted for :rarrow: Cocksucker Y


Crumb :rarrow: Nightson
thegoldglove07 :rarrow: MonCapitan2002
Sock Puppet :rarrow: MonCapitan2002
MonCapitan2002
cappuccino
beyelzu :rarrow: wei yau
wei yau :rarrow: Crumb
Joshua Adams
Nightson


Smilin (hoople) - lynched, day 1
Adam (Bullock) - killed, night 1
viscousmemories (Pinkerton) - lynched, day 2
godfry n. glad (Calamity Jane) - killed, night 2
trillian (hoople) - killed, night 2

Total votes for:

MonCapitan2002 - 2
wei yau - 1
Nightson - 1
Crumb - 1

[Sock Puppet]

I have had severe troubles with :ff: the last couple of days, which appears to be a combination of :ff: server troubles and my own connection crapping out. My company has a shitload of proxy servers set up, and if one goes down, the whole Intarweb disappears for awhile. I don't seem to have any trouble so far today.

[Crumb]

I've been having troubles the last few days, too.

[wei yau]

Same here, though not consistently. Sometimes the page won't load for me and I've lost a post or three.

[Joshua Adams]

Me too. I blame vm, that goddamn Pinkerton, trying to take the whole camp down with his last breath.

[thegoldglove07]

I've been having troubles the last few days, too.

Yep. The boards were down for Tuesday for me.

[Sock Puppet]

Joshua, does Swearingen know whom you've cleared? Sorry if that was already clarified and I missed it.

[Joshua Adams]

Yeah he does.

[Sock Puppet]

So in the worst case, Swearingen can clear the innocent when he outs. Problem with that is, it will be harder to tell a false reveal from a real one if JA is dead. But we've got to live with that, since I'd say it's way too early for Swearingen to reveal.

[Joshua Adams]

I'd say the worst case is Swearengen dies as well.

I've gone back looking at MonCapitan2002 and he seems a little off. Not really acting like he did in Mafia 3 as I recall.

vote: MonCapitan2002

There seems to be at least as good a chance that he's scum as the rest of my few suspects (I've mentally cleared just about everyone, hopefully I ain't mistaken on them).

[Crumb]

There is no point in Al ever revealing unless he is about to be lynched.

[wei yau]

I've reviewed today's posts and feel compelled to unvote: Crumb. And if my suspicions are right, then I'll have to vote: Nightson.

[cappuccino]

I'm the person Joshua investigated. It was indeed me who beat him the first night. I didn't immediately come out because of the risky early move on my part and because of this strange thing, I hadn't received the notification that I had gotten a beating last night. So I was trying to find an explanation for that discrepancy. I even thought that maybe there was some sort of conspiracy going on.

It turned out that liv had forgotten to PM me and she sent me a belated one 2 hours ago which I just got. So that's a discrepancy resolved. No secret plans or conspiracy going on(at least not revolving around the beatings).

I'm looking at Crumb, MonCap, and Nightson. There's something about them that's striking me as off. I can't put my finger on it right now but there's something not right about them. I don't have time right now but I need to go back and review their posts. It may be nothing more than personal bias or something more.

[Joshua Adams]

I'll just confirm that cappuccino isn't lying. Obviously.

[Crumb]

cool. Thanks capp. Having one less suspect is very good.

[wei yau]

I'm relieved at capp's reveal. I had reviewed his posts and still couldn't come to a conclusion about his status.

[Joshua Adams]

Who'd you beat up last night, capp?

[Sock Puppet]

And having at least one known innocent who will survive to Daybreak is very good. (Since those Pinkerton cocksuckers can only hit one of them tonight.) Add in the uncertainty of whether JA was protected last night or not, and things have just gotten tougher for the Pinks, and the outlook for the town is considerably brighter than I thought it was. We now have an excellent chance that no innocents will die tonight. Those cocksuckers have to make a difficult decision come Nightfall, and I hope it causes them severe annoyance and consternation.

[Joshua Adams]

In a best case scenario the doctor and pinkertons would both choose the same between either me or capp, nullifying the kill (50/50 chance of that happening if they don't stray to a third party). Therefore I think the pinkertons will probably not want to risk it and will kill off some other person, leaving both confirmed innocents alive.

