#376  
Old 04-18-2015, 12:39 AM
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Default Re: DC Nation

No, New 52 is not a full reboot. There's a lot of the Batman stuff that survived even if other characters have been mostly remade. I can't speak to much beyond the Holy Trinity or Justice League stuff.
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  #377  
Old 04-18-2015, 04:40 AM
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Reading Re: DC Nation

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Originally Posted by wei yau View Post
Weirdly enough, Crisis was my first entry into the DC universe. I didn't know most of the characters, but wanted to learn so much more about them. Which I did, over the course of many many years.

And I have no regrets. Ymir's Blood is absolutely right on how the whole thing fell apart almost immediately after the end of Crisis. Perhaps it could never have worked without a complete reboot, which is what the New 52 is, right?
I came in in the middle of Crisis, having been all Marvel before my brother started picking up DC books. The first run of Who's Who was coming out at the same time and I tracked down all of those, which helped a lot as it gave the Pre-Crisis history of the characters and tried to explain some of the retcons.
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  #378  
Old 04-18-2015, 06:15 AM
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Default Re: DC Nation

So are we not going to talk about the trailer?
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Old 04-18-2015, 06:41 AM
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Default Re: DC Nation

Marvel thrad is :rarrow: that way. Unlessen you want to start a new one for the rebooted new & improved War of the Stars. Oh wait. There's been an official release for it. That hadn't happened last I looked.


The tone of it suggests that they're going for a straight up Frank Miller style character assassination for all the characters. We've already seen the Superman who kinda isn't. And now we have a Batman who straight up murders people with his wonderful toys. I have yet to see anything I like concerning the Dawn of Justice. The angle they're playing at no wonder Jonathan Kent didn't want Clark to save kids on a schoolbus.
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  #380  
Old 04-18-2015, 06:44 AM
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Default Re: DC Nation

Oh, and this gave me a good long chuckle.

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  #381  
Old 04-18-2015, 06:26 PM
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Default Re: DC Nation

The very first thing I thought of, "That looks just like the power suit in Lego Batman. You can use it to blow up silver metallic Lego pieces."
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  #382  
Old 04-21-2015, 02:25 AM
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The tone of it suggests that they're going for a straight up Frank Miller style character assassination for all the characters. We've already seen the Superman who kinda isn't. And now we have a Batman who straight up murders people with his wonderful toys. I have yet to see anything I like concerning the Dawn of Justice. The angle they're playing at no wonder Jonathan Kent didn't want Clark to save kids on a schoolbus.
I'm trying so hard not to be that guy. I want to be accepting and open minded and give things a chance. I already set aside my Star Wars pre-hate and am okay with the Episode VII (though I worry that it will use nostalgia as a crutch as much as Abrams "Star Trek").

But, this...this thing.

Ugh.

Someone tells me that it's set in a universe where Batman already existed, though is largely believed to be an urban legend. He comes out of retirement to deal with Superman? Or maybe some army of Mutants who rise out of the ruins of Metropolis (though there is no way those are rubber bullets).

So, maybe it's Dark Knight Returns with Superman being asked by the government to put down a rogue Batman.

I don't know.

DKR only worked because you had years of backstory between Batman and Superman. While, I prefer the relationship they have in the DCAU than Miller's smug fascist Batman and weak willed Superman, I have to acknowledge that their duel in DKR was a seminal event.

But, there are so many things that don't make sense to me. The Superman shield on the jackbooted thugs. The dialogue in the VO by Alfred (wait...who's he talking about? Superman or Batman? And is what he is saying a good thing or a bad thing?)

And who knows how Wonder Woman and Aquaman even fit into here. How is this the Dawn of Justice, when it looks like all these guys are gonna do is fight each other?

With every bit of the DC Cinematic Universe that comes together, I believe that we have already seen the best possible version of the DC Universe in the DCAU.

Warner Bros should have put Bruce Timm in charge of this thing.
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  #383  
Old 04-21-2015, 03:17 AM
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Default Re: DC Nation

There are definitely things to like about the Dark Knight Returns. I wasn't into comics at that point in my life but I understand the historical context and how it fits and is beloved. But that fight at the end is nothing but frothing at the mouth idiocy. I hate that whole setup and scene. Frank Miller actually convinced me to hate Batman. Well, that and the Batman with prep fanboys.

