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  #176  
Old 05-12-2019, 10:20 PM
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Default Re: Ultimate Cagefight MMXIX, Democratic Edition

Just wanted to note something about Biden's strong position in the polls...

Anyone who, in 2016, told us that Trump winning would "bring the revolution" and energize the left and result in a left-wing victory needs to explain how Biden's commanding polling lead fits into this theory. They thought that it was going to be Bernie's turn and everyone would view the lesson as "Bernie woulda won."

Of course, they've also had several months to explain why it is that DSA/Our Revolution/Justice Democrats endorsees didn't flip a single Congressional district and the argument there seems to be basically "Sure, we didn't flip any seats but look how much media attention AOC is getting!" Which is good, but it isn't what was advertised by the heighten-the-contradictions crew.

Which isn't me arguing that those type of candidates are bad. Some of them got quite close, like JD Scholten coming closer to unseating Steve King than any previous Democrat*, but the notion that other Democrats have a losing strategy and you have a much more winning one isn't really supported by them doing about the same or only slightly better.

My view is that wins for the leftmost viable candidate are more likely to shift politics in the country to the left, rather than wins for the more right-wing candidates. Too clever by half, I know.

And now we see Republicans looking to rig the census to push reapportionment towards red states and enabling more voter suppression and the GOP-dominated Supreme Court is unlikely to do anything about gerrymandering, or explicitly rule in its favor. All of which makes the "revolution" less likely.

So instead of bringing the revolution, we're quite likely to get Biden, who has a more centrist record as a politician than the hated Hillary Clinton. Good job *roll Curb Your Enthusiasm music*

(And just to be clear: I'm only talking about people who thought that Trump winning would move the country more to the left than a Clinton win and that it would result in a clear mandate for the left-wing to control the Democratic Party, etc. People who argue that Bernie would've been a better candidate or president but still viewed a Clinton victory over Trump as better for the left are not who I'm talking about.)

*when you adjust for the national environment, King winning by 3 while Democrats won nationally by almost 9 pts means the district result was 12 pts more GOP. But in 2012, Christie Vilsack lost by 6 pts in a national environment that was Democrats winning by 1 pt, which is arguably a stronger performance. But the shift towards the GOP in Iowa makes it hard to say who was really the stronger candidate. Or perhaps the conclusion is that Steve King is a weak candidate?
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  #177  
Old 05-15-2019, 12:36 AM
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Default Re: Ultimate Cagefight MMXIX, Democratic Edition

For a Union Man, Joe Biden Sure Has a Lot of Big Donors Who Aren’t Fond of Labor
Quote:
Joe Biden would like to project that he is a friend of the working man. Look at the picture above, from his very first campaign event: Rolling up his sleeves and gripping the lectern to talk tough at a union hall in steel country. He’s also recently spoken at a rally in support of the Stop and Shop workers’ strike in Boston and been endorsed by the International Association of Fire Fighters.

When he’s not doing campaign rallies, though, Biden has been doing some other stuff, like holding his first fundraiser at a mansion owned by the Comcast executive who supervises lobbying operations for the giant telecom company. Comcast’s lobbying division, in turn, works with the hugely influential American Legislative Exchange Council, which writes right-wing legislation—including “right to work,” “stand your ground” and voter-ID laws—on behalf of Republican state legislators. A canned quote from the Comcast exec who hosted Biden’s fundraiser actually shows up in a press release on ALEC’s website, while the New York Times recently wrote that Comcast’s relationship with organized labor “is often strained” and said it has “largely managed to fend off efforts by groups like the Communications Workers of America to organize its employees.”
Say it ain't so, Joe.

Biden Predicts Republicans Will Start Working With Democrats After the Election, Which Is Also What He Predicted in 2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Biden in 2012
“There are still some solid Republican conservatives who understand what principled compromise means and are not wrapped up in ideological purity,” said Biden, insisting he knew a dozen Republican senators and up to three dozen House members that want to work with the Democrats.

After the election is over, Biden said members will say “’Hey man I no longer have an obligation to stick with the right of the party’… I really believe you’ll see movement. Real movement.”
That was a thing.
Quote:
Said Biden on Tuesday: “I just think there is a way, and the thing that will fundamentally change things is with Donald Trump out of the White House. … You will see an epiphany occur among many of my Republican friends.” As the 2012 quote indicates, Biden has been dealing with Republican intransigence and derangement since before Trump was a major figure in the party, which one would think would indicate to him that the current president is not the sole cause of its extremism. But when bringing everyone in the country together through the sheer force of your personality is the singular theme of your campaign, I suppose you can’t let a decade or so of history get in the way.
I can't tell if this is signalling, cover, centrism, recruiting, or how he actually thinks
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  #178  
Old 05-15-2019, 12:48 AM
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Default Re: Ultimate Cagefight MMXIX, Democratic Edition


Merrick Garland.
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  #179  
Old 05-15-2019, 06:09 AM
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Default Re: Ultimate Cagefight MMXIX, Democratic Edition

I would push the button, but not with any enthusiasm. It would be more like starting the washing machine, just another task that can't be avoided.
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  #180  
Old 05-15-2019, 06:47 AM
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Default Re: Ultimate Cagefight MMXIX, Democratic Edition

Joe Biden is awful. He may be the worst of all the candidates.