[Sock Puppet]

That's the tough decision I was talking about. Either they choose to leave 2 confirmed innocents alive, or risk being blocked entirely. I'm enjoying the schadenfreude.

[Nightson]

So has the hoople status given us a way of pretty much directly confirming who are hooples? I was going to vote for Bey for blatant fishing, but the beating seems to have cleared him. Hmm, maybe a mass claim could win us the game.

Will post more on this later.

[Sock Puppet]

I don't know if it would win us the game outright, but I can see how we could at least tell pretty easily if someone falsely claimed hoople status. I'll go get lunch and think about it.

[Nightson]

Nevermind, we got ten minutes more of class.

9 people left 2 of them pinkertons.

3 named roles left right now, plus 3 or 4 hooples?

Hooples name their targets for tonight, then when they beat their targets they'll be confirmed the next day. On that day, the other name roles could claim, thus leaving 4-2 possible pinks. We'd win definately.

If you see any flaws in the plan, please post now.

[Crumb]

I see that if hooples claim the Pinkertons have a much easier time finding the remaining specials.

[Joshua Adams]

Utter (me)
Doc Cochran
Swearengen
3 Beaters (cappuccino)
1 regular hoople
2 pinkertons

The plan should work if everyone picks a different target to beat up. However if the target dies then we won't know if they ever did it. It's a little bit of a crapshoot, but as long as we think carefully after about the results tomorrow...

[Joshua Adams]

Crumb, I think he's proposing a mass roleclaim. If we do that we better make it while I'm alive, so I can confirm the identity of Swearengen.

[wei yau]

One correction:

Utter (Joshua Adams)
Doc Cochran
Swearengen
3 Beaters (cappuccino, beyelzu)
1 regular hoople
2 pinkertons

[Joshua Adams]

That's a strong likelihood, and I even had him in there before, but I took him out since I'm not 100% sure of it like the others.

[Sock Puppet]

Could a Pinkerton get away with claiming he wasn't really beaten? I ask because it's obvious that the scum will claim hoople status as well, and we'll end up with a shouting match between them and their alleged beating targets over who's lying about their bruises.

Edit - and if we do a mass roleclaim, we lose the Doctor immediately.

[Crumb]

Crumb, I think he's proposing a mass roleclaim. If we do that we better make it while I'm alive, so I can confirm the identity of Swearengen.
You guys think Swearengen and Doc should out too? wow I dunno... Do we want to lose Swearengen? or our doc? It is a radical strategy though, and the history of the town here in :ff: suggests that a radical strategy may not be a bad idea...

[Joshua Adams]

It seems to me that pinkertons could lie about it, but there are three people who I know are innocent, me capp and Swearengen, so we know they'd at least tell the truth, so somebody should target them for sure.

The pinkertons could simply "beat up" each other and corroborate their accounts, so nobody would be allowed to pair off. But even then the pinkertons could lie and maybe get their beater lynched, but we'd know at least one of the parties in "his word against his" would be scum, right?

I'm trying to do my math homework, bastards! I don't know if this is a good plan yet or not.

[cappuccino]

I beat Nightson last night.

I'm not sure about the mass role claim. There's too many people right now to help us tell apart the liars and the truthful people, I believe.

Yes, it'd be a radical strategy, it just might work...considering there's only two Pinkertons now. Losing one special role tonight might not be that disasterous, if we manage to hang a Pinkerton today, especially if we had a good guess to who's the other Pinkerton.

At least you know that Joshua and I are innocent. If they decide to kill either Doc or Al tonight instead of us that still leaves two and possibly one more who we know are innocent the next day.

Now the more I think about it, the more attractive the mass role claim tactic is. We need to keep in mind that without doing anything else, the chances of Joshua(in addition myself) surviving tonight is rather slim and Joshua's the only one who can verify Swearengen's identity.

[Sock Puppet]

Yeah, I think it might narrow the field further, I just don't think it'll make the Pinkertons light up with a glowing red 'P' on their foreheads. Good point on targeting the known innocents, but keep in mind one of those will probably be dead come morning, and we'll be left with the question of whether the player who said he'd beat the dead one is a Pinkerton covering himself, or a hoople victimized by a frame-up.

