Usefullness of the ignore feature if....

[livius drusus]

Originally Posted by Sweetie

What's the point of the ignore feature in the first place?

To customize the individual's experience of the forum as much as possible.

Originally Posted by Sweetie

If there wasn't an ignore feature possible, would the administration need to utilize another form of guidelines?

We adminned another site which didn't have an ignore feature but we didn't have behavioral guidelines there either. That was private, though; I don't know if we'd go live on a public forum without ignore features.

Originally Posted by Sweetie

In that sense, does the administration recognize a need for it, a need, not just a pleasure or a preference?

There's always demand for it even on forums with strict behavioral guidelines, so I would say yes, there's a need for ignore features.

[Sweetie]

We adminned another site which didn't have an ignore feature but we didn't have behavioral guidelines there either. That was private, though; I don't know if we'd go live on a public forum without ignore features.

HH? You mean the one where you allowed personal information of me to stand? Where people are spoken of and attacked without being able to defend themselves? Is there too, a reason why the place was so poorly frequented, that you left it and that Gurdur is so tight now especially with who is allowed to be part of the crew? Is it an enjoyable place, for people other than the crew or oldbies?

There's always demand for it even on forums with strict behavioral guidelines, so I would say yes, there's a need for ignore features.

And what need is it there to meet? Is it my problem that I don't want to hear abusive comments directed at me or is that someone else's problem?

I edited.

[livius drusus]

Originally Posted by Sweetie

HH? You mean the one where you allowed personal information of me to stand? Where people are spoken of and attacked without being able to defend themselves? Is there too, a reason why the place was so poorly frequented, that you left it and that Gurdur is so tight now especially with who is allowed to be part of the crew? Is it an enjoyable place, for people other than the crew or oldbies?

HH, yes. I wasn't an admin when you were spoken of and my departure was unrelated to posting rates. I won't speak to the issues of current policy as I don't feel it's my place. The atmosphere is, imo, very pleasant for new members from all over.

And what need is it there to meet?

The need to provide members with options to reduce irritants and experience the forum according to their preferences.

Is it my problem that I don't want to hear abusive comments directed at me or is that someone else's problem?

Your not wanting to hear abusive comments directed at you may or not be a problem, I wouldn't presume to say, but it's certainly natural. I feel the same way. I just don't think I have to use the admin control panel to avoid them.

[Sweetie]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

Your not wanting to hear abusive comments directed at you may or not be a problem, I wouldn't presume to say, but it's certainly natural. I feel the same way. I just don't think I have to use the admin control panel to avoid them.

Let me know the trick so that I don't have to keep encountering offensive directed at me chronic harassing material which should be taken care of by the ignore feature which has been your repeated solution. Sometimes I think your method of "avoidance" is retreat and not participating at all. You're guarded and that's great......for you.

[livius drusus]

I do what I think is best according to my priorities, like everyone else. Sometimes that's guarded and sometimes not.

[Sweetie]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

I do what I think is best according to my priorities, like everyone else. Sometimes that's guarded and sometimes not.

That's not my point. Your insinuation is that I should just happily be willing and able to ignore and tolerate harassing and abusive behavior, like you do, even though you're not being harassed or abused. Your insinuation is that la-de-da, you don't need a board feature, you're so much better than I in that sense. That's how it comes accross to me. My response is nobody knows you, you rarely put yourself out there to be attacked, you're on mod or admin mode most of the time and therefore are above criticism......you're not experiencing things like I am. It may be worse in some sense, but I just don't feel like you really.........whatever.......I don't know......

We're just......

[viscousmemories]

Originally Posted by Sweetie

My response is nobody knows you, [...]

No, you're wrong. I know livius very, very well. Just because she chooses not to spread her private, personal business all over a public Internet forum doesn't mean nobody knows her. I don't know who you think you are, but the fact that livius is an admin here and has enough class to not tell you to go fuck yourself doesn't mean you or anyone else the right to pry into her personal life and cast aspersions on her character. I know for a fact that she has gone to great lengths to help you resolve your problems here both publicly and privately. Obviously you don't know anything about her, but that you repay her kindness by making these nasty insinuations says a lot about your character.

