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  #226  
Old 07-30-2015, 09:32 PM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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  #227  
Old 07-31-2015, 01:20 AM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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You're not a monster; you're just not knowledgeable on the issue. There is harm in vaccination as more and more are added to the crazy vaccine schedule. There is no way yet to know the exact extent of the harm, long term. There are more and more adverse reactions seen right after or not long after the shots, including death. If these dreaded diseases were still around, and if vaccines were effective at eradicating these diseases without undue side-effects, that would be another story, but that's not the case.
Show us stats on the reactions and deaths you are talking about that have been objectively verified, not dumpster dived from the VAERS (which at one point indicated vaccines turned people into The Hulk), or parental anecdotes.


Quote:
VAERS is a passive reporting system. This means that anyone can report anything to it. There is no go-between. It’s almost like an online forum or message board; anyone can post and no one vets the claims. As such, a report in VAERS does not prove that any adverse event was actually caused by vaccines. In fact, it doesn't even prove that any reported adverse event actually existed. One of the more well-known examples of how any report makes it into VAERS was Dr. James Laidler’s report that the influenza vaccine turned him into the Incredible Hulk. He inspired Kevin Leitch from Left Brain Right Brain to report a similar Wonder Woman adverse event. Moms Who Vax: The Incredible Hulk Vaccine Side Effect: Or, Understanding VAERS
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  #228  
Old 07-31-2015, 01:32 AM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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Measeles is 90% contagious in an unvaccinated population. Only 170 got sick in the last outbreak which happened at Dinseyland. That is a win for vaccines, as thousands and maybe millions would have gotten sick if nobody were vaccinated.

We had all but eradicated measles in this country, it was reintroduced by foreign travel and purposeful non-vaccanation. If it were for anti-vaxxers we wouldn't have these types of outbreaks, only a few isolated cases.

It is known that vaccines are not effective in everyone. It is known that not everyone can be vaccinated. Not being 100% effective is not a reason to scrap the whole thing.
Only 14% of people in Disneyland measles outbreak were unvaccinated, but it's 100% their fault, claims propaganda - NaturalNews.com
That statistic is inaccurate and did not come from the actual status of the patients. You don't even try to see how these people vet their information do you?
This commenter on another site hit the nail on the head
Quote:
How did he get that figure, you wonder? It turns out that a study published recently in JAMA Pediatrics calculated the vaccination percentage in areas where case clusters occurred (not coverage among those who got sick), and pegged it at 50-86%.

So NN’s writer evidently glommed on to the high-end 86% estimate, stupidly (or maliciously) claimed that was the actual percentage of vaccination among measles victims, and used the number to argue for ineffectiveness of vaccination. Never mind that the study’s conclusion was 180 degrees in the opposite direction.

A link to a report on the study is provided at the end of the NN article. They [Natural News] apparently are confident their readers are too lazy or stupid to read it and draw their own conclusions A highly misguided concern about California SB 277 and cracking down on nonmedical vaccine exemptions – Respectful Insolence
Anyway, herd immunity requires about 95% vaccination rate to protect the vulnerable...those who are too young for the vaccine, immunocompromised, or those for whom the vaccine simply doesn't work.

Last edited by LadyShea; 07-31-2015 at 04:02 AM.
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  #229  
Old 07-31-2015, 02:53 AM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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Among the 110 California patients, 49 (45%) were unvaccinated; five (5%) had 1 dose of measles-containing vaccine, seven (6%) had 2 doses, one (1%) had 3 doses, 47 (43%) had unknown or undocumented vaccination status, and one (1%) had immunoglobulin G seropositivity documented, which indicates prior vaccination or measles infection at an undetermined time.

Twelve of the unvaccinated patients were infants too young to be vaccinated. Among the 37 remaining vaccine-eligible patients, 28 (67%) were intentionally unvaccinated because of personal beliefs, and one was on an alternative plan for vaccination. Among the 28 intentionally unvaccinated patients, 18 were children (aged <18 years), and 10 were adults. Patients range in age from 6 weeks to 70 years; the median age is 22 years. Among the 84 patients with known hospitalization status, 17 (20%) were hospitalized.
So among the 62 ill Californians whose vaccination status was known, only 1 was fully vaccinated with the recommended 3 doses. That's less than 1%.