Edit - my "yeah" is in response to Joshua's post.

... and I just thought of another way the scum could screw up the plan, but I am definitely not going to edumacate them.

[Crumb]

So maybe holding off a day on that is in order?

[Joshua Adams]

Well.... perhaps making an offering of the doctor would let everyone else survive (he should protect Swearengen, I'd say). Just a thought, not a serious recommendation. Of course, those pinkerton fucks would be inclined to foil our plan anyway, maybe. I'm not sure how much they want him dead.

Don't forget we have all the usual evidence that might clear people, so we can still decide how much stock to put into people's claims.

[cappuccino]

Right, we have the posts and voting history to consider which can reveal information in view of who has claimed what.

Suppose we all reveal our roles, the only two choices Pinkertons have is to either claim a hoople or claim a Doc. Analysis of the voting pattern and listening to the Doc's claims could help us figure out who's the real one.

If both Pinkertons decide to be hooples, I think we'd still be able to tease out the liars or at least arrive at a good guess. Plus we have the advantage that Swearengen's kill is processed before Pinkerton's kill so effectively we have two targets we can kill today.

Worse case scenario, we fuck it up and kill two innocents, then tonight'll see another innocent killed by the Pinkertons. Tomorrow morning, there'll be still at least two known innocents plus two more innocent and two Pinkertons.

Good case scenario, we kill one Pinkerton and one innocent, and then the remaining Pinkerton kill one innocent tonight. That still leaves two known innocents, three innocents, and one Pinkerton the next day.

Best case scenario, pretty self-evident, we kill the two Pinkertons today and we win.


Hmmm...

[Joshua Adams]

I think we still have about 30 hours until the day ends, so... we do have time to analyze this stuff...

[Sock Puppet]

In the meantime, I'm keeping my piehole shut about whatever role I might have, until all of you cocksuckers come to some sort of consensus. Hell, at this point, the non-beating hoople is a role, considering there's only one of 'em. I believe wei is claiming that one already.

[beyelzu]

i think we should decide in the next few hours, i will be away when we get close to nightfall. i probably wont be on for the last six hours of the day.

so i do think we should try to come to a decision tonight, if possible.

the mass roleclaim is a very interesting plan.

i can beat capp tonight for some proof.

[cappuccino]

So far the only people who haven't posted since bey claimed he's the hoople who beat Crumb up are MonCap and Nightson. And nobody have chimed up to dispute bey's claim so far.

Either bey's telling the truth or Crumb's true beater is either MonCap or Nightson.

Since I'm most suspicious of MonCap, that makes me more inclined to feel that he's Pink. But let's wait till the remaining players post and then we may be able to count bey as innocent.

[Joshua Adams]

bey, I think, maybe, a better plan is to have the people we trust the LEAST be the ones who target the known innocents. Since nobody has contradicted your claim to have beaten Crumb, you're firmly in my hoople list. I'm not sure how we're going to tell the difference between Pinkertons, non-beating hoople, and Doc Cochran though.

I'm fine with just lynching MonCap today, since he is my strongest suspect. The only problem is if he turns out innocent we might not get another chance for this tomorrow.

[Joshua Adams]

Beatings:

Adam -> viscousmemories
cappuccino -> Joshua Adams
? -> Crumb
? -> wei yau

Joshua Adams -> cappuccino
cappuccino -> Nightson
beyelzu -> Crumb
? -> MonCapitan2002

Any details we can fill in here? I think this shows conclusively that MonCapitan isn't a beater, doesn't it?

[Crumb]

:confused:

[cappuccino]

Yeah, I've come to the same conclusion. I've been looking at voting history the past half hour to see if I can determine who may have been remaining unknown beaters.

Smilin was one of the original beaters, by the way.

[beyelzu]

ok i guess i shouldnt beat capp then.

we need to lynch someone who claims townie. hooples can prove with a beating so pinkertons are going to have to claim townie to avoid someone disagreeing with them.

right now i think the mass role claim might be a really good idea.