The two teasers thus far have done nothing to help me try and be less subjective about the film. But sitting here now, I can try and be as charitable as possible. If I were just average Hugh Mann in the world where Man of Steel happened, I'd be angry and afraid of the seemingly omnipotent alien being who helped destroy half of Metropolis. I don't doubt that there would be those weirdos who would worship that nigh all powerful alien as well.

Then there's this third faction of humanity. The soldiers, let me go ahead and call them the Soldiers of New Krypton, the Superman Brigade. I don't know. They'll definitely have some ominous name. In MoS Jor El said that Clark could be a beacon to mankind.

Quote:
You will give the people of Earth an ideal to strive towards. They will race behind you, they will stumble, they will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun, Kal. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders.
Let's say that these soldiers represent a big block of well meaning but violent jackanapes who do the stumbling and falling. Instead of using their minds to build a future or anything resembling compassion, they use guns and oppression to either prepare for the next alien invasion or fight a no holds barred war on crime around the world. A Mercenaries Without Borders if you will.

But what about Batman? Well, I don't know. Outside of saving crashing Russian rockets or rescuing kittens out of trees, Superman himself is rather reclusive. He doesn't do press conferences, doesn't hang around after the action is over. Batman, always being an idiot in the movies, goes off half-cocked itching for a fight rather than, you know, being the World's Greatest Detective. And then they fight for a while until Batman realizes he's not dead yet because Superman isn't a maniacal murderer.


Then they team up and are total Justice Bros.

But none of that really feels like a good enough movie. I mean, there's no Luthor and there's no real estate deal or anything. I don't know how to fit those pieces in. Despite all the talk from the last movie about Hope and It's Not an S, that wasn't the most hopeful of movies. And this one isn't even talking about that so who knows how bleak it will actually be.
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  #384  
Old 04-21-2015, 04:24 AM
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Default Re: DC Nation

Miller has come out and said he doesn't really like Superman. I never cared for DKR, and what Miller has done since then certainly hasn't inspired me to change my opinion.
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  #385  
Old 04-21-2015, 06:09 PM
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Default Re: DC Nation

According to my grandson, in the DC Comics Batman vs Superman, Batman wins by superior intellect, oh, and kryptonite batarang and other stuff.
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Old 04-21-2015, 06:20 PM
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Default Re: DC Nation

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Originally Posted by BrotherMan View Post
Marvel thrad is :rarrow: that way. Unlessen you want to start a new one for the rebooted new & improved War of the Stars. Oh wait. There's been an official release for it. That hadn't happened last I looked.


The tone of it suggests that they're going for a straight up Frank Miller style character assassination for all the characters. We've already seen the Superman who kinda isn't. And now we have a Batman who straight up murders people with his wonderful toys. I have yet to see anything I like concerning the Dawn of Justice. The angle they're playing at no wonder Jonathan Kent didn't want Clark to save kids on a schoolbus.
I am in complete disagreement with you on matters of opinion but I agree on matters of fact. Since the idea of the story was announced, I assumed a storyline similar to The Dark Knight Returns. This trailer gives some shape to the story. I find it to be more different from DKR than I thought it would be and incredibly awesome.

So yes, some Millar, but in my opinion not enough.

The trailer makes me want to see the film.
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  #387  
Old 04-21-2015, 06:22 PM
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Default Re: DC Nation

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Originally Posted by Ymir's blood View Post
Miller has come out and said he doesn't really like Superman. I never cared for DKR, and what Miller has done since then certainly hasn't inspired me to change my opinion.
I loved Year One and DKR, I held Miller in high esteem. I have since realized that his warped, often misogynistic work reflects some sort of Platonic ideal that he holds which makes his work shittier.

I definitely view DKR as a sort of proFascism work in a way that did not occur to me twenty years ago.

I guess that I had a different starting point but we are probably in similar places in regards to Miller now.
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  #388  
Old 04-30-2015, 12:08 PM
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My DCTV update for this week: Everyone is racing towards their season finale cliff hangers. Some I'm looking forward to and others I can't wait until it's just over.

Got ham: Nygma is the Riddler, guys. Did you know that? He's murdered his first victim but it was a totes accident on purpose. He's still a major creep but at least he doesn't abuse the women in his life so he's not as bad as you think. Ladies the line starts to the left!

Somehow the Penguin is still alive. What started as the breakout character of the show has devolved into tedium. Now he's most cleverly played the two big bosses against one another and started a city wide gang war. Which for some reason the police actually care about.

Fish Mooney won't be returning next season and we'll find out why next week. Based on what she's been through recently I'm amazed either group she interacted with didn't already kill her. Last time we saw her she had been gut shot while escaping. I'm assuming she succumbs to her injuries.

