Cultural Appropriation and You

[Ari]

I often think of appropriation as not just taking but redefining or mocking other cultures through use. Especially if that culture was almost eradicated by yours.

Originally Posted by Watser?

I always have mixed emotions about people wearing dreadlocks, a religious symbol for the rastafarians. It's a bit like wearing skull caps if you're not Jewish.

Dreads are just a hair style and occurs naturally for some people. The problem comes with dreads and a rastacap (bonus if it's fake dreads sewn onto the cap dangling down) which not only clearly marks them as taken from rasta culture, it's an insult to that culture as rastacaps are worn to cover one's dreads from view in public.

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by Dingfod

That's Mr. Renaissance Man to you.

Thank you in advance,

You have my deepest sympathy.

[Dingfod]

Sympathy is the only thing I could hope for.

[chunksmediocrites]

There's a fine line. One can appreciate another culture without appropriating it in an arrogant or disrespectful, dehumanizing manner. Or one can be, as Qingdai succinctly states, an asshole.

On the subject of dreadlocks, as Ari pointed out they are not specific to Rastafarians- you can find them in a number of cultures historically. As well, religions that allow conversion can hardly be upset at appropriation of their symbols by the sincere- though certainly they could be dis-satisfied at the quality of converts.

It is my theory that sometimes Buddhism appeals to Americans because it does not carry the same cultural baggage that Christianity does for many; perhaps the same holds true for Korean Baptists in South Korea.

Music: yes, it can be a shame that music is appropriated by a dominant White culture. However with the example of rap music: the music is largely bought by people who are not Black- and for Black artists to profit, they rely in large part on sales outside the Black community. Profit and exposure is not the be-all end-all for every artist, but is important to many. The Beastie Boys are not Black- but they gave Public Enemy a national stage as their opening act when they toured, and exposed huge numbers of White people to Public Enemy's message. And you can find plenty of Black members of the hip-hop community who respect White, Latino, French, Samoan, or whatever hip-hop or rap artists, based on the skills and depth of the artists.

There are inexplicable or bizarre appropriations like German Hobby Indians, who are very into Native American practices and religion.

Or people with tattooed Chinese or Japanese script that they can't actually read or decipher.

A lot of it comes down to attempting to measure authenticity, and that makes me think of old Flip-Side Magazine letters columns that were constant rebuttals on what was Punk and who was really a Punk and who was just a poser- I don't have a lot of energy to spend on that.

Not that I'm not judgmental as fuck; I am. It's just that I am also aware that I may not have the whole story.

[Qingdai]

Germans, what don't they ruin?

I think they may fall under assholes. Seriously the more your culture dominates and subjugates another culture, the more the cultural appropriation can be horribly construed. I have met many a German traveling who have scorned Americans because of their treatment of Native Americans, which made me want to bring up the whole Jew thing. I suspect that the US support of Israel is along those lines, "See we're not as bad as the Germans." Also see: Australians and Aboriginals, Japanese and any minority in their culture.

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by chunksmediocrites

Or people with tattooed Chinese or Japanese script that they can't actually read or decipher.

My daughter wants to gert a tattoo in Latin, which I think is OK because English is partly derived from Latin. And she knows what it translates to in English.

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by Qingdai

Germans, what don't they ruin?

I think they may fall under assholes. Seriously the more your culture dominates and subjugates another culture, the more the cultural appropriation can be horribly construed. I have met many a German traveling who have scorned Americans because of their treatment of Native Americans, which made me want to bring up the whole Jew thing. I suspect that the US support of Israel is along those lines, "See we're not as bad as the Germans." Also see: Australians and Aboriginals, Japanese and any minority in their culture.

Unfortunately Genocide is not uncommon even now, History is full of it, but that doesn't make it right.

[erimir]

Originally Posted by Qingdai

I have met many a German traveling who have scorned Americans because of their treatment of Native Americans, which made me want to bring up the whole Jew thing.

I don't know nothin' bout how Germans treat Jews living there nowadays, but it might be a fair point if they're talking about current treatment of Native Americans.

