Guilty Pleasures

[The Lone Ranger]

Originally Posted by Adam

I sort of do too, and I tell myself that there's a difference on looking down on something because it's lowbrow and looking down on something because it's weird voyeur porn about someone else's train wreck of a life.

I think that's a fair and perfectly reasonable statement.

[Ensign Steve]

Originally Posted by Adam

I sort of do too, and I tell myself that there's a difference between looking down on something because it's lowbrow and looking down on something because it's weird voyeur porn about someone else's train wreck of a life.

I haven't watched much Honey BooBoo, but I have watched plenty of Toddlers & Tiaras which it was spun off from, and I read some about HBB and her mom and them in the People magazine and the blogs and stuff, and essentially one of the things that is so appealing about the show is that they really are sweet people and the public fell in love with them in spite of ourselves. This is in direct contrast to Duck Dynasty who are a bunch of fake assholes. (I mean fake people, real assholes)

I bring it up because I was wearing a t-shirt from the LA Pride run to bootcamp one day, and the trainer asked me if it meant gay pride, and I said yes, and she says, "I guess you aren't watching Duck Dynasty anymore then, are you?" and I laughed and said "No, but I wasn't really into before, either. Honey BooBoo, on the other hand..." Which, yeah, I essentially lied about whether I watch this show, but I wanted to make it clear to these Georgia ladies that I am aware that it is possible to be southern or country or redneck or whatever you want to call it without being a complete asshole.

[lisarea]

I haven't actually seen (a whole of) Honey Boo Boo or the Kardashian show, so if I'm way off, fight me and you win.

Honey Boo Boo is a child, which is problematic, but the Kardashians are adults who are making some pretty good money I assume by playing themselves on TV.

How is that really concretely different from a biographical or lifestyle documentary, apart from the TV versions usually being more scripted? Would you judge someone the same for enjoying Marwencol or Grey Gardens or Brother's Keeper or the Up series? They're really all pretty voyeuristic, and the subjects' lives are trainwrecks to varying degrees, but people never seem embarrassed about liking those.

Isn't that probably some sort of cultural value judgment, like a high vs. lowbrow sort of thing? Not that it's unwarranted or anything, because reality TV is superficial and lacking the nuance, analysis, and stylistic elements that makes those documentaries great. But that's also the difference between most low vs. high brow media.

I don't think it's bad to make those distinctions, BTW.

[Janet]

I used to sometimes find myself getting mad at reality shows when they manipulated the results and my emotions. I'm talking things like Four Weddings which I used to watch for lack of anything better on Friday nights. But then I stopped and realized that I admire well scripted and well edited dramatic shows, so why would I scorn the same skills when applied to so-called reality shows? Now I just get bored with the repetitive narrative and stop watching. I also started noticing that more often than not the home improvement type shows always made the woman of the couple come off as bitchy and now I can't watch them like I used to anymore.

I need to stop noticing things or only watch when my brain has shut off for the day.

And I watch Toddlers and Tiaras or used to before I had the true crime channel. I usually bring that up when saying I don't watch the Kardashians so people don't think it's because I'm snobby, it's just because I'm not interested.

[LadyShea]

Originally Posted by lisarea

I haven't actually seen (a whole of) Honey Boo Boo or the Kardashian show, so if I'm way off, fight me and you win.

Honey Boo Boo is a child, which is problematic, but the Kardashians are adults who are making some pretty good money I assume by playing themselves on TV.

How is that really concretely different from a biographical or lifestyle documentary, apart from the TV versions usually being more scripted? Would you judge someone the same for enjoying Marwencol or Grey Gardens or Brother's Keeper or the Up series? They're really all pretty voyeuristic, and the subjects' lives are trainwrecks to varying degrees, but people never seem embarrassed about liking those.

Isn't that probably some sort of cultural value judgment, like a high vs. lowbrow sort of thing? Not that it's unwarranted or anything, because reality TV is superficial and lacking the nuance, analysis, and stylistic elements that makes those documentaries great. But that's also the difference between most low vs. high brow media.

I don't think it's bad to make those distinctions, BTW.

LOL, that's a lot of thinking hard. I was mostly kidding with my original statement, but I do happen to think that 99% of (voyeur type) reality TV is about really gross people whose lives have had no significant or positive impact on society, or history, or technology, or whatever and who have nothing to teach me...and I don't personally find their televised lives interesting, informative, enlightening or enriching in any way. I can see people living life most anywhere.

Documentaries and biographies quite often are interesting, informative, enlightening, or enriching in some way. I can often learn something or be inspired by stuff like home improvement shows, and some reality competitions.