The last few episodes were primarily about a serial killer called the Ogre. Because the cops in Gotham are both corrupt and incompetent, they were all afraid of tracking him down. Until brave and upright Jim Gordon that is. When Jim gets on the case no one can dissuade him, including the Ogre - who threatens to go after the one closest to him. Initially we're lead to believe that this means the lovely Dr. Lee. But no! Barbara Kean is the only woman that the Ogre is aware of Gordon having a thing for!

Kean is wooed and then imprisoned. Gordon breaks bad. Eventually, Kean's parents are murdered. Gordon and Bullock arrive too late. The showdown ends with the Ogre dead, Bullock with another concussion and Barbara is, well, we don't really know. She's not in her right mind.

Bruce is haunted by the memory of Selina killing the guy what stabbed Alfred. Bruce's clever plan to get any secrets from the CEO(?) of Wayne Ent. is out clevered. The Boss tells Bruce that of course the company is evil, it is a company after all, and that even Bruce's so-believed righteous and decent father knew all these secrets. We also meet Mr. Fox.


The Bat-Arrow: Oliver is gone full Batman. Now he's acceded to become the Heir to the Demon, complete with R'as' daughter Talia Nyssa to become his wife. Oliver did this just so Thea could be revived by a Lazarus Pit. Laurel finally uses a Canary Cry. It's sort of underwhelming. Nothing else of any interest happens.


Flash: Everyone's cards are one the table now. Iris now believes that Barry may be the Flash. Not because anyone told her or anything. The Flash Team knows that Wells is really Eobard and he's from the far future. Best minor detail: We may be getting a brighter suit and a proper Flash emblem. Next week: GRODD.


iZombie (this is here because Vertigo): Fantastic and fun new show. Rose McIver is just killing it. The writing for Liv is on point as is her portrayal. The conceit for the show, if you're not aware: She's a zombie and any time she has a gnosh of brains she demonstrates some of that person's personality and or knowledge. That's how she helps solve their murders. A bonus is her supporting cast. Chiefly (no pun), the CME Dr Ravi Chakrabarti. His intellectual curiosity about zombism is, forgive me for this pun, infectious. They have a fun dynamic working together.
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  #389  
Old 05-01-2015, 02:21 AM
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Thank you, Mr. Bort. You are smart and I agree with everything you say.

Thanks to Daredevil and iZombie, I have decided that this will be my last season of Gotham. I gave it a full season and while there were some points of promise, it eventually devolved into pablum. Even the promise of no more Fish isn't enough to bring me back.

I'll still watch Arrow, because it's tied so tightly to the Flash. I dislike the whole Bat-Arrow thing and cannot wait for it to end. I loathe the Atom, every single time I see him I think how much better it would be if it were the Blue Beetle. The Atom suit just does not make sense. Ugh.

Flash. Still in love with this show, though I have to grit my teeth whenever they deal with Iris. They are doing the character and the actress a huge disservice with how they write her. But, Grodd. Man. GRODD.

iZombie. Hooboy this show is good. I've never watched Veronica Mars, but I hear tell that this resembles it greatly. I'm only three episodes in, so I've got three more to catch up on, but it's really, really good. Just the right mix of smarts, humor and pathos.
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  #390  
Old 05-01-2015, 05:57 PM
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People keep telling me it was supposed to be Blue Beetle but DC said they couldn't use him for some reason. I was skeptical about it, but I've been rewatching season two and, what do you know? there was a reference to Kord Industries in the Clock King episode. I thought this weeks episode of Arrow was the first to get Ra's al Ghul right and it made the errors of every other episode this season more glaring.

Totally happy with The Flash, though. SO EXCITED FOR GRODD! And Iris made me cry in the flashback this week. Which stands as more proof that the writers have been letting her down all season. Clearly the actress isn't the problem.
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  #391  
Old 05-01-2015, 07:26 PM
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Agreed.
Become the Demon's head, don't become the Demon's head, become the Demon's balls instead, don't become the Demon's balls, I'm starting not to care.
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  #392  
Old 05-05-2015, 04:49 AM
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So, I picked up from the library "Brightest Day" Volume 1 from the library, not sure I'm picking the right titles to start with.... I found it interesting, even if I didn't understand a lot of it. I think with Volume 1, even the fans who knew all the characters weren't supposed to understand it all, and I can handle that.

