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Old 12-02-2015, 06:20 PM
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Default Dyson Sphere

In case you don't know what a Dyson sphere is...

There has been a lot of hype lately about scientists possibly finding a Dyson sphere, and although it's highly unlikely to be true, it's still pretty fun to think about.

IMHO, I don't think we'll ever find one, because I don't think they exist. They seem way too impractical for an advanced civilization that has mastered nuclear fission. It also irritates me to see it imagined as somewhat of a solid sphere surrounding a star. That would be absolutely impossible to construct as it would collapse at the poles. They would have to have multiple rings layered on top each other and each orbiting in the appropriate direction. This would seem grossly inefficient to creatures that were capable of building fission reactors that were the size of a laptops.

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Old 12-02-2015, 06:48 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Drive by science - Page 13 - Freethought Forum
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Old 12-02-2015, 11:30 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

It would have to have some structural cohesion, but because it's curved, I don't think the forces would be too strong for it to hold up. Think of arches, you can build them out of blocks which don't even have to be fastened together to withstand gravity.

I can't really back this up right now, but I will try it as an exercise, not least because I have to learn that stuff right now anyway.
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Old 12-03-2015, 12:39 AM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Even if the engineering were possible, why choose solar power over nuclear fission?
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Old 12-03-2015, 01:30 AM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Do you mean nuclear fusion? The energy you could get from fusion is much more than what you can get from fission.

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Old 12-03-2015, 11:25 AM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevlar View Post
Even if the engineering were possible, why choose solar power over nuclear fission fusion?
Solar power is nuclear fusion, isn't it?

Why not capture all that energy - as well as building portable fusion reactors?
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Old 12-03-2015, 08:19 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Portable fusion reactors? You mean like a star in a lunchbox?
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Old 12-03-2015, 10:02 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Yeah, thanks, I meant fusion, the combining of atoms.

:derp:

I know we haven't achieved fusion yet, but aren't we pretty close? Give us another million years of evolution, like a civilization that can create a Dyson sphere, and tiny/cheap fusion reactors could be entirely possible.

Solar power is collecting the end product of fusion, but it doesn't contain the source of fusion, so I wouldn't say it was the same thing.
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Old 12-03-2015, 10:04 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Quote:
Originally Posted by godfry n. glad View Post
You mean like a star in a lunchbox?
A sun in a bun.
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Old 12-03-2015, 11:23 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevlar View Post
Yeah, thanks, I meant fusion, the combining of atoms.

:derp:

I know we haven't achieved fusion yet, but aren't we pretty close? Give us another million years of evolution, like a civilization that can create a Dyson sphere, and tiny/cheap fusion reactors could be entirely possible.

Solar power is collecting the end product of fusion, but it doesn't contain the source of fusion, so I wouldn't say it was the same thing.
But it's quite similar. On the outside of a fusion reactor there would be something to convert the heat into electrical energy, like steam turbines. The sphere would be the analog of that. It would turn a solar system into a giant fusion reactor to collect astronomical amounts of power.
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Old 03-27-2016, 05:52 AM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Bringing back a long dead post here..... Was thinking about this the other day, (damned star trek re-runs) mainly just the stagering amount of material that would be needed to make a dyson sphear or even just a ring world.

Given the earths average arbital distance from sun, spherical surface aria would be approximately 281 000 000 000 000 000 square km. Woul there even be enough material in the solar system to build it? And then you need the energy to collect, refine, transport, and build with that material

Even a 10km wide ring at earth orbital distance would be around 9 393 362 030 sq km

For comparison earths surface area is mere 510 million sq km


Perhaps around a small Red dwarf, a civilization with thousands of mellenia to throw at such Project could compete it. Would be far easier just to build smaller structures as they need them.
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Old 03-27-2016, 10:22 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Completion of it is academic. If you don't want to or can't build a complete one, don't complete it, a partial one is still lots of energy. Dyson didn't explain it as a construct as much as a civillizational phase.
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Old 03-31-2016, 09:56 AM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Quote:
Originally Posted by But View Post
It would turn a solar system into a giant fusion reactor to collect astronomical amounts of power.
:nod:
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Old 03-31-2016, 05:52 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

This brainiac proposes we dismantle the planet Mercury to build something of a Dyson Sphere.