12 of the 62 were only partially vaccinated. That's 19%

49 of the 62 were unvaccinated, that's 79%.


28 of the 49 unvaccinated from the 62 whose status was known were intentionally unvaccinated (as opposed to being too young), that's 45%.

About 43% of all California victims had unknown vaccination status

Wow, math sure is hard for anti-vaxxers I guess! Nothing about 14% of anything anywhere to be found!


Measles Outbreak — California, December 2014–February 2015

Last edited by LadyShea; 07-31-2015 at 03:29 AM.
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  #230  
Old 07-31-2015, 03:35 AM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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The majority of the 159 patients with reported measles in the 2015 outbreaks were either unvaccinated (71 [45%]) or had unknown vaccination status (60 [38%]); 28 (18%) had received measles vaccine. Among the 68 U.S. residents who had measles and were unvaccinated, 29 (43%) cited philosophical or religious objections to vaccination, 27 (40%) were ineligible because they were too young to receive vaccination (26 patients) or had a medical contraindication (one), three (4%) represented missed opportunities for vaccination, and nine (13%) had other reasons for not being vaccinated (Figure 2).

Of the 159 measles cases, 153 (96%) were import-associated. Ten cases were classified as direct importations, (six among unvaccinated U.S. residents returning from overseas travel, of whom three were aged 6–11 months and age-eligible for vaccination before departure, and four among foreign visitors). Countries associated with direct importations included Azerbaijan, China, Germany, India, Indonesia, Kyrgyzstan, Pakistan, Qatar, Singapore, and United Arab Emirates (one import each).
45% of US measels cases, whose status was known, in the US this year were unvaccinated

18% had received measles vaccine

Measles — United States, January 4–April 2, 2015
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  #231  
Old 07-31-2015, 04:25 AM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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Quote:
The majority of the 159 patients with reported measles in the 2015 outbreaks were either unvaccinated (71 [45%]) or had unknown vaccination status (60 [38%]); 28 (18%) had received measles vaccine. Among the 68 U.S. residents who had measles and were unvaccinated, 29 (43%) cited philosophical or religious objections to vaccination, 27 (40%) were ineligible because they were too young to receive vaccination (26 patients) or had a medical contraindication (one), three (4%) represented missed opportunities for vaccination, and nine (13%) had other reasons for not being vaccinated (Figure 2).

Of the 159 measles cases, 153 (96%) were import-associated. Ten cases were classified as direct importations, (six among unvaccinated U.S. residents returning from overseas travel, of whom three were aged 6–11 months and age-eligible for vaccination before departure, and four among foreign visitors). Countries associated with direct importations included Azerbaijan, China, Germany, India, Indonesia, Kyrgyzstan, Pakistan, Qatar, Singapore, and United Arab Emirates (one import each).
45% of US measels cases, whose status was known, in the US this year were unvaccinated

18% had received measles vaccine

Measles — United States, January 4–April 2, 2015
And, some 38% had an unknown status...might be unvaccinated, might be vaccinated.

Thus, we can confidently state that more than 18% of those affected by the measles outbreak in California were vaccinated. That's a considerably higher vaccine failure rate than touted by Merck, the vaccine manufacturer.
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  #232  
Old 07-31-2015, 05:01 AM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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Originally Posted by LadyShea View Post
Quote:
The majority of the 159 patients with reported measles in the 2015 outbreaks were either unvaccinated (71 [45%]) or had unknown vaccination status (60 [38%]); 28 (18%) had received measles vaccine. Among the 68 U.S. residents who had measles and were unvaccinated, 29 (43%) cited philosophical or religious objections to vaccination, 27 (40%) were ineligible because they were too young to receive vaccination (26 patients) or had a medical contraindication (one), three (4%) represented missed opportunities for vaccination, and nine (13%) had other reasons for not being vaccinated (Figure 2).

