Was God creating Satan a good idea?

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Was God creating Satan a good idea?

Eden and creation seemed to be going along quite well for God and man until Satan was cast into Eden by God. God would have been in charge of who he allowed into the Garden of Eden. After all, God would have kept a firm control of who entered his new day care so as to insure the wellbeing of Adam and Eve.

Being all knowing, God already knew that Satan, with God’s own power of deception, would successfully tempt Eve to eat of the tree of all possible knowledge.

It almost seems as if God wanted us to and planned for us to fail. Perhaps that is why the Church called Adams sin a happy fault and necessary sin.

Christian dogma, the opposite of Jewish dogma, has Satan as God’s nemesis and arch rival for the souls of mankind. God’s foreknowledge would have told him that Satan would cause him to condemn the vast majority of his beloved souls to hell and death and thus play into Satan’s hands. This to me seems like God creating a huge amount of grief for himself and mankind, unless God truly wanted man to fail, --- and sin was a happy fault and necessary sin as the Church says.

Did Adam and Eve actually do what God really wanted them to do, and was God creating Satan a good idea?

We are told by the Church and scriptures to emulate God.

Should all parents do as God did and create a situation of failure for their children so as to insure that they too have the happy fault and necessary sin that makes them fail?

Why was it important for God to insure that we failed?

Regards
DL

[JoeP]

God created Hitler, and Satan killed him. Have you conversed with our new Nazi cumstasher?

[Ari]

Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop

Why was it important for God to insure that we failed?

Never underestimate the possibility God's a dick!

Edit to add: He did murder everyone's pets because he didn't like who they were fucking. So psychopathic dick.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Originally Posted by Ari

Never underestimate the possibility God's a dick!

Edit to add: He did murder everyone's pets because he didn't like who they were fucking. So psychopathic dick.

You leave nothing to argue.

Regards
DL

[Ari]

Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop

You leave nothing to argue.

It's almost as if the writers of the old testament *didn't* believe God was all knowing or benevolent creature and that was later added when hollywood asked them to write a trilogy so they panicked and made Neo a direct Jesus figure.

Given early tribes believed in multiple Gods, and the language is similar to a parable to explain the tribe's arbitrary laws that's lost context, it seems pretty reasonable to think that any later interpretation is flawed and trying to shoehorn new beliefs into old ones. For all we know the Serpent is actually a representation of another tribes God who tempts followers.

Afterall Old testament God is totally cool with polytheism, just so long as he's the top God.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Originally Posted by Ari

It's almost as if the writers of the old testament *didn't* believe God was all knowing or benevolent creature and that was later added when hollywood asked them to write a trilogy so they panicked and made Neo a direct Jesus figure.

Given early tribes believed in multiple Gods, and the language is similar to a parable to explain the tribe's arbitrary laws that's lost context, it seems pretty reasonable to think that any later interpretation is flawed and trying to shoehorn new beliefs into old ones. For all we know the Serpent is actually a representation of another tribes God who tempts followers.

Afterall Old testament God is totally cool with polytheism, just so long as he's the top God.

Indeed.

The Serpent cults have been traced back to every continent and as far back as 70,000 years ago in Africa. In a way, it is the oldest God.

Christianity vilified that well respected icon just to have their cross replace the serpents that were being worshipped.

That is likely why Christianity reversed the Jewish notion of success for both God and man in Eden, --- to the fall of man and failure for God to start us up in the right way.

Christianity will even insult God to get more cash from their fallen people.

Regards
DL

[ceptimus]

The whole thing is just a story originally dreamt up by uneducated goatherds and then successively tweaked by people with an axe to grind through the ages. You shouldn't give it any more credence than any other work of fiction.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Originally Posted by ceptimus

The whole thing is just a story originally dreamt up by uneducated goatherds and then successively tweaked by people with an axe to grind through the ages. You shouldn't give it any more credence than any other work of fiction.

I would not if it was not still causing many to vilify women and you should know that that story is the root of Christian misogyny.

If you have a wife or daughters and do not care then you do not care about the women in your family. Not to be harsh but just telling it like it is FMPOV.

Regards
DL

[davidm]

Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop

I would not if it was not still causing many to vilify women and you should know that that story is the root of Christian misogyny.

If you have a wife or daughters and do not care then you do not care about the women in your family. Not to be harsh but just telling it like it is FMPOV.

Regards
DL

We already know what kind of misogynist you are. You link to a writer who believes not only that women are property of men, but common property of all men. So don't pretend to lecture people on Christian misogyny or anything else, for that matter.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Originally Posted by davidm

We already know what kind of misogynist you are. You link to a writer who believes not only that women are property of men, but common property of all men. So don't pretend to lecture people on Christian misogyny or anything else, for that matter.

Thanks for the lies.

Regards
DL

[JoeP]

Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop

Thanks for the lies your enslavement to your cult makes you believe, dumb asshole.

Regards
DL

[davidm]

Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop

Thanks for the lies.

Regards
DL

Epiphanes: on Righteousness

And by the words Your neighbor’s wife he says something even more ludicrous, since he forces what should be common property to be treated as private possession.

Hey, it’s your link, dude.

[Watser?]

I like to use the Tintin books as my moral guide. Specifically Captain Haddock. I guess Stormlight is a believer too.

[JoeP]

[erimir]

Discussing this as if there is a real God and a real Satan is just silly. So instead maybe we should talk about whether the IDEA that God created Satan is a good idea.

I think that as science has advanced (lowering people's need for supernatural explanations) and the problem of evil became a more serious difficulty, it does not look to be a very good idea. I imagine most of the people who proffer the free will defense would have at least a little trouble reconciling it with the traditional view of Satan.