[livius drusus]

Originally Posted by Sweetie

That's not my point. Your insinuation is that I should just happily be willing and able to ignore and tolerate harassing and abusive behavior, like you do, even though you're not being harassed or abused. Your insinuation is that la-de-da, you don't need a board feature, you're so much better than I in that sense. That's how it comes accross to me. My response is nobody knows you, you rarely put yourself out there to be attacked, you're on mod or admin mode most of the time and therefore are above criticism......you're not experiencing things like I am. It may be worse in some sense, but I just don't feel like you really.........whatever.......I don't know......

We're just......

I've been abused here, you know. I've been hurt, even by people going out of there way to get in digs at me -- which basically seems to me what you're talking about when you say harassment.

It sucked and I withdrew. It's better for the thread, for people who care about the individuals involved, and ultimately, even though is seems counterintutive at the time, it's better for my emotional health as well.

I learned this the hard way, I preach it and I practice it. You wouldn't be the first person to accuse me of cowardice because of this. I don't mind. It's a fair enough perspective.

So yes, of course I'm not experiencing things like you are, but you are most decidedly not seeing through my eyes either or you would have laughed out loud at your own post.

[Sweetie]

Originally Posted by viscousmemories

No, you're wrong. I know livius very, very well.

You've known her for a long time. I'm not even complaining that I don't know her, I'm saying that we're not on the same level, avoidance, and not participation, non-personal is more her style than it is mine.

Just because she chooses not to spread her private, personal business all over a public Internet forum doesn't mean nobody knows her.

If you know her, you have other interaction with her than here. That's all good though, you don't get that that's not my point. You always jump the gun, you always refuse to check yourself and check another perspective/ point of view, or argument than the one your mind is wont to first think up.

I don't know who you think you are, but the fact that livius is an admin here and has enough class to not tell you to go fuck yourself doesn't mean you or anyone else the right to pry into her personal life and cast aspersions on her character.

I'm not prying. I have enough class to not call you a stupid fuck at this point, no? Sauce for the gander and all that?

I know for a fact that she has gone to great lengths to help you resolve your problems here both publicly and privately.

Nope, I totally one hundred percent disagree.

Obviously you don't know anything about her, but that you repay her kindness by making these nasty insinuations says a lot about your character.

There are no character assasinations here. She's perfectly allowed to keep to herself, it's her life, it works for her, but that's my point. It works for her, it reduces clashes, it raises her esteem in the eyes of others.....but it's also non-participation as far as I'm concerned. It's not something I'm willing to do, not participate so as not to deserve harassment and abuse.


Read it and read it again, the above sentence is my point and the point of the build up to. Participation or non-participation is no reason to deserve abuse.
Check it.

I wish you would listen instead of constantly casting aspersions on my character. Who knows, maybe liv gets my point.

[Sweetie]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

[

I've been abused here, you know. I've been hurt, even by people going out of there way to get in digs at me -- which basically seems to me what you're talking about when you say harassment.

I know, and I know you used to receive more when you were out there. Verbal abuse is not harassment, chronic abuse is.

It sucked and I withdrew. It's better for the thread, for people who care about the individuals involved, and ultimately, even though is seems counterintutive at the time, it's better for my emotional health as well.

I know this, and it's my point. I disagree with you that this is the best course of action. It works for you, is my point, it's ultimately not my solution. I think someone needs to stop and that's it.

I learned this the hard way, I preach it and I practice it. You wouldn't be the first person to accuse me of cowardice because of this. I don't mind. It's a fair enough perspective.

I'm not accusing you of cowardice. Seebs is not so different from you, and he's no coward. No, that has no part of it.

But I am out there, and I'm taking hits, and you aren't and that's ok. But you can't tell me I deserve abuse because I refuse to withdraw like you do. I don't deserve abuse whether I stay or withdraw is my point.

