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Old 12-22-2007, 07:10 AM
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Default Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

[i]School officials say the 5th grader was brown-bagging it. She brought a piece of steak for her lunch, but she also brought a steak knife. That's when deputies were called.

It happened in the cafeteria at Sunrise Elementary School. The 10-year-old used the knife to cut the meat.

"She did not use it inappropriately. She did not threaten anyone with it. She didn't pull it out and brandish it. Nothing of that nature," explained Marion County School Spokesman Kevin Christian.

But a couple of teachers took the utensil and called the sheriff. When deputies arrived, they were unable to get the child's parents on the phone, so they arrested her and took her to the county's juvenile assessment center.

"And we didn't handcuff her or treat her like a criminal. But, we took her to the assessment center to be assessed," said Capt. James Pogue, Marion County Sheriff's Office.

School officials said it doesn't matter what the knife was being used for. They said they had no choice.

"Anytime there's a weapon on campus, yes, we have to report it and we aggressively report it because we don't want to take any chances, regardless," Christian said.

But the sheriff's office said the extreme measures in what some may say was a harmless incident had to do with school policy, not theirs.

"But once we're notified, we have to take some type of action," Pogue explained.

The student now faces a felony charge for the possession of a weapon on school property and the principal suspended her for ten days. The parents of the girl could not be reached for comment.

The sheriff's office has turned the case over to the State Attorney's Office.


Knife At Lunch Gets 10-Year-Old Girl Arrested At School - News Story - WFTV Orlando
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  #2  
Old 12-22-2007, 07:12 AM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

ah, 'merica...
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Old 12-22-2007, 08:58 AM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

You do go on. Over the last decade or so Canadian schools have been adopting the same sort of zero tolerance policies that American schools have, claiming it reduces violence in schools. Despite that claim, 54% of students in one Canadian study claimed to have been victims of violence in school.
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Old 12-22-2007, 12:44 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

I don't think there is necessarily a correlation between events and location, these things can happen anywhere. It's unfortunate that the United States, with its huge population and fragmented education system, is statistically more likely to throw up these cases than smaller countries.


The issue for me is not the location, but the Pythonesque logic. I laughed at the reasoning that 'all witches float, therefore if she floats,she's a witch'. When the argument is promoted as 'all 10 year old knife-wielding sociopaths have a knife, therefore all 10 year olds with knives'......etc
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Old 12-22-2007, 01:02 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

They are actually bringing charges? Sweet, fucking...

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Old 12-22-2007, 01:20 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

Of course now they've arrested her they bring charges.

Otherwise they would look like fools.

Oh wait...:dumbass:
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Old 12-22-2007, 03:50 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

How come I never got steak for lunch?
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Old 12-22-2007, 06:47 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

Calling something a 'weapon' when its obvious intended use is not for violence makes no sense. Perhaps I could see the point if she was using a bayonet or a machete.
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Old 12-22-2007, 07:13 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

Or a stick of dynamite :undyna:
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Old 12-22-2007, 08:19 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

Maybe the police had no choice in taking her away from school grounds, but they certainly don't have to charge her with anything. What a bunch of morans.
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Old 12-22-2007, 08:55 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

Quote:
What a bunch of morans
Oi!

Quote:
Calling something a 'weapon' when its obvious intended use is not for violence makes no sense
The obvious intended use for an angle socket wrench in a car isn't a weapon either, but it can be. The 'Offensive Weapon' laws in the UK/Ireland rely very much on the common sense of the officer in question. Walk down the high street with a hammer when you're a carpenter about to do a job in a shop, and you'll be fine. Walk down the same high street with the same hammer when you're a student wearing gang colours, and you're liable to get done in.

Again, though, this relies purely on the application of judgement, something which seems lacking around here.

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Old 12-22-2007, 09:07 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

Ditto "burglar tools."
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Old 12-22-2007, 10:27 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

Doesn't get any better on the other coast.

Booze-filled candy gets girl suspended - Weird news - MSNBC.com

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Old 12-22-2007, 10:59 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

:sigh:
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Old 12-23-2007, 12:12 AM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

"Every tool is a weapon if you hold it right." - Ani Difranco

When you make taking a knife to school a violent offense then only violent offenders will take knifes to school.

If the knife was placed in her lunch bag by her parent then why isn't the blame being directed to the parent? If any charges were brought forth they should be directed to the parent.
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Old 12-23-2007, 12:49 AM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

My kids didn't go armed with any less than a Smith & Wesson .44 Magnum, no silly little steak knives or sporks for them.
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  #17  
Old 12-23-2007, 01:59 AM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

I trust that you have taught them how to cut steak without messy powder burns.....
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Old 12-23-2007, 03:34 AM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

In fairness, it'll probably kill off any bacteria.

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Old 12-23-2007, 03:51 AM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Artemis Entreri View Post
"Every tool is a weapon if you hold it right." - Ani Difranco
I probably shouldn't be snickering at that so much.
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Old 12-23-2007, 03:57 AM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

That's just ridiculous. :rolleyes:
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Old 12-23-2007, 04:04 AM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

:giggle:
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Old 12-23-2007, 05:26 AM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

Quote:
The State Education Code "says (an) intoxicant of any kind. It doesn't mention flavor, size or quantity," Whisenand said. "Any type of alcohol can be cause of suspension. I certainly wouldn't call it candy."
Seems to me that the relevant term in that quote is the word 'can'. That would seem to imply that some discretion is available to school authorities when it comes to the application of a penalty.

On the knife thing. When I was about 15 or so I was stopped by a policeman and subjected to a search (there was no probable cause, but what did I know). He told me to empty my pockets. One of the items in my pocket was a small penknife. The kind with two blades, the longest being maybe two or three inches. I always carried that knife in my pocket, at home and at school. So he starts in on this routine about how that is a dangerous weapon. I pointed out that stick or a rock was a dangerous weapon too. It all depended upon how you intended to use it. The upshot was that he didn't find anything illegal on me and let me go on my way, after returning my knife. I sure was glad that he didn't have me take off my boots, cause that was where I kept my stash.
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Old 12-23-2007, 05:36 AM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

I'd like to give the steak knife to one of those admins, then pick up the lunch chair the girl sat in. We'll see which is more cause for concern.


&^%$@%^ @*^%(*$# ®$%!!!
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Old 12-23-2007, 09:47 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

Are you trying to convince them to bolt all the chairs to the floor?
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Old 12-23-2007, 09:55 PM
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Default Re: Zero tolerance equals total abdication of common sense?

Or just all knives
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