[Qingdai]

I do like watching train wreck of life shows, sometimes, if they aren't overly scripted. My Big Fat Gypsy Wedding for example. Anthropology, and since I was born on another planet, I don't understand instinctively what makes people make so many seemingly dysfunctional decisions, so those sort of things help me, in the short term, figure out why people do make such seemingly illogical decisions.
It's like the poverty essay I linked to on here, sometimes seemingly bad decisions can be functional for the short term or the situation I don't understand. The show about the octuplets, I'm sure even though it made me cringe for multiple reasons, made having 8 babies possible.

[Miisa]

It's not really a dislike of lowbrow things for me, but I feel a certain amount of guilt about watching shows that obviously manipulate the heartstrings and intentionally make you go aww and oooh, and then afterwards you just feel cheap and used by some network. For me, that is Extreme Makeover: Home Edition. And there is only so much treacle I can take with that either, let alone the startling and frankly tiring exuberance of the hosts.

So I feel good while watching and bad afterwards, therefore a guilty pleasure. Like too much cake.

[Gonzo]

buying things on ebay with college loan refund money...

mostly guilt.

[thedoc]

We like to watch Dancing with the Stars. I like to watch the different dance styles and, from the judges comments, learn what was right and wrong with the dance. I also enjoy the attractive women in skimpy outfits.

Mostly Pleasure, Can't think of much to feel guilty about.

[lisarea]

Originally Posted by LadyShea

LOL, that's a lot of thinking hard.

LOL I know right? But it's the rule that if I see something that I don't really understand, I have to overthink it for a really long time until I figure it out. IT IS VITALLY IMPORTANT THAT I DO THIS.

[chunksmediocrites]

At some point in my life I realized the people I respected didn't care what others thought of what music they listened to, books they read, hobbies, or what have you, and were just up front about it whether or not it was cool. I am judgy, but attempt to ease back with a keen recognition that I like some pretty bad shlock, like Rob Schneider movies. But I still do judge a friend who enjoys and owns all the seasons of Two-and-a-Half Men, though I can admire his guilt-free enjoyment of such.... I guess.

And if someone tells me they love Dinosaur Comics I think a lot less of them because that shit is straight up atrocious and I hate it with a white-hot ball of fury.

[Ensign Steve]

FYI, my Honey BooBoo post was not my guilty pleasure, because I don't feel guilty about that. A short list of things that I am into that I do not feel guilty about include watching reality TV shows about weight loss or hoarding, listening to popular music on the radio, reading gossip magazines like US Weekly and People, and watching TMZ.

My actual guilty pleasures that I do feel guilty about are how much I love football, especially college football, despite how completely sexist and rapey the culture is, and working really hard to remain skinny because of how much it impresses people I don't care about and my mom.

[lisarea]

Originally Posted by Miisa

It's not really a dislike of lowbrow things for me, but I feel a certain amount of guilt about watching shows that obviously manipulate the heartstrings and intentionally make you go aww and oooh, and then afterwards you just feel cheap and used by some network.

OMG yes, I have watched those sort of shows, and still do sometimes, but UGH THE FUCKING MAKEOVER SHOW FORMULA.

Act 1: The Tour of Shame and Filth. We are introduced to the problem area, whether it's a home, a business, or a human, marveling at the horrors. The Tweety Bird shirt worn in public! The airbrushed triptych and mismatched curtains! OH GOD THOSE PEPPERCORNS ARE MOVING! If I do anything that I should feel guilty about, it's that I sometimes watch the first act of makeover shows, because the outrage is usually pretty over the top. On restaurant makeover shows, this is usually where the host, overcome with moral outrage, summarily closes the restaurant and kicks out all the customers. Every now and again, they get really lucky and someone will say they don't feel well, so they can call 911 and end this segment with a shot of the emergency vehicles. I wish they could sort out some way to do this with a human makeover show, though. Like someone's outfits are SO BAD that they have to call an ambulance.

Act 2: Help me, Maury! Wherein the makeover subject initially resists, then slowly acquiesces to the reasonable suggestions of the experts, who identify the complex psychological motivations for the problem and begin the healing process under their firm but loving guidance. If you can work a crying child into this segment, that goes into the promos.

Act 3: THE ACTION PACKED CLIMAX!!1! With the psychological barriers all but demolished, the final battle is the battle of resources! Will they be able to stretch the budget to accommodate the needed changes? Will time run out before the end of the show? How will the problem be solved before the final commercial break?

Denouement: The reveal! Imagine Peer Gynt's Morning Mood playing as the fresh new beginning is revealed in the final moments of the show. Tears of joy are shed! Effusive bystanders marvel at the fresh, vibrant new thing!