[Nightson]

I did not beat up crumb last night (just to make that clear). I think the best course would be for the hooples to claim today and announce their targets. Going into the night we should confirm them, the possible failures are the mob killing one of the hoople's targets (which seems likely) or getting hit and lying about it. Only the first one is the real problem, it leaves one unconfirmed, but if any of them lie they sign their death sentence, a lynch or vig kill will reveal the truth and they'll be next on the list. Anyway tomorrow Swearnagen and the doc can come forward.

[Joshua Adams]

[to capp] I know. Does that mean there were only three beatings on day 1? Did I screw up by including wei? I thought he said he got beaten up... Or was Smilin replaced during the night and the replacement got to take a shot at somebody?

trillian was a beater, right? so we could probably conclude that she targeted MonCapitan on night 2, or is my reasoning/facts incorrect?

[Crumb]

No. I think it has to be all or nothing. Otherwise the baddies have no reason to claim anything, we won't want to lynch them on fear that they are doc or Al.

[beyelzu]

thats an interesting plan as well. but who exactly is claiming hoople sides me and capp?

[beyelzu]

Beatings:

Adam -> viscousmemories
cappuccino -> Joshua Adams
? -> Crumb
? -> wei yau

Joshua Adams -> cappuccino
cappuccino -> Nightson
beyelzu -> Crumb
? -> MonCapitan2002

Any details we can fill in here? I think this shows conclusively that MonCapitan isn't a beater, doesn't it?
i dont know if its conclusive what if there is someone who was beaten but they havent revealed it yet?

[Joshua Adams]

The only way it isn't conclusive is if you are lying, bey. Or MonCap beat himself up night 2.

edit: because there are three beating hoopleheads at any given time. Liv said they are replaced as needed; she didn't grant everyone beating priviledges.

[cappuccino]

I know. Does that mean there were only three beatings on day 1? Did I screw up by including wei? I thought he said he got beaten up... Or was Smilin replaced during the night and the replacement got to take a shot at somebody?

trillian was a beater, right? so we could probably conclude that she targeted MonCapitan on night 2, or is my reasoning/facts incorrect?

Yes, I noticed that, it looks like that a replacement was found for Smilin as soon he was lynched. So that means during the first nightfall, two beaters were the original hooples(me and one another) and one new beater(Smilin's replacement). Then the second nightfall, when trillian dies, I took liv's words to mean that trillian was just an ordinary hoople, not one of the violent ones. So where does bey come in?

He said he became a new violent hoople yesterday. So either trillian indeed was one of the 3 violent beaters or...bey is lying.

[beyelzu]

hmm. i liked the idea of a mass role claim. i dont think that swearengen should kill anyone tonight btw. odd numbers are good. 6 is the last day for certain, 7 is another day if he chooses to not kill.

i think with a mass role claim we can certainly get the field narrow enough that the town can win.

i think that the role claim has to be done today though so we can have a couple of days to mull over the info.

so officially and all.

beyelzu-new hoople

[Nightson]

Alright lets see, everyone claims, we lynch moncap assumign he doesn't claim a power role, lets say he's a townie.

8 to 2
Lynch MocCap
7 to 2
Night kill the doc
I dunno if the vig should kill or wait
6 to 2
We lynch someone uncomfirmed lets say we get one
6 to 1
Vig kills someone, lets assume town
night kills the vig
4 to 1
Town wins by this point, there has to be at least three confirmed protown palyers and they get two more lynches.

[Joshua Adams]

I think the scenario is that bey replaced Smilin. Thus trillian was an original (I think she said so in the peanut gallery...I think!), so she beat either Crumb or wei on night 1, and beat MonCap on night 2.

[beyelzu]

The only way it isn't conclusive is if you are lying, bey. Or MonCap beat himself up night 2.

edit: because there are three beating hoopleheads at any given time. Liv said they are replaced as needed; she didn't grant everyone beating priviledges.
fair enough.

so there should only be three beatings tonight. me, capp, and who?

[cappuccino]

Can anybody confirm whether they thought trillian was an ordinary hoople or a violent hoople?