Of the 159 measles cases, 153 (96%) were import-associated. Ten cases were classified as direct importations, (six among unvaccinated U.S. residents returning from overseas travel, of whom three were aged 6–11 months and age-eligible for vaccination before departure, and four among foreign visitors). Countries associated with direct importations included Azerbaijan, China, Germany, India, Indonesia, Kyrgyzstan, Pakistan, Qatar, Singapore, and United Arab Emirates (one import each).
45% of US measels cases, whose status was known, in the US this year were unvaccinated

18% had received measles vaccine

Measles — United States, January 4–April 2, 2015
And, some 38% had an unknown status...might be unvaccinated, might be vaccinated.

Thus, we can confidently state that more than 18% of those affected by the measles outbreak in California were vaccinated. That's a considerably higher vaccine failure rate than touted by Merck, the vaccine manufacturer.
All we know is they had some vaccine, may not have had all 3

Also we already talked about this, clinical trial efficacy and live population effectiveness over time are not the same . The manufacturers cant report on the latter.

As I said a few months ago, you cannot judge the effectiveness of a vaccine by the raw numbers of a single outbreak. That's just irrational.
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  #233  
Old 07-31-2015, 05:35 AM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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Originally Posted by LadyShea View Post
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Originally Posted by godfry n. glad View Post
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Originally Posted by LadyShea View Post
Quote:
The majority of the 159 patients with reported measles in the 2015 outbreaks were either unvaccinated (71 [45%]) or had unknown vaccination status (60 [38%]); 28 (18%) had received measles vaccine. Among the 68 U.S. residents who had measles and were unvaccinated, 29 (43%) cited philosophical or religious objections to vaccination, 27 (40%) were ineligible because they were too young to receive vaccination (26 patients) or had a medical contraindication (one), three (4%) represented missed opportunities for vaccination, and nine (13%) had other reasons for not being vaccinated (Figure 2).

Of the 159 measles cases, 153 (96%) were import-associated. Ten cases were classified as direct importations, (six among unvaccinated U.S. residents returning from overseas travel, of whom three were aged 6–11 months and age-eligible for vaccination before departure, and four among foreign visitors). Countries associated with direct importations included Azerbaijan, China, Germany, India, Indonesia, Kyrgyzstan, Pakistan, Qatar, Singapore, and United Arab Emirates (one import each).
45% of US measels cases, whose status was known, in the US this year were unvaccinated

18% had received measles vaccine

Measles — United States, January 4–April 2, 2015
And, some 38% had an unknown status...might be unvaccinated, might be vaccinated.

Thus, we can confidently state that more than 18% of those affected by the measles outbreak in California were vaccinated. That's a considerably higher vaccine failure rate than touted by Merck, the vaccine manufacturer.
All we know is they had some vaccine, may not have had all 3

Also we already talked about this, clinical trial efficacy and live population effectiveness over time are not the same . The manufacturers cant report on the latter.

As I said a few months ago, you cannot judge the effectiveness of a vaccine by the raw numbers of a single outbreak. That's just irrational.

So, stop throwing around all the pointless statistics, then.

CDC says two injections, with the first injection producing 95-98% develop antibodies in the vaccinated, with 99% after the second injection.
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  #234  
Old 07-31-2015, 06:23 AM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

The stats are not pointless,I was refuting a specific claim about this outbreak. They are important to the larger isuue as the majority of measles cases in the last 10 years have been amongst the unvaccinated or started by an unvaccinated person. Vaccine failure rate is a related issue, also important, but requires a different analysis. It is also one of the reasons herd immunity is even a thing.
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  #235  
Old 07-31-2015, 07:29 AM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

peacegirl, are cabalist Jews their own God? I ask because your new friends at Liberty Round Table are pretty sure the answer is yes.

It's astonishing. How on Earth do you keep finding these brand new treasure troves of racist crazies?
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  #236  
Old 07-31-2015, 12:20 PM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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Originally Posted by LadyShea View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
You're not a monster; you're just not knowledgeable on the issue. There is harm in vaccination as more and more are added to the crazy vaccine schedule. There is no way yet to know the exact extent of the harm, long term. There are more and more adverse reactions seen right after or not long after the shots, including death. If these dreaded diseases were still around, and if vaccines were effective at eradicating these diseases without undue side-effects, that would be another story, but that's not the case.
Show us stats on the reactions and deaths you are talking about that have been objectively verified, not dumpster dived from the VAERS (which at one point indicated vaccines turned people into The Hulk), or parental anecdotes.