Of course, I just can't get over the impracticalities of the Dyson Sphere concept in general.
What about solar winds? solar flares? Comets? The other millions of objects that whirl around the Sun?
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  #15  
Old 03-31-2016, 06:46 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Quote:
Moreover, various forms of wireless energy transfer could be used to transmit energy between its components and the Earth.
I can conceive of no way in which this could possibly go wrong.
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Old 03-31-2016, 06:53 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Ooh ...
Quote:
Well, it’s very possible that our appetite for computational power will become quite insatiable. It’s hard to predict what a post-Singularity or post-biological civilization would do with so much computation power.
... it's not humanity who's going to be motivated to do this, it's Lord Post-Singularity ASI.

A Dyson swarm of paperclips!


:clippy::clippy::clippy:
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Old 04-01-2016, 02:22 AM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Considering the massive amounts of resources necessary to build a Dyson swarm or sphere are staggering in quantity, it's safe to consider them hypothetical. Until we find evidence of an extant swarm or sphere discussing how one could be constructed is largely hypothetical.
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Old 04-01-2016, 06:00 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

True that we have no evidence to support any real arguments, but thought experiments are fun, and I'd also posit that these hypotheses are essential on the path to learning.

So, I was reading this article about how we could cloak our planet to make it undetectable to an alien's sky survey. Let's face it, the odds are quite significant that aliens would be predatory. After all, if humans were given the power of inter-stellar travel right now, they'd use it to shit Jesus and Capitalism all over the galaxy.

That's when I thought of a real use for a Dyson Sphere. Not to cloak the Earth, but as a show of power. Let's say there are predatory aliens out there and they are scanning the stars, looking for planets with inferior civilizations. If they see a Dyson Sphere around a star, I think that would give them pause as to whether they wanted to fuck with whoever made it.
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Old 04-01-2016, 10:50 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

No one fucks with the paperclip swarm.
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Old 06-19-2016, 01:26 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

OK guys, don't panic, but I thought of another use for a Dyson sphere.

Gamma ray bursts are a pretty frequent event across the universe, and could be frequent enough that they wipe out complex life and explain the Fermi paradox. Fermi Paradox thread; aliens welcome - Freethought Forum

We need to build a Dyson sphere pronto. A GRB could destroy our biosphere tomorrow, or any time within the next 500 million years.

(A sphere built around the Earth obviously isn't enough - it would protect us from GRBs but would kind of block out the sun.)

No single space project in this period will be more impressive, or more important for the survival of mankind; and none will be so difficult or expensive to accomplish.

We choose to build this sphere in this megayear, not because it is easy, but because it is hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win, and the others, too.
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Old 07-03-2016, 07:20 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeP View Post

No single space project in this period will be more impressive, or more important for the survival of mankind; and none will be so difficult or expensive to accomplish.

We choose to build this sphere in this megayear, not because it is easy, but because it is hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win, and the others, too.
Ask not what your Dyson Sphere can do for you, but what you can do for your Dyson Sphere!

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Old 07-04-2016, 02:51 AM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Here's your Dyson Sphere right here. I don't get what all the noise is about.

:confused2:

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Old 07-04-2016, 04:01 AM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Quote:
Originally Posted by Angakuk View Post
I don't get what all the noise is about.
About 90 decibels.
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Old 07-04-2016, 04:11 AM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

All this talk about Dyson Sphere, no one ever mentions the Dyson Cube.
:rif:
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Old 08-06-2016, 08:21 PM
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Default Re: Dyson Sphere

Update:

We just got even weirder results about the 'alien megastructure' star - ScienceAlert

Quote:
But basically what Kepler saw was KIC 8462852, also known as Tabby's star, dimming at such an incredible rate that it can't solely be explained by any of the leading hypotheses we had: comet swarms, or the effects of a warped star.
:cheer:

Quote:
In the meantime, we would remind you that it's very, very unlikely that this strange flickering star has anything to do with aliens (and is even more exciting if it doesn't - because, hello new space phenomena!).
:sadcheer:
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