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Old 05-21-2017, 09:20 PM
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peacegirl peacegirl is offline
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin View Post
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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
No Maturin. The term risk in this situation applies to causing a physical hurt to someone else as a result of your actions. The emotional fallout to others, or the financial cost, will not deter those who don't want to wear seat belts. :giggle:
:laugh:

Sorry, Cochise, but you don't get to redefine words to suit your own purposes. Look, I understand that you're a parasite and in all likelihood have never done an honest day's work in your life. Coming from that perspective, it's likely impossible for you to understand that unnecessarily draining public resources is in fact a risk adults take - not for themselves but for others - when they refuse to buckle up.

But hey, no one can legitimately expect you to understand that simple truth. It'd be like asking a chimp to do calculus.
I'm just sayin that's not the way people think. If they don't want to wear seatbelts, and this is a risk that they are willing to take because this is a risk that applies only to them (they aren't telling other people not to buckle up), that's as far as their thought process is going to take them, right or wrong.

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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
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He's not my boy.
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
Of course he is:

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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
I hope Trump wins: he believes vaccines can cause autism and would not make vaccines mandatory.
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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
Trump is right on this issue. It's an issue of freedom. I would vote for him due to his position on vaccines alone.
You're a Trumpling. Time to own up and embrace the horror you helped bring about. :yup:
Labeling me is a display of your weakness.
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
Hey, I'm not the dipshit who openly advocated putting a total sociopath in the White House based solely on the fact that the sociopath in question tweeted some dumbass nonsense about vaccines. That was you. :you:

You're a Trumpling, peacegirl. The Trump Administration is yours. Own it! I know you believe that you've never had any measure of responsibility for anything at all, but that belief is simply not true. :nope:

Have your children decided whose going to support you when your boy kicks you off the dole?
He's not my boy. Every voter has to make tough decisions. The issue of vaccination was a deal breaker for me. You can intimidate me all you want. You also made a choice based on what was most important to you. That doesn't make you right and me wrong.

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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
Yet that's exactly what government does when it mandates the use of child safety devices.

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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
And keep in mind that the laws regarding seatbelts and child seats are far more onerous than anything vaccine related. Violate the seatbelt or child seat laws and you go to jail or pay a fine. Forego vaccinating your child, and in many states there are no consequences at all. The worst that could happen is losing out on some government freebies.
Your legalistic mind isn't serving you well. The consequences of not wearing a seatbelt is a fine, but the consequences of not following the latest vaccine schedule may be a child who is free of the vaccine induced complications that you are in denial about.
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin:laugh:

As long as you have the Big Book of Informal Fallacies open, check out the section on "equivocation."

The legal consequences of failure to use seat belts and child seats are criminal sanctions, namely fines and jail time.

The worst possible legal consequence of failure to vaccinate is loss of some government freebies. In many states, mine included, there are no legal consequences at all. Thus, death belt mandates are substantially more onerous than vaccine mandates, which are not really mandates at all.[/quote]

As I said, the legal consequences of not vaccinating might be lighter than the seat belt fines, but the health consequences may be greater.

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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
You are assuming that there are non-negligent parents who would choose to allow their children to ride unrestrained because the burgeoning data of seatbelt risks override the benefits.
[quote="Stephen Maturin
Not at all. I know with certainty that there are non-negligent parents who would choose to allow their children to ride unrestrained because the burgeoning data of seatbelt risks override the benefits. Haven't you read any of the articles or watched any of the videos Chuck posted on the subject?
The data shows that the chance of survival in an accident still favors the use of seatbelts.
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
Unsubstantiated pontification noted. :yup: In any event, this is not a conclusion that you or your big government authoritarian cohorts get to make for every parent.
I never said they should.

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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
Show me those non-negligent parents or you're a liar.
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
peacegirl, you quite literally have nothing to do and all day to do it. If you can't be bothered to read any of the many articles or watch any of the many vids linked upthread, then you're beyond hope.
So only if I don't read the vids linked upthread, I'm beyond hope? I thought you said I'm beyond hope long before that. :giggle:

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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
So then, the only assumption here is yours. You're assuming that any parent who declines to use deathbelts or death seats is automatically negligent. What arrogance!Sorry, peacegirl, but you don't get to make that judgment. It's up to each parent to decide what's best for his or her child.
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I'm not making a judgment.
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
Nonsense. You're assuming that every single parent who declines to use deathbelts or death seats is negligent, regardless of how much research they have done, how well they make their case, and how much they love their children. That's quintessentially judgmental. :yup:
I never said or implied that. I said that taking into consideration the stats on lives saved, seatbelt and car seats are still considered the best protection we have. That's why you don't see parents crusading against seatbelt laws.

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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
Right. As you see it, it's okay for government to legislate child safety in derogation of the rights of "minority" parents.
Technically, it's not right just as I don't agree with vaccine mandates.
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
So then, we're back to my original statement at the outset of this latest deathbelt discussion: mandatory seat belt legislation is wrong and should be repealed.

Right?
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Like I said, most parents would go along with the legislation because the stats show that the benefits of wearing a seatbelt outweighs the risks, therefore they are in line with the legislation.
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
But according to you, the legislation is "not right" just the same. Even if we assume that your unsubstantiated pontification about "most parents" is true, would that justify overriding the parental rights of those in the minority?
It would be overriding the parental rights of those in the minority, but those in the minority would most likely be negligent in their parental duties. So, yes, there are negligent parents out there and they would not be worse for the wear to have to abide by the law. If they were worried about the seatbelt getting stuck in a car accident, they could buy a utility knife. There are risks to everything, true. It is choosing the least risky alternative that matters. This is not the same for vaccination Maturin. I know what you're getting at.

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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
I reserve the right to weigh the pros and cons of vaccine administration as circumstances dictate. If there was an epidemic or my child was in a particularly vulnerable situation (such as being in a crowded area where meningitis is known to occur), I may get my child vaccinated. Giving one vaccine increases the chance that there will be no adverse effects. Less is often more as we are learning with the overuse of antibiotics.
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
And that's fine. There's no harm in admitting that you changed your mind and are now a safe vaccines advocate rather than a "bonafide anti-vaxxer." Thinking people don't hesitate to change their minds when the evidence renders an existing position untenable.
Whatever. Call me a safe vaccine advocate. I don't think the present vaccine schedule is necessary or safe. But if there was an epidemic of fatal diseases, I may choose to vaccinate. Vaccinating for measles (especially the three in one vaccine) or chicken pox isn't one of them. But I would consider vaccinating for pneumonia or meningitis depending on certain conditions.

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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
So then, according to you, when it comes to the dangers of seat belts and child seats parents should just don their blinders, toe the line, and obey the law like good little sheeple.

Whatever you say, Goebbels.
I didn't say that
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Originally Posted by Stephen Maturin
What you said was that as to seat belts and car seats, parents shouldn't do any safety-related due diligence; since they're stuck obeying the law in any event, researching the safety issues can only cause them grief.

In other words, according to you, when it comes to the dangers of seat belts and child seats parents should just don their blinders, toe the line, and obey the law like good little sheeple.
I never said that. I said that once something becomes law, people often don't feel they have a choice. If the law is unjust or people are getting hurt by the law, they will fight back as we are seeing with vaccine mandates.
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