[cappuccino]

I think the scenario is that bey replaced Smilin. Thus trillian was an original (I think she said so in the peanut gallery...I think!), so she beat either Crumb or wei on night 1, and beat MonCap on night 2.

The problem is, bey said he became the new beater hoople yesterday so he couldn't have been smilin's replacement.

[Joshua Adams]

Yes, tril did claim to be a beater, and I see no reason to distrust that:

Well that sucks cock for sure you cocksucker. At least I might have beaten one of you bastards.(i.e., at least I might have beaten up a pinkerton as a going away present)

[Sock Puppet]

Considering two out of the three drunken hooples have already claimed, is there really a point to the last one keeping quiet?

[beyelzu]

Alright lets see, everyone claims, we lynch moncap assumign he doesn't claim a power role, lets say he's a townie.

8 to 2
Lynch MocCap
7 to 2
Night kill the doc
I dunno if the vig should kill or wait
6 to 2
We lynch someone uncomfirmed lets say we get one
6 to 1
Vig kills someone, lets assume town
night kills the vig
4 to 1
Town wins by this point, there has to be at least three confirmed protown palyers and they get two more lynches.
i thought there were 9 people

i think the vig should be careful using the lynch to maintain the odd number ensuring the game ends with a lynch instead of a night kill in effect giving the town another day.

[cappuccino]

Ok, I didn't see that post by trillian so I feel better now.

Are we agreed on doing a mass role claim? We can lynch MonCap afterwards, the difference in his behavior in this game compared to previous games is so striking I'm almost positive he's Pinkerton.

[beyelzu]

but if we claim swearengen can be confirmed by utter, if the doc claim remains uncontested the doc will be pretty safe bet as well unless the pinkertons are really desperate.

so. capp has been cleared.

thats four clear people. i can proove my hoopleness by beating one of them and if there is a third hoople as there should be he can also proove his hoopleness in theory anyway.

so that makes 5 clear people out of 7 tomorrow, assuming the hearst cocksuckers kill one clear tonight and we kill an unknown during the lynch.


smells like victory to me.

[Nightson]

Alrighty then, lets get started, I'm Swearnagen. JA will confirm.

[cappuccino]

I knew it! I had you pegged as Swearengen after I went back and reread posts in light of JA's reveal.

[Nightson]

Yeah I wasn't being the most subtle about it, I kinda expected to get hit my the Pinks last night. Dunno why the hit Trill.

[Sock Puppet]

I'm the last hoople. I beat up Crumb the first night, and MonCap the second. I was waiting to see if somebody would falsely claim the 3rd hoople role, but it didn't happen. Who among the innocents would like me to beat on him tonight?

[Nightson]

Crumb
thegoldglove07
Sock Puppet (hoople, claimed)
MonCapitan2002
cappuccino (hoople, confirmed)
Beyelzu )hoople, claimed)
wei yau
Joshua Adams (Utter)
Nightson (Swearnagen)

Crumb, tgg, wei, and MonCap, you're up.

[cappuccino]

Go ahead and beat me up tonight, Sock.

[Nightson]

Bey, you can beat me tonight, I'd also like to ask for the doc protect, I'll probably need to get a kill in tomorrow.

[Joshua Adams]

I thought Nightson and Adam were being way too obvious talking about whether it was legal to strategize the way Nightson proposed. Of course, I knew Adam was sheriff the whole time so that may have colored my perception.

Bey said he became a beater "yesterday." I'm not sure when that is supposed to mean. If he replaced trillian then he couldn't have beaten Crumb while also having trillian beat MonCapitan (I assume), that'd be double-dipping. If he replaced Smilin then he either administered a beating on night 1, or one of the people who claimed to have received a beating (Crumb or wei yau) is lying.

Is that a clear analysis of the situation?

[Sock Puppet]

I think you missed my post, Joshua. I was the one who beat MonCap last night, not trillian.

[Joshua Adams]

Adam -> viscousmemories
cappuccino -> Joshua Adams
Sock Puppet -> Crumb
trillian? -> wei yau

Joshua Adams -> cappuccino
cappuccino -> Nightson
beyelzu -> Crumb
Sock Puppet -> MonCapitan2002

Like that?