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  #51  
Old 11-14-2011, 06:50 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

In both Morrowind and Oblivion, if I clicked directly on an object that was, say, 30' away or so, arrows fired would fall below it. I could hit it by clicking above it. At least in Morrowind, this was also true with creatures; to shoot a creature, I had to click above it, frequently entirely outside the model or even a box around the model. I didn't play Oblivion long enough to be quite sure how it worked, but I did notice the same basic thing; clicking on a thing did not aim at it, but rather, aimed below it by a distance determined by range.

The thing is. My basic wired-in concept of "an RPG" is that this is not how it works. In an RPG, I pick a target, and my clicking precision is irrelevant; if the engine is able to determine what I meant to click on, the sole determinants of my success are game-world things like character archery skill, dodges, etcetera. If a game does not work like that, but relies on my ability to decide how far above something to aim, it is not an RPG to me, no matter how many stats it has, because fundamentally I can only play characters who have my abilities.
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  #52  
Old 11-14-2011, 06:51 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

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So, yeah. Bethesda the corporation are being abusive assholes.
This is a sort of interesting tangent to the discussion in the Apple thrad. To the extent that this is true:

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Originally Posted by BrotherMan View Post
From a legal standpoint they do have to expend time, effort and money to defend perceived incursions on their brand. Agree with this specific case or not, it is something they have to do.
...I would think it's even more true in this case, given that the product lines are direct competitors in the same market.

Of course, that's not to say I approve.
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  #53  
Old 11-14-2011, 06:52 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

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If a game does not work like that, but relies on my ability to decide how far above something to aim, it is not an RPG to me, no matter how many stats it has, because fundamentally I can only play characters who have my abilities.
The "Action RPG" is a pretty common sub-genre these days.
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  #54  
Old 11-14-2011, 06:57 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

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In both Morrowind and Oblivion, if I clicked directly on an object that was, say, 30' away or so, arrows fired would fall below it. I could hit it by clicking above it. At least in Morrowind, this was also true with creatures; to shoot a creature, I had to click above it, frequently entirely outside the model or even a box around the model. I didn't play Oblivion long enough to be quite sure how it worked, but I did notice the same basic thing; clicking on a thing did not aim at it, but rather, aimed below it by a distance determined by range.

The thing is. My basic wired-in concept of "an RPG" is that this is not how it works. In an RPG, I pick a target, and my clicking precision is irrelevant; if the engine is able to determine what I meant to click on, the sole determinants of my success are game-world things like character archery skill, dodges, etcetera. If a game does not work like that, but relies on my ability to decide how far above something to aim, it is not an RPG to me, no matter how many stats it has, because fundamentally I can only play characters who have my abilities.
I can understand that. However I love FPSs so it doesn't really affect me.

Skill checks are more present in Skyrim but combat is still FPS.
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Old 11-14-2011, 07:13 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

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There are supposedly an 'infinite' number of side quests, but I've no idea how that works.
They have a quest generator of some kind. Sounds really interesting. It will be interesting to see if they get repetitive or not.
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  #56  
Old 11-14-2011, 07:17 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by seebs View Post
So, yeah. Bethesda the corporation are being abusive assholes.
This is a sort of interesting tangent to the discussion in the Apple thrad. To the extent that this is true:

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherMan View Post
From a legal standpoint they do have to expend time, effort and money to defend perceived incursions on their brand. Agree with this specific case or not, it is something they have to do.
...I would think it's even more true in this case, given that the product lines are direct competitors in the same market.

Of course, that's not to say I approve.
So far as I can tell, the legal requirement is COMPLETELY solved by sending a letter saying "hey, we have a trademark over sort of near that", and getting a response back saying "yes, you do, our thing is different, look how it is different."

And even if it weren't, it would absolutely be solved if Mojang were to drop the trademark application and change the name. Which they've offered to do.