Quote:
VAERS is a passive reporting system. This means that anyone can report anything to it. There is no go-between. It’s almost like an online forum or message board; anyone can post and no one vets the claims. As such, a report in VAERS does not prove that any adverse event was actually caused by vaccines. In fact, it doesn't even prove that any reported adverse event actually existed. One of the more well-known examples of how any report makes it into VAERS was Dr. James Laidler’s report that the influenza vaccine turned him into the Incredible Hulk. He inspired Kevin Leitch from Left Brain Right Brain to report a similar Wonder Woman adverse event. Moms Who Vax: The Incredible Hulk Vaccine Side Effect: Or, Understanding VAERS
Off subject but indirectly related, if studies are so important to people rather than anecdotal reports by parents who see their children day in and day out, why don't they study the vaccinated versus unvaccinated, which would give a picture of the general health of each group thereby offering valuable information? I know why. It's not because it's unethical to not get children vaccinated (there are many unvaccinated children who would volunteer for the job, I'm sure). It's because they're afraid of what they might find. The studies that you are counting on to be accurate don't give the full picture, so we can't use them either.
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  #237  
Old 07-31-2015, 12:31 PM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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Originally Posted by LadyShea View Post
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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
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Originally Posted by LadyShea View Post
Measeles is 90% contagious in an unvaccinated population. Only 170 got sick in the last outbreak which happened at Dinseyland. That is a win for vaccines, as thousands and maybe millions would have gotten sick if nobody were vaccinated.

We had all but eradicated measles in this country, it was reintroduced by foreign travel and purposeful non-vaccanation. If it were for anti-vaxxers we wouldn't have these types of outbreaks, only a few isolated cases.

It is known that vaccines are not effective in everyone. It is known that not everyone can be vaccinated. Not being 100% effective is not a reason to scrap the whole thing.
Only 14% of people in Disneyland measles outbreak were unvaccinated, but it's 100% their fault, claims propaganda - NaturalNews.com
That statistic is inaccurate and did not come from the actual status of the patients. You don't even try to see how these people vet their information do you?
This commenter on another site hit the nail on the head
Quote:
How did he get that figure, you wonder? It turns out that a study published recently in JAMA Pediatrics calculated the vaccination percentage in areas where case clusters occurred (not coverage among those who got sick), and pegged it at 50-86%.

So NN’s writer evidently glommed on to the high-end 86% estimate, stupidly (or maliciously) claimed that was the actual percentage of vaccination among measles victims, and used the number to argue for ineffectiveness of vaccination. Never mind that the study’s conclusion was 180 degrees in the opposite direction.

A link to a report on the study is provided at the end of the NN article. They [Natural News] apparently are confident their readers are too lazy or stupid to read it and draw their own conclusions A highly misguided concern about California SB 277 and cracking down on nonmedical vaccine exemptions – Respectful Insolence
Anyway, herd immunity requires about 95% vaccination rate to protect the vulnerable...those who are too young for the vaccine, immunocompromised, or those for whom the vaccine simply doesn't work.
The False Theory of Vaccine Derived - Herd Immunity

If vaccine derived herd immunity were a realistic and proven theory; then there would be some scientific evidence behind it. After reviewing numerous studies that were claimed to represent and show the vaccine derived herd immunity theory to have a scientific basis; I conclude that there is NO scientific backing for the claim. Correlation equals causation, simply can not and should not be applied only where it benefits the intended promotional agenda, and then at the same time the same principal is disregarded, where it does not produce a conclusion favorable to the intended and thus promoted agenda. You can not have it both ways, and not lose major credibility, as to the level of existing bias.

What we can find is the backing for is the premise of natural herd immunity, because the majority of those thus becoming immune, have life long immunity. Any even 3rd grade science student, could comprehend the obvious validity of that basic concept.