[Sweetie]

And, since the point of this thread is, what is the usefulness of the ignore feature, my point was that the ignore feature isn't good enough as a solution insofar its been recommended to me as that if I use it and it will all be good.

I brought it up, I think it's clear that this is true as far as the available evidence is concerned, I think it's clear Adora is not going to choose to leave me alone of her own volition, etc.

Food for thought.

[Sweetie]

And perhaps it has use in that it brings to everyone's attention, those who all agreed that the Ignore feature is the solution and that I should just ignore her, don't quote her if you don't have to. That's all. Apparently the ignore feature requires a community in order to work for even one person.

[maddog]

Originally Posted by Sweetie

I don't see the point with that myself, no offense maddog.

None taken.
As I noted when I made the request , personally I'd prefer to be able to ignore the whole Sexuality forum. I'd rather not accidentally get into those threads.
#603

[livius drusus]

Originally Posted by Sweetie

I know, and I know you used to receive more when you were out there. Verbal abuse is not harassment, chronic abuse is.

Hence the going out of their way to dig at you clause.

Originally Posted by Sweetie

I know this, and it's my point. I disagree with you that this is the best course of action. It works for you, is my point, it's ultimately not my solution. I think someone needs to stop and that's it.

I think people should stop too. I don't think I should use the ACP to stop them.

Originally Posted by Sweetie

I'm not accusing you of cowardice. Seebs is not so different from you, and he's no coward. No, that has no part of it.

Okay.

But I am out there, and I'm taking hits, and you aren't and that's ok. But you can't tell me I deserve abuse because I refuse to withdraw like you do. I don't deserve abuse whether I stay or withdraw is my point.

It's not about what people deserve. I've never told you you deserve abuse. I'm recommending ways of managing hostility. I realize that you don't find these methods effective, and we're always looking to plug holes. Hopefully some of the suggestions in this thread will do that.

And perhaps it has use in that it brings to everyone's attention, those who all agreed that the Ignore feature is the solution and that I should just ignore her, don't quote her if you don't have to. That's all. Apparently the ignore feature requires a community in order to work for even one person.

That's a good point. It's probably best to avoid quoting flames altogether, but it's even more important to do so if you suspect the poster is likely to be on ignore lists.

[pescifish]

Originally Posted by Sweetie

... even though you're not being harassed or abused.

Not true, Sweetie. By your own definition, you have harrassed (and abused) both admins of this board during your continued campaign.

Don't even think you are in the same league as livius in term of class. Anyone who knows her is privileged to do so and they know it. I for one am glad you haven't gotten close enough to consider yourself so privileged. You don't deserve it. You have shown yourself to the members of this board and we have every right to react to you as we see fit.

I wish this board would institute a rule against harrassment by your definitions because you are arguably one of the worst, if not the worst, violator on this board.

[Fencesitter]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

I've been abused here, you know. I've been hurt, even by people going out of there way to get in digs at me -- which basically seems to me what you're talking about when you say harassment.

It sucked and I withdrew. It's better for the thread, for people who care about the individuals involved, and ultimately, even though is seems counterintutive at the time, it's better for my emotional health as well.

I learned this the hard way, I preach it and I practice it. You wouldn't be the first person to accuse me of cowardice because of this. I don't mind. It's a fair enough perspective.

So yes, of course I'm not experiencing things like you are, but you are most decidedly not seeing through my eyes either or you would have laughed out loud at your own post.

I'm not aware of this situation, so I don't mean to be insensitive, and I apologize if it comes out that way. But I'd like to place a hypothetical around this situation, if that's ok.

I'm assuming since this person that abused you in the past is no longer posting things about you, liv, that your withdrawal worked in stopping the abuse. But let's pretend that it didn't.

So in my hypothetical, you're still you, liv, an admin. of this board and someone has come here and decides to attack you after every post you make. We can either surmise that they find personal information about you from other places or they just post offensive stuff. But all of it is directed at you and no one else. So after every post you make, there's a comment from abuserX and it goes on for days, then weeks, then months. Let's further hypothesize that abuserX has vm on ignore. What are the possibilities of outcomes?