So at this point it's just dickery, not a legal requirement. The original letter might have been a requirement; this isn't.
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  #57  
Old 11-14-2011, 07:18 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by seebs View Post
If a game does not work like that, but relies on my ability to decide how far above something to aim, it is not an RPG to me, no matter how many stats it has, because fundamentally I can only play characters who have my abilities.
The "Action RPG" is a pretty common sub-genre these days.
Yes. I sometimes like them, but I don't experience them as RPGs. They aren't about the character any more than a platformer is. And the thing is, the only appeal to me of the Big Worlds would be the character development and story. So an action RPG with a huge immersive world is pointless to me. Sad me.
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  #58  
Old 11-14-2011, 07:21 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

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Quote:
There are supposedly an 'infinite' number of side quests, but I've no idea how that works.
They have a quest generator of some kind. Sounds really interesting. It will be interesting to see if they get repetitive or not.
Supposedly, key characters in a quest aren't fixed. They get selected by the computer when the quest starts. This eliminates the need for tons of 'essential' characters who can't be killed.

I know there are unkillable characters in the game though. Reviews say that kids can't be killed. I know for a fact that Barnabas, the 'dog' that hangs out with Clavicus Vile is unkillable. I've done the quest with him and he couldn't have been taking damage since he was always in the front when enemies showed up.
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  #59  
Old 11-14-2011, 09:16 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

Does Skyrim have random ambient light sources in all the indoor environments to the point where torches and Night Eye are rendered utterly pointless, like Oblivion did? 'Cause I couldn't play Oblivion without modding that out.

Also, how does arrow damage scale? I always thought it was a bit low compared to melee and spell damage, making archer characters more difficult even above having to be more careful about aiming, and would usually tweak it up a bit with mods in both Oblivion and Morrowind.
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  #60  
Old 11-14-2011, 09:43 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

I would say those are both still issues. I haven't needed the one torch I picked up, and the arrows have really only proven successful against the weak ass skeletons.
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  #61  
Old 11-14-2011, 10:09 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

The only time I've used light spells were to investigate wall carving or search for treasure in dark corners. There have been a few times where night-eye would have been useful, but not many. I used it a lot in Oblivion as it made arrows and spells easier to target.

I've not messed with archery at all in this game, but in Oblivion it was great when combined with sneak attacks and often poison. "Must have been a ra...arghh," (thunk) said the bandit with a poisoned arrow sticking out of his head.
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  #62  
Old 11-15-2011, 01:51 AM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

Sounds like I'll be aiming to get this on PC, then, and mod it into the game I want...
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  #63  
Old 11-15-2011, 03:19 AM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

Mage's Guild quest line "spoiler"

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  #64  
Old 11-15-2011, 06:50 AM
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  #65  
Old 11-15-2011, 11:27 AM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

:muahaha:


What's funny is harvesting beehives for bees!
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  #66  
Old 11-15-2011, 11:44 AM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

You can do that? I'll have to try!
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Old 11-15-2011, 03:35 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

I'm covered in bees!
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  #68  
Old 11-15-2011, 04:07 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

Bees. My god.
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  #69  
Old 11-15-2011, 04:34 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

You can catch the fireflies, too. I haven't seen any bees or hives.
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Old 11-15-2011, 04:44 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

Bees, fireflies, butterflies and moths can be caught. Bees can be found in hives on trees. There are also some glowing pill bugs in dungeons.
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  #71  
Old 11-15-2011, 06:02 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

What do you do with the insects you catch? Pets? Crafting? Weird fetish stuff?
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  #72  
Old 11-15-2011, 06:06 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

I'm guessing alchemy, though I've never really dappled in the stuff in any of these games.
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  #73  
Old 11-15-2011, 06:18 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

Yep, alchemy. You can also catch and cook meat.
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  #74  
Old 11-15-2011, 07:41 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

It would be pretty cool to make armor out of bees but yeah alchemy. Food is no longer used in that skill but they added abunch of new ingredients.

Alchemy was way overpowered in Oblivion.
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  #75  
Old 11-16-2011, 09:48 PM
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Default Re: I almost wet myself.

Like I said before, I've got boundary issues



Apparently that is an actual mod in-game.
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