If they're talking about the past, then yeah, they don't exactly have room to talk.

My dad likes to tell the story of how when he was in Sweden as an exchange student, people* would assume he didn't want to listen to records by black artists. Meanwhile, because of his darker Italian complexion, women* would pull their children close and call him a Gypsy when he was walking down the street.

*May have just been the one person in either case, I don't know. I have a feeling that's the sort of detail that he might have exaggerated

[ZEZOZE]

Hi!

[ZEZOZE]

in regard to unfair treatment of native americans, what colour are those doing the treating? is it all americans, or a division of them?

we divide at a cellular level. you can't help it. the best thing you can do is treat your body right.

[Gonzo]

Poor thread.

[ZEZOZE]

chipper up...it will work its way around me.

my resistance seems futile.

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by Dingfod

Sympathy is the only thing I could hope for.

Then you won't be disappointed with me.

[Angakuk]

I have to confess that I am guilty of cultural appropriation. I went to the local 4th of July rodeo today and wore Wrangler jeans, a western shirt, a cowboy hat and a cowboy boots, just so I could blend into the rodeo ambiance. I am such a bad person.


Wait! I just remembered that most of my maternal ancestors were cowboys.

Nevermind.

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by Angakuk

I have to confess that I am guilty of cultural appropriation. I went to the local 4th of July rodeo today and wore Wrangler jeans, a western shirt, a cowboy hat and a cowboy boots, just so I could blend into the rodeo ambiance. I am such a bad person.


Wait! I just remembered that most of my maternal ancestors were cowboys.

Nevermind.

Your 'Maternal Ancestors' were cowboys?

[Angakuk]

Yeah, my ancestors on my mother's side of the family. The male maternal ancestors anyway. Have you got a problem with that pilgrim?

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by Angakuk

Yeah, my ancestors on my mother's side of the family. The male maternal ancestors anyway. Have you got a problem with that pilgrim?

Read your posts again, it sounded like your grandmothers were 'cowboys'.

[AynMisesLibertarian]

The best thing about economic and cultural globalization is how the various specific stupid inferior culture and religion(the spirit of the Eagle?Jebus???yeaah? it is the 2013 moron,we have science) are destroyed

People are not longer bounded to culture and religion by a random choice("I born in texas,so I think and speak like a Texans") but can choice they personal culture and be free citizien in a barrier-less world

[Stormlight]

Originally Posted by AynMisesLibertarian

People are not longer bounded to culture and religion by a random choice("I born in texas,so I think and speak like a Texans") but can choice they personal culture and be free citizien in a barrier-less world

[erimir]

I had to double check that one to make sure it wasn't the librarian.

[Dingfod]

Is it cultural appropriation to wear cowboy boots and hats when you are not a cowboy? I think it is. We used to call them drug store cowboys, the ones that dressed up like cowboys and leaned up against the drug store on Saturday nights but had no cows and probably never rode a horse in their life.

[thedoc]

Originally Posted by Dingfod

Is it cultural appropriation to wear cowboy boots and hats when you are not a cowboy? I think it is. We used to call them drug store cowboys, the ones that dressed up like cowboys and leaned up against the drug store on Saturday nights but had no cows and probably never rode a horse in their life.

Interesting but I never leaned up against a drug store on a saturday night, and I don't wear hats.

[Dingfod]

But you herd cows and ride a horse, right?

[lisarea]

That's more like a poseur, I'd think.

Cowboyism is a job, maybe a lifestyle, not really a full blown culture, ultimately, and there hasn't been widespread or systemic genocide or enslavement of cowboys. It might be annoying in same way that it might be annoying to see kids wearing fake tour shirts they bought at Hot Topic or non-Germans wearing leather shorts.

So I vote it'd actually be appropriative to use the term cultural appropriation to describe that.

[Angakuk]

Originally Posted by thedoc

Read your posts again, it sounded like your grandmothers were 'cowboys'.

Only to someone who is just marginally literate.

A maternal ancestor is an ancestor on the mother's side, while a paternal ancestor is an ancestor on the father's side.

Now go get stuffed.