I also picked up a New 52 title, "Red Lantern Corps" which I enjoyed, except for the fact that I did not need to know Bleez's ass so intimately. Seriously, it was highlighted every 3 pages or so, to my embarrassment.
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  #393  
Old 05-08-2015, 04:48 AM
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This week on Gotham's season finale: Just the worst. Terrible from top to bottom, beginning to end. Damn near every scene had some convenience or contrivance to get through it.

By some miracle Fish survived getting shot. Just like how we don't know how she got captured off that ship, she landed the helicopter somewhere. She comes back to Gotham on a dingy. Literally floats onto some shore on a tiny little row boat. That's the contrivance. The convenience is that she comes ashore right in front of Selina and some other street rats. Further, Fish somehow co opts them into being her new gang. An ever more further contrivience, she gets her hands on Falcone, Gordon, Bullock and Kappleput, which she offers in trade to Marone.

If I tried to explain how that trade goes down in any detail you won't believe me. Let me brief it: Marone is an idiot this episode and continually insults Fish. Enough so that she simply shoots him in the head. In the ensuing confusion the previously captured and handcuffed Falcone, Gordon, Bullock and Kappleput escape. Gordon, being the upstanding and law and order cop that he is decides to make a deal with Falcone, calling him "the least worst" option, and only he can get a lid back on the gang war that's been tearing Gotham apart.

The end result of the gang war is Fish gets thrown off a building. Kappleput declares him the King of Gotham. Falcone may or may not be going out of town. Falcone also, for no explainable reason, has a knife that was given to him by Gordon's father (who was a "good man," good luck figuring that out). He gives this knife to Gordon for reasons.

And the season ending stinger is Bruce and Alfred find a hidden entrance to a hidden room in Stately Wayne Manor.


Arrow: Oliver is a moron and it looks like he's the smartest one of the group. And that's terrible. He's also one step closer to being the Bat-Arrow. Now he's married to the Daughter of the Demon. And apparently this is all according to his plan which he totally planned ahead of time with his good buddy Merlin.

For no good reason despite hating Merlin and not trusting anything he says, the Arrow Team make a trip to Nanda Parbat to destroy the macguffin. But it's a double bat-gambit and Ra's was expecting some goody two shoes to come along and double fooled them. They get captured and imprisoned. And as of the end of the episode it looks like they are going to die!

Also, Thea finds Roy and then loses him right away. But now she has the red Arsenal suit so, you know.


Now, iZombie was totally good this week. The mystery of the week was, well, the mystery of the week. Liv eats the brain of a radio psychotherapist and overanalyzes everyone around her.

The big take aways from this week are: Peyton and Ravi are going on a date. Major thinks there's more to the missing kids despite everyone telling him the case is closed. The big reveal this week is that Liv's new main squeeze is getting his brains from the evil Blaine.


Flash. All I have to say is GRODD. You know, there was a time when I would have hated - okay, too strong "not enjoyed" - an evil ape as an enemy. It's just too damn goofy. But after so much indoctrination by JL/U, Grodd and Ultrahumanite were among my favorites. Even further: I was pretty content at least this season to just know Grodd was out there, waiting to reveal himself. So it's really exciting to see him in action, even if it isn't totally and fully realized. He was fully CGI and it looks really good for a TV show. I was ready to be skeptical about it, but it turns out p good. In fact, Grodd is much more terrifying than any villain we've seen. That scene with Joe begging for his life? I mean, DAMN.

And now that Welles is out of his closet, so to speak, his heel face turn is beautiful to watch. It was great watching him be cagey and constrained all season. Now that he's himself, though? He's enjoying being his regular evil self.
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  #394  
Old 05-08-2015, 06:52 AM
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They seem confused on Arrow, showing us how Ollie isn't really evil means it doesn't matter what cliff hanger evil plan with lazers attached to ninjas is because we already know there's no real cliff hanger, everyone will be fine and not just because they are main characters.

The Flash, you left out the fucking finally about Iris being let in and rightfully telling everyone off. Joe's plan of keeping someone who is clearly a target safe by keeping everything a secret is Arrow level of stupid asshat thinking.
I generally hate monkeys (anyone else auto correct Joe when he called Grodd a monkey?) in TV shows. If JMS's thing was no kids and no robots, mine would be no monkeys. Shows like Gilligan's Island have soured me on the comedy relief monkey, and that generally goes for apes too and yet, Grodd was awesome! Made extra scary by the clearly growing intellect without any guidance, combined with the power of a telepathic Gorilla. 'Eiling hurt me, so I hurt Eiling' is a great contrast to the civilized gentleman's wager the flash has made with the Rogues.