[Stephen Maturin]

Nice work, Ari! You left nothing to argue.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Originally Posted by erimir

Discussing this as if there is a real God and a real Satan is just silly. So instead maybe we should talk about whether the IDEA that God created Satan is a good idea.

I think that as science has advanced (lowering people's need for supernatural explanations) and the problem of evil became a more serious difficulty, it does not look to be a very good idea. I imagine most of the people who proffer the free will defense would have at least a little trouble reconciling it with the traditional view of Satan.

No argument on this.

I wrote it as I did to draw theists as stats show that 70 odd % still believe in that fantasy to be real.

I do not see any theists here so far so will likely move along soon.

Regards
DL

[davidm]

Originally Posted by Gnostic Christian Bishop

I do not see any theists here so far so will likely move along soon.

Regards
DL

Yes, you will move along soon, especially since I quoted back to you your own link to the Gnostic "thinker" who holds that women should be common property of men (rather than merely (!) a "private possession.") And just think, you had called me a liar for correctly identifying your own views!

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

davidm

Some just do not have a life and settle for really small kicks.

Why do you not post the whole piece that you are talking about?

Are you afraid to learn that you do not understand what it is saying?

Regards
DL

[Stephen Maturin]

Originally Posted by davidm

Yes, you will move along soon, especially since I quoted back to you your own link to the Gnostic "thinker" who holds that women should be common property of men (rather than merely (!) a "private possession.") And just think, you had called me a liar for correctly identifying your own views!

In GCB's defense, he's extremely stupid and dishonest.

[The Man]

Of the regular posters here, Angakuk (an actual Lutheran minister) and, I believe, wildernesse, at the very least, are theists, but I'm fairly certain they will have no inclination to treat you with the seriousness you seem to think you deserve, given your pervasive misogyny, Islamophobia, and racism. Just as no one here wanted to discuss Israel with Sophia, I suspect no one here will have any interest in discussing theology with you. Of course, the two of them are more than intelligent enough to speak for themselves, but your perception that there are no theists here is false.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Originally Posted by The Man

Of the regular posters here, Angakuk (an actual Lutheran minister) and, I believe, wildernesse, at the very least, are theists, but I'm fairly certain they will have no inclination to treat you with the seriousness you seem to think you deserve, given your pervasive misogyny, Islamophobia, and racism. Just as no one here wanted to discuss Israel with Sophia, I suspect no one here will have any interest in discussing theology with you. Of course, the two of them are more than intelligent enough to speak for themselves, but your perception that there are no theists here is false.

What misogyny and racism?

Where have I denigrated women and what race did I disrespect.

Get any quote and we can chat as I see what you put as just lies.

For all I know, as happened in a post above, some a hole may have redone something I put after altering it.

Regards
DL

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by The Man

Of the regular posters here, Angakuk (an actual Lutheran minister) and, I believe, wildernesse, at the very least, are theists, but I'm fairly certain they will have no inclination to treat you with the seriousness you seem to think you deserve, given your pervasive misogyny, Islamophobia, and racism. Just as no one here wanted to discuss Israel with Sophia, I suspect no one here will have any interest in discussing theology with you. Of course, the two of them are more than intelligent enough to speak for themselves, but your perception that there are no theists here is false.

Hey, I'm right here ya know. While I'm kinda used to being ignored, I would at least appreciate being included in the list of Theists, Even if my beliefs don't fit with everyone else's.

As far as GCB, I really don't have much time for him, I've encountered him on other forums, and don't really see the need to respond to his nonsense, Others are doing that quite nicely, in my opinion.

[The Man]

By even writing this response I'm giving you far more attention than you deserve, but off the top of my head, your misogyny includes that time you blamed children for paedophile priests raping them. Of course, this isn't just misogyny but misandry as well, since many of the victims were male. There's also this thread, where you describe the West as practising "equality of the sexes" (spoiler alert: it does not, and anyone who believes it does is demonstrating a massive pro-male bias) and refer possessively to "our women".

Your racism includes this charming thread where you proposed banning immigration from any majority-Islamic countries and falsely stated that all majority-Islamic countries apply sharia law, or this one where you proposed that because of a couple of dictatorships in the Middle East, all Muslims should be subjected to discriminatory treatment in Western countries. Or this dead giveaway where you fret about the number of "white births" and, when it is pointed out to you that the only reason whites becoming a minority would be a problem is if whites were creating a precedent of treating minorities badly, naturally gravitate towards the response of doubling down on why this means a declining white population is a bad thing instead of why it means treating minorities badly is a bad thing. Just to name a few examples.

I could go on, but that's enough. I don't expect you to accept any of these examples, because misogynists generally refuse to acknowledge that they are misogynists, and racists generally refuse to acknowledge that they are racists. I've learned to accept that, and I'm not particularly concerned with convincing you of anything; I'm mostly doing this for the benefit of third parties. I probably won't respond to this thread again; I've already given you far more effort than you deserve.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

Originally Posted by The Man

This is a lie.

Nowhere in that post do I assign any blame to a victim for their assault. I do speak of culpability for future victims but that is not the same thing at all

Get the quote or be seen as lying.

So that is your idea of a recant after an wrongful insult. No wonder you lie so easily.

So my thinking that the West practices equality when your view of equality is not met makes me misogynous.

You go from dumb to dumber.

A religion is not a race.

Name the race I disrespected or retract your lie.

What you have learned is to denigrate where it is not apropos and do the type of blackballing without showing the facts as you have done here.

You are either a young idiot, which I can forgive, or an old and stupid bastard which I cannot forgive.

Recant of be seen as one of those and ignorant to boot.

Regards
DL