The huge hole in the obviously incorrect concept of vaccine derived herd immunity, is exactly this. Vaccines do no provide increased vaccine derived antibody production, for life. Vaccines only provide relatively passive immunity, if and when they provide protection at all; and providing as well that over time the targeted pathogen has not mutated or changed to a point that the vaccine has become increasingly ineffective. This is what is happening currently in regard to the pertussis vaccine. As well in the use of the DPaT or whatever vaccine in the past was or currently is; other similar pathogens tend to because of the vaccine, as well become more commonly seen, dominant; and at times even more virulent. In regard to the known and current pertussis outbreaks, that non vaccine targeted pathogen is B.parapertusis; with B. pertussis of course being the existing vaccine targeted pathogen.

The second phase as to the understanding of why vaccine derived herd immunity is a myth, is to realize that thousands and if not millions of adults exist with having had no vaccines in decades. What are the odds that their childhood vaccines still protect them from polio, small pox, pertussis, diphtheria, measles, rubella, etc??? Agreed, there is a big push in the recent past to give tetanus boosters to adults, which often includes the entire, DTaP. But think of all the decades that have gone by where the ONLY people in that vaccinated herd, were the infants, and school children. In the recent past more of the CDC directive has gone to vaccination boosters for teens and college students, for certain, but limited numbers of vaccines.

In the extensive time I have researched vaccines, I find and conclude that we have been mislead and lied to about the safety and effectiveness of vaccines, for the past 100 years. The balance in any medical procedure, treatment, and as well as to vaccines is exactly this; at what point is more harm than good being done???? If you do not know the real facts truth; and/or if those have been hidden from the pubic, and/ or covered up; then how would you know when and where the balance between more harm than good is being done?

In any case, the pro-vaccine side always claims that they are, and have always been about the science, and the scientific method, and that to back their vaccine claims. They do this, even all the while in which at the same time the CDC refuses to acknowledge the bulwark of existing scientific evidence, as to the harm of vaccines; as well as to the vaccine connection to the current major increases in cases of ASD.

The existing so called authorities lie to the public, and falsely present with their repeated claim that the science showing the vaccine caused neurological harm and as well in regard to the causation of ASD, that the science simply does not exist to support that claim. Nothing, could be further from the truth. The real science has existed front and center, the whole time. If the CDC does no acknowledge the scientific study; in their world it simply is non existent. If the science does not support the vaccine agenda, as for the CDC; it does not exist. With the current numbers of ASD at now said 1 in 88; should NOT the CDC be looking at all of the available science, and following up with further larger scale studies? There is stated large amounts of funding available, however they refuse to look at anything but genetics, and anything other than vaccines. Anything they can blame it all on, but vaccines. They are in as well, quite obvious deep denial of all. They at they CDC quite obviously have everything to lose, if the truth be known; and with no way to further make any denial of it all.

The False Theory of Vaccine Derived - Herd Immunity - Vaccine Facts
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  #238  
Old 07-31-2015, 01:56 PM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyShea View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
You're not a monster; you're just not knowledgeable on the issue. There is harm in vaccination as more and more are added to the crazy vaccine schedule. There is no way yet to know the exact extent of the harm, long term. There are more and more adverse reactions seen right after or not long after the shots, including death. If these dreaded diseases were still around, and if vaccines were effective at eradicating these diseases without undue side-effects, that would be another story, but that's not the case.
Show us stats on the reactions and deaths you are talking about that have been objectively verified, not dumpster dived from the VAERS (which at one point indicated vaccines turned people into The Hulk), or parental anecdotes.


Quote:
VAERS is a passive reporting system. This means that anyone can report anything to it. There is no go-between. It’s almost like an online forum or message board; anyone can post and no one vets the claims. As such, a report in VAERS does not prove that any adverse event was actually caused by vaccines. In fact, it doesn't even prove that any reported adverse event actually existed. One of the more well-known examples of how any report makes it into VAERS was Dr. James Laidler’s report that the influenza vaccine turned him into the Incredible Hulk. He inspired Kevin Leitch from Left Brain Right Brain to report a similar Wonder Woman adverse event. Moms Who Vax: The Incredible Hulk Vaccine Side Effect: Or, Understanding VAERS
Off subject but indirectly related, if studies are so important to people rather than anecdotal reports by parents who see their children day in and day out, why don't they study the vaccinated versus unvaccinated, which would give a picture of the general health of each group thereby offering valuable information? I know why. It's not because it's unethical to not get children vaccinated (there are many unvaccinated children who would volunteer for the job, I'm sure). It's because they're afraid of what they might find. The studies that you are counting on to be accurate don't give the full picture, so we can't use them either.
Why dont they? There are scientists and doctors on the anti-vax side of the issue, why do they rely on anecdotes instead of doing valid medical research?