Off the bat, abuserX could be banned or the site could be shut down, but let's assume that those two options are not available to you. What are the other options?

I'm just trying to explore options in my hypothetical. Any ideas?

Fence

[Sock Puppet]

Welcome to Sweetie's latest manic episode. Please keep your tray tables in the upright and locked position until the thread grinds to a complete halt.

[maddog]

Originally Posted by Fencesitter

I'm not aware of this situation, so I don't mean to be insensitive, and I apologize if it comes out that way. But I'd like to place a hypothetical around this situation, if that's ok.

I'm assuming since this person that abused you in the past is no longer posting things about you, liv, that your withdrawal worked in stopping the abuse. But let's pretend that it didn't.

So in my hypothetical, you're still you, liv, an admin. of this board and someone has come here and decides to attack you after every post you make. We can either surmise that they find personal information about you from other places or they just post offensive stuff. But all of it is directed at you and no one else. So after every post you make, there's a comment from abuserX and it goes on for days, then weeks, then months. Let's further hypothesize that abuserX has vm on ignore. What are the possibilities of outcomes?

Off the bat, abuserX could be banned or the site could be shut down, but let's assume that those two options are not available to you. What are the other options?

I'm just trying to explore options in my hypothetical. Any ideas?

Fence

I can't speak from an admin perspective, as I believe the admins do not have the ability to "ignore" a user. But absolutely every single other ordinary user does. If it were me, I'd put that person on "ignore."

Another option open to me is to exercise some self-restraint, so that I do not respond to that person's posts.

It also strikes me that your hypothetical scenario seems unrealistically extreme. I don't think that happened to livius, and I don't think that happened to Sweetie, nor to anyone else that I'm aware of. What is the point of making such an extreme example?

ETA: What would you think of someone who, for no reason at all, just decides to attack your every post? I would have great sympathy for a person who has so much pain and so much missing from their lives.

#604

[Johnny Pneumatic]

Originally Posted by Sweetie

Oh, I see. I have to ignore her and then I have to ignore anybody else's thoughts in response to any of hers in order to successfully ignore her. I can't just ignore her and still read other peoples thoughts, I have to ignore her thoughts, all responses to her thoughts, all those who encourage her in this by being nice-nice with her regardless of her behavior, and all other threads related to those thoughts. At such a slow forum, no less.

Sounds peachy.

Or you could grow up and deal with her behavior. I've never put anyone on ignore and have dealt with very obnoxious people; the likes of which Adora cannot hope to become, and I survived. No pain no gain, aren't you Catholic, Sweetie? Suffering is supposed to be part of that faith I thought.

[Petra]

Just to give a little perspective to those who are beguiled by Sweetie's accusations of persecution and harrassment, while claiming she is no more than an innocent victim, I'd like to offer exhibit a, from the FF Art Thread:

http://www.freethought-forum.com/for...827#post133827

She later says to SkepticJ:

http://www.freethought-forum.com/for...861#post133861

Either way, you are just a means to an end in this case...

That 'end' being to troll a reaction from Adora.



Usual story. Sweetie's 'on one' and we all have to suffer for her nasty, fucked up little episodes while she throws tantrums, insults everyone, brings up everyone's old stuff, uses anything that anyone may have posted about their personal lives against them, and otherwise plays spoiled little bitch.


Look in the mirror, sweetie. Look real fucking hard.

[Petra]

...

[Fencesitter]

Originally Posted by maddog

It also strikes me that your hypothetical scenario seems unrealistically extreme. I don't think that happened to livius, and I don't think that happened to Sweetie, nor to anyone else that I'm aware of. What is the point of making such an extreme example?

My hope in creating the hypothetical was to move it away from reality in order to create some brainstorming solutions. As we move closer to reality, then the personalities come into play. I am hoping to avoid that.

Originally Posted by maddog

ETA: What would you think of someone who, for no reason at all, just decides to attack your every post? I would have great sympathy for a person who has so much pain and so much missing from their lives.