I also quite like the constant hints that Kaitlin and Cisco will eventually be metas without overtly saying it.
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  #395  
Old 05-08-2015, 08:04 AM
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Default Re: DC Nation

:mourn:

You are so right. That's what I get for saving the post for when I've watched all the DC stuff for the week. I'm so very glad that 1) Iris figured it out on her own sparked (pun intended) by talking to the Flash and 2) she laid into everyone about it. They all definitely deserved it.

I'm not blanketly anti-monkey. As a general rule, I like monkeys and apes of all sorts. There are instances of course where it's not a great idea to have a monkey in a movie or on tv. I extra hated on Ross from Friends for having Marcel. More than half of that hate is plain ol' Ross hate, but also in the mix were his stupid reasons for having one and then not taking care of him. But when the monkey isn't just a punchline or a cheap laugh, I can be down with it.

I thought the non-cliff hanger of Arrow was even barely worth mentioning for the exact reason you stated. I already know that Katana is going to play a pivotal role in saving the Arrow-Friends that is if a) they aren't already inoculated or b) that wasn't the Alpha-Omega disease and either al Sahim or Merlin swapped it because this is all going according to their plan that they totally planned ahead of time.
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  #396  
Old 05-08-2015, 10:34 PM
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I keep hearing all these complaints about the non-cliff hanger on Arrow and I don't get it. I must be watching the show differently than you and most of the AV Club commenters. I never expected suspense over whether Ollie was evil or would kill his friends. To me the suspense comes from when Ra's is going to bust him on it. How long can he string Ra's along is the question in my mind. Or, in this case, how can he fake their deaths in a convincing enough way? That's my cliff hanger.

I loved Grodd completely, but the CGI wasn't great. I also loved Iris going of on everyone. And Joe, fucking Joe West, can be completely stupid and over-protective and apologize so sweetly that you can't stay mad. He can also whimper in the most heart-breaking way. Jesse L. Martin brings so damn much to that show. He and Tom Cavanaugh deserve all the awards.
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Old 05-08-2015, 11:11 PM
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I read some of your foolish scree, then just skimmed the rest.
 
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It's not so much that it's an actual cliff hanger but that they spent so much time trying to make it up to be a cliff hanger even though it's clearly a non event compared to everything else.

I think I'm also one of the few that found the CGI to be fine. Sure it wasn't perfect but it still looked quite good especially for a TV show, although I don't watch in super HD. In the close ups they may have used animatronics.
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  #398  
Old 05-08-2015, 11:26 PM
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Yeah, I'm totally okay with the CGI Grodd. There's no uncanny valley like there can be with tv level CGI sometimes.

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Jesse L. Martin brings so damn much to that show. He and Tom Cavanaugh deserve all the awards.
All my yesses to this. I like Grant Gustin as the Flash and I think he's doing really well, but Martin and Cavanaugh definitely show their veteran experience in the field.

And, you know Janet? Honestly? There's no reason for Ra's to trust Oliver. Like, nothing. He's been handed the largest idiot ball of all. I think Batman just gets lucky when he outwits Ra's. There's now way the BatArrow, in any incarnation, can match that.
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Old 05-09-2015, 12:15 AM
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Constantine among others cancelled by NBC

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From Warner Bros. Television, Constantine completed its 13-episode run in February very quietly. The DC Comics adaptation of Hellblazer starring Matt Ryan concluded with 3 million total viewers and was paired with veteran Grimm, as NBC continues to try to find a good companion for the genre show. Despite rumors of the David Goyer drama moving to corporate sibling Syfy, the VFX-heavy series appears doomed to join Friday predecessors including Dracula and Crossbones in the canceled heap, marking a rare miss for DC. Warner Bros. is expected to shop the series elsewhere. NBC has already picked up four new dramas for next season, but the cancellation of Constantine makes it the only broadcast network without a comic book property.
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Old 05-09-2015, 06:12 PM
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Stephen Amell tweeted last night that if anyone picks up Constantine he will guest star. Which is cool. It would be nice to expand the universe like that.

There was only one bit of Grodd CGI that bothered me, and only on the rewatch. It was when he took off running down the tunnel toward Barry. Someone in the AV Club comments had referred to the CGI as weightless and when I watched his first leap I thought that was exactly the right word for it. None of the rest of it bothered me, even the climb up the building.
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