And you are deluded if you thin non vaxxers would volunteer for a mainstream medicine study. They dont trust doctors, remember?
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  #239  
Old 07-31-2015, 02:21 PM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
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Originally Posted by LadyShea View Post
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Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
You're not a monster; you're just not knowledgeable on the issue. There is harm in vaccination as more and more are added to the crazy vaccine schedule. There is no way yet to know the exact extent of the harm, long term. There are more and more adverse reactions seen right after or not long after the shots, including death. If these dreaded diseases were still around, and if vaccines were effective at eradicating these diseases without undue side-effects, that would be another story, but that's not the case.
Show us stats on the reactions and deaths you are talking about that have been objectively verified, not dumpster dived from the VAERS (which at one point indicated vaccines turned people into The Hulk), or parental anecdotes.


Quote:
VAERS is a passive reporting system. This means that anyone can report anything to it. There is no go-between. It’s almost like an online forum or message board; anyone can post and no one vets the claims. As such, a report in VAERS does not prove that any adverse event was actually caused by vaccines. In fact, it doesn't even prove that any reported adverse event actually existed. One of the more well-known examples of how any report makes it into VAERS was Dr. James Laidler’s report that the influenza vaccine turned him into the Incredible Hulk. He inspired Kevin Leitch from Left Brain Right Brain to report a similar Wonder Woman adverse event. Moms Who Vax: The Incredible Hulk Vaccine Side Effect: Or, Understanding VAERS
Off subject but indirectly related, if studies are so important to people rather than anecdotal reports by parents who see their children day in and day out, why don't they study the vaccinated versus unvaccinated, which would give a picture of the general health of each group thereby offering valuable information? I know why. It's not because it's unethical to not get children vaccinated (there are many unvaccinated children who would volunteer for the job, I'm sure). It's because they're afraid of what they might find. The studies that you are counting on to be accurate don't give the full picture, so we can't use them either.
Why dont they? There are scientists and doctors on the anti-vax side of the issue, why do they rely on anecdotes instead of doing valid medical research?
Because anecdotal evidence is a sound way to go forward. Are you kidding me LadyShea? If your child was okay and suddenly regressed an hour or a day (even) after receiving a triple dose MMR vaccination; that wouldn't be cause for concern as astute as you are in your quest for truth? Come on, be honest for a change. Stop making it appear that there are NO RISKS in giving vaccines to certain children. It makes you look very biased.

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And you are deluded if you thin non vaxxers would volunteer for a mainstream medicine study. They dont trust doctors, remember?
Of course they would. They're doing it in Germany. You are uninformed and are only trying to protect your double blind empirical studies which prove nothing whatsoever because they are incomplete and do not prove your case.

Studies Outside the U.S. Show Unvaccinated Children Healthier than Vaccinated Children

Health Impact News Editor Comments:

Christina England has done an excellent job of digging up some previous studies conducted in New Zealand and Germany comparing vaccinated children with unvaccinated children.

In addition to these two studies, there was also a clinical study conducted in Hong Kong in in 2012 comparing vaccinated with unvaccinated children in regards to the flu vaccine. Researchers conducted a double-blind placebo-controlled trial on children with the trivalent inactivated influenza vaccine. Their results were published in the journal Clinical Infectious Diseases in 2012, and they found that the seasonal trivalent flu vaccine resulted in 5.5 times more incidents of respiratory illness than the placebo group. Read more about the study here.

If you watch the video below of Congressman Posey questioning the CDC at an autism Congressional hearing back in November of 2012, you will hear the CDC admit that they have never conducted a study in the U.S. comparing vaccinated with unvaccinated children.