But if he wins (please, no :beg:) I hope everyone else pulls behind him 100% against Trump.
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  #181  
Old 05-15-2019, 06:53 AM
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Default Re: Ultimate Cagefight MMXIX, Democratic Edition

Corporate Grandpa with the nuke button sounds much nicer than Batshit Grandpa with the nuke button.
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  #182  
Old 05-15-2019, 09:29 PM
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Default Re: Ultimate Cagefight MMXIX, Democratic Edition

The idea that an epiphany will cause the "fever to break" is dumb, but not so much more dumb than the idea that there will be a "political revolution" and protesters at McConnell's office or whatever will force the GOP to cooperate.

In Biden's case, I think appeals to bipartisanship could just be cynical pandering. Fact is that there are still plenty of voters who believe/want to believe that the GOP isn't what it is. Obama claimed there is no red America or blue America, and he could bring the country together in 2008, and that was wrong, but he did, after all, win that election. Obama and Biden may have predicted that the "fever [would] break" in 2012, and that prediction was obviously completely wrong, but they did, after all, win that election, too. So it's not obvious that it's a losing message. It could well be a winning message again.

He could campaign on that message and then after a month or two of making a show of trying, claim that it's obvious he was wrong and he's going to go forward without their cooperation. FDR campaigned on a balanced budget in 1932 then turned around and gave us the New Deal with deficit spending. Likewise, I don't expect Bernie Sanders to necessarily really believe his own bullshit about a "political revolution" forcing the GOP to do anything. The structural factors that make them able to behave the way they do won't go away even if Sanders wins a decisive victory (7-8 pt popular vote margin, say). They will know that their gerrymandering, voter suppression and Senate advantages will reassert themselves in the 2022 midterms, as they did in 2010. Sanders could also adopt a different approach early on, of making structural reforms, even feeding some bullshit about this being "the political revolution" or that the revolution needs these changes.

The only thing that will break the GOP's fever is changes that reduce their structural advantage, which leads to repeated losses until they change their strategy. That means eliminating the filibuster, adding new states to reduce their Senate advantage, and passing a new and expansive voting rights bill to put an end to gerrymandering and voter suppression, etc. After we've expanded our Senate majority and put a stop to GOP gerrymandering in the House, we'll have a more even playing field, and can then pursue other changes that help.

Supporting unionization rights would be good, for example, in both providing material benefits to workers AND in building Democratic power. Also important would be doing what you can (while respecting free speech) to break the power of right-wing and corporate media.

Neither political revolutions nor epiphanies will deliver a sane and responsible Republican Party, only breaking their sources of minoritarian power will. Now, I happen to prefer candidates like Elizabeth Warren that I am quite sure understand what needs to be done, but I don't assume that Biden or Sanders definitely don't.
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  #183  
Old 05-19-2019, 12:21 AM
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Default Re: Ultimate Cagefight MMXIX, Democratic Edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by slimshady2357 View Post
Joe Biden is awful. He may be the worst of all the candidates.

But if he wins (please, no :beg:) I hope everyone else pulls behind him 100% against Trump.

The guy is so full of shit it's incredible. Let's see how long he can keep feeding off the Obama nostalgia and his huge fake ass smile when the debates start.
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  #184  
Old 05-23-2019, 02:30 PM
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Default Re: Ultimate Cagefight MMXIX, Democratic Edition

DeBlasio now. All this just to circle back round and heave unca joe back up on the pick me! pick me! wagon? Weird.
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  #185  
Old 05-23-2019, 02:52 PM
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Default Re: Ultimate Cagefight MMXIX, Democratic Edition

Pretty much the only message Uncle Grope and No Change seems to have is that he's not Donald Trump.

Hmm, what's that?

Joe Biden once said a fence was needed to stop 'tons' of drugs from Mexico - CNNPolitics

Quote:
Joe Biden once spoke about jailing employers who hire "illegals," said sanctuary cities shouldn't be allowed to violate federal law, and argued a fence was needed stop "tons" of drugs coming into the country from "corrupt Mexico."
A couple of weeks ago he actually claimed that he had the "most progressive record" of anyone running for President. God that guy is full of shit. Go away.
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