That's pretty much the whole reason I don't watch those shows much anymore. The story arc is always the same, and it takes up so much of the show that it almost doesn't matter what the actual subject is because there isn't time for that, what with all the interpersonal drama.

[Ensign Steve]

Originally Posted by lisarea

Act 1: The Tour of Shame and Filth. We are introduced to the problem area, whether it's a home, a business, or a human, marveling at the horrors. The Tweety Bird shirt worn in public! The airbrushed triptych and mismatched curtains! OH GOD THOSE PEPPERCORNS ARE MOVING! If I do anything that I should feel guilty about, it's that I sometimes watch the first act of makeover shows, because the outrage is usually pretty over the top. On restaurant makeover shows, this is usually where the host, overcome with moral outrage, summarily closes the restaurant and kicks out all the customers. Every now and again, they get really lucky and someone will say they don't feel well, so they can call 911 and end this segment with a shot of the emergency vehicles. I wish they could sort out some way to do this with a human makeover show, though. Like someone's outfits are SO BAD that they have to call an ambulance.

Act 2: Help me, Maury! Wherein the makeover subject initially resists, then slowly acquiesces to the reasonable suggestions of the experts, who identify the complex psychological motivations for the problem and begin the healing process under their firm but loving guidance. If you can work a crying child into this segment, that goes into the promos.

Act 3: THE ACTION PACKED CLIMAX!!1! With the psychological barriers all but demolished, the final battle is the battle of resources! Will they be able to stretch the budget to accommodate the needed changes? Will time run out before the end of the show? How will the problem be solved before the final commercial break?

Denouement: The reveal! Imagine Peer Gynt's Morning Mood playing as the fresh new beginning is revealed in the final moments of the show. Tears of joy are shed! Effusive bystanders marvel at the fresh, vibrant new thing!

That is exactly my favorite show!

apropos: We have already done some organizing in the office and in the garage, on account of we have been snowed in, and I have been half-tempted to document the thing and post it to some #hoarders tumblr instagram feed, but I decided my effort would be better spent on doing it than documenting it.

[BrotherMan]

A show that was in that vein which I don't at all feel guilty for having watched is How Clean is Your House. Because the ladies running it were just fantastic. Yeah, the formula was present, but the genre hadn't yet perfected itself so the drama and the constant Coming Up Next! and Previously! and the ramped up drama wasn't present or pronounced. (The same goes for the British version of Ramsey's kitchen makeover.)

[BrotherMan]

Originally Posted by Ensign Steve

That is exactly my favorite show!

apropos: We have already done some organizing in the office and in the garage, on account of we have been snowed in, and I have been half-tempted to document the thing and post it to some #hoarders tumblr instagram feed, but I decided my effort would be better spent on doing it than documenting it.

I don't remember what show from the TLC channel it was, but it was immensely helpful for me the last couple of times I moved. When sorting things into Keep, Trash, Sell piles made things so much better. Especially when the Sell pile was the secondary Trash pile. Tertiary to that was the advice of if you're not sure, put it away and if you haven't touched it in x time, you can probably trash it.

[Janet]

I kind of like Love It or List It but their formula is getting really old. They always want half their house renovated for no money and the contractors almost always discover that the plumbing or electrics or both need to be replaced, or it's not to code or the homeowners association won't let them do it. Then the homeowners get mad. And on the rare occasions they don't find any horrible costly repairs, the homeowners make some unreasonable demand that means they only get half of what they want done. Funny thing, but it's the exceptions on that show that throw the formula into such vivid relief.

The only show with Pea's pattern I liked was the original British What Not To Wear because their rules for dressing were actually helpful. And they always insisted, on the show and in interviews that women shouldn't think they need to have plastic surgery or lose weight or change their bodies in any way to look good, they just needed to learn how to dress for their bodies. I like that message.

[Ensign Steve]

Originally Posted by BrotherMan

When sorting things into Keep, Trash, Sell piles made things so much better.

What do you think? Keep?

[BrotherMan]

[Ensign Steve]

personal growth...

[BrotherMan]

[lisarea]

What just happened?

You're agonizing over Trivial Pursuit pieces and selling Star Tracks DVDs?

I'm calling the police.

[Ensign Steve]

I just feel like maybe I could use all those colorful triangles in an art piece. Well, not me but someone could. Someone could!

[Qingdai]

I think you need to take a look at Cheapass games. They frequently use parts from other game sets. Then if that doesn't float your boat, donate.

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by Ensign Steve

personal growth...

I just put you on my watch list, I hope you aren't selling something that I have to have.

Wow! you're really into watches? What I really might be interested in is a genuine wind-up pocket watch, don't see many anymore.