#604

The sympathy here for anyone who is seen as attacking another is not overwhelming, from what I've seen.

How would you show this sympathy? How would it manifest on this forum?

Fence

[Fencesitter]

Originally Posted by lunachick

Just to give a little perspective to those who are beguiled by Sweetie's accusations of persecution and harrassment, while claiming she is no more than an innocent victim, I'd like to offer exhibit a, from the FF Art Thread:

http://www.freethought-forum.com/for...827#post133827

She later says to SkepticJ:

http://www.freethought-forum.com/for...861#post133861

That 'end' being to troll a reaction from Adora.

I didn't see that as Sweetie's 'end'. I think her point was here:

Originally Posted by Sweetie

Anyways, I was more or less just using it as an example of the fact that I have Adora on ignore and yet I have this picture staring right at me......hers from her post.....which you quoted. I was just using you.

here

which was a point that she made earlier in this thread. Her point was that despite having someone on ignore, you still see their posts when someone else quotes them. It is therefore ineffective as a total solution to the problem of ignoring someone completely.

Fence

[Petra]

Sweetie's melodramatics are wearing extremely thin. She reminds me of the kinds of men who cannot control their sexual urges, but will blame the women because the women aren't wearing burkhas. It's disingenuous and pathetic.

It's about time Sweetie grew the fuck up and took some responsibility for her own actions.

And, even if Sweetie's "point" was to show that she could still see material posted by Adora if it is quoted by another, she made her point in a totally bitchy and petty way, and shows herself to be no better than her perceived aggressor.


I have no sympathy for Sweetie at this point - none. To sympathise with her histrionics is to be an enabler to it.

[maddog]

Originally Posted by Fencesitter

I didn't see that as Sweetie's 'end'. I think her point was here:

here

That isn't different. Sweetie has simply repeated that she was "using" both SkepticJ and Adora to make a point -- a point that had nothing to do with Adora's picture or the Art thread. She effectively admits, twice, that she made a nasty post purely for derailing purposes. I'm frankly surprised and disappointed that she would do that, given how important she has said many times that it is to her for us to all behave civilly to one another.

Originally Posted by Fencesitter

. . . which was a point that she made earlier in this thread. Her point was that despite having someone on ignore, you still see their posts when someone else quotes them. It is therefore ineffective as a total solution to the problem of ignoring someone completely.

Perhaps. But notice how the goal has shifted from "avoiding harassment" to "a total solution to the problem of ignoring someone completely." The suggestion to "ignore" Adora was made to Sweetie to solve the problem of having Adora "follow Sweetie around" and make rude comments TO Sweetie ABOUT Sweetie -- i.e., "harassing" Sweetie.

I don't see how it "harasses" Sweetie for someone else, who isn't talking to Sweetie, to post Adora's picture for the purpose of commenting on the picture. Adora wasn't talking to or about Sweetie, and SkepticJ wasn't talking to or about Sweetie. Nobody said anything harassing or bad about Sweetie. How was seeing Adora's picture "harassing" to Sweetie? It simply wasn't part and parcel of the PURPOSE for which Sweetie was encouraged to put Adora on "ignore." Regardless of whatever justification Sweetie has for her opinion of Adora, and regardless of how she decides to treat Adora, I don't see what SkepticJ did that deserved being "used" in that fashion. It was unkind.

I agree with livius drusus that it's better to avoid quoting and repeating flames, but the mere existence of the picture was not a flame, and was definitely not a flame of or about Sweetie. It's also better not to purposely use people. It's also better not to say nasty things, especially if you don't mean them.

So, you're right, putting someone on "ignore" may not be "[]effective as a total solution to the problem of ignoring someone completely," but I never understood that that was the problem it was suggested to help alleviate.

If that's what this thread is about -- not that someone repeated an Adora flame about Sweetie where Sweetie had to see it -- but simply that Sweetie had to see the substance of an Adora post (a drawing) that had nothing to do with Sweetie and wasn't nasty in the slightest to Sweetie or anyone, then I don't understand it at all.
#607