Studies Prove Without Doubt That Unvaccinated Children Are Far Healthier Than Their Vaccinated Peers

By Christina England
VacTruth.com

A study from the 1990s has come to light, proving that compared to unvaccinated children, vaccinated children were more likely to suffer from asthma, eczema, ear infections, hyperactivity and many other chronic conditions.

Furthermore, the study identified that there was a ten-fold increase in the incidence of tonsillitis in the children who were vaccinated, and a total lack tonsillectomy operations among the children who were unvaccinated. In 1992, the Immunization Awareness Society (IAS) conducted a survey to examine the health of New Zealand’s children.

Unsurprisingly, the results of their study indicated that unvaccinated children were far healthier than vaccinated children. Questionnaires were given out to IAS members, their friends and their associates asking various health questions. A total of 245 families returned their questionnaires, giving the researchers a total of 495 children surveyed. Of these children, 226 were vaccinated and 269 were unvaccinated.

Healthy Children and Ethics

The ages of the children ranged between the ages of two weeks – 46 years (obviously some friends were older with older children). Of the children studied, 273 were males and 216 were females. (Six children were unclassified.) Sue Claridge, who reported on the study, wrote:

“Respondents were asked to provide the year of birth, gender, vaccinations received, whether or not the child suffered from a range of chronic conditions (asthma, eczema, ear infections/glue ear, recurring tonsillitis, hyperactivity, diabetes or epilepsy) whether or not he or she needed grommets, had had a tonsillectomy, or were shown to develop motor skills (walking, crawling, sitting-up etc.). Parents also provided information on breastfeeding and bottle feeding and when a child was weaned if breastfed.”

During the study, another interesting fact emerged. Researchers discovered that 92 percent of the children requiring a tonsillectomy operation had received the measles vaccination, indicating that the vaccination for measles may have made some of the children more susceptible to tonsillitis. The study also revealed that 81 of the families had both vaccinated and unvaccinated children. Many of these families had vaccinated their older children but had grown more reluctant to vaccinate their younger children, due to their growing concerns regarding vaccine safety. Researchers concluded that:

“While this was a very limited study, particularly in terms of the numbers of unvaccinated children that were involved and the range of chronic conditions investigated, it provides solid scientific evidence in support of considerable anecdotal evidence that unvaccinated children are healthier that their vaccinated peers.” [1]

Although governments from around the world have continually stated that studying vaccinated versus unvaccinated children would be unethical, the New Zealand researchers are not the only group of researchers to study comparisons.

Vaccinated Children 5 Times More Likely To Suffer From A Range Of Diseases

Continued at: http://healthimpactnews.com/2014/stu....SJebQmpz.dpuf

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Old 07-31-2015, 02:36 PM
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The majority of the 159 patients with reported measles in the 2015 outbreaks were either unvaccinated (71 [45%]) or had unknown vaccination status (60 [38%]); 28 (18%) had received measles vaccine. Among the 68 U.S. residents who had measles and were unvaccinated, 29 (43%) cited philosophical or religious objections to vaccination, 27 (40%) were ineligible because they were too young to receive vaccination (26 patients) or had a medical contraindication (one), three (4%) represented missed opportunities for vaccination, and nine (13%) had other reasons for not being vaccinated (Figure 2).

Of the 159 measles cases, 153 (96%) were import-associated. Ten cases were classified as direct importations, (six among unvaccinated U.S. residents returning from overseas travel, of whom three were aged 6–11 months and age-eligible for vaccination before departure, and four among foreign visitors). Countries associated with direct importations included Azerbaijan, China, Germany, India, Indonesia, Kyrgyzstan, Pakistan, Qatar, Singapore, and United Arab Emirates (one import each).
45% of US measels cases, whose status was known, in the US this year were unvaccinated

18% had received measles vaccine

Measles — United States, January 4–April 2, 2015
And, some 38% had an unknown status...might be unvaccinated, might be vaccinated.

Thus, we can confidently state that more than 18% of those affected by the measles outbreak in California were vaccinated. That's a considerably higher vaccine failure rate than touted by Merck, the vaccine manufacturer.
That doesn't work. The fraction of vaccinated people who get sick and the fraction of sick people who are vaccinated are two completely different numbers. Look up conditional probability.
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Old 07-31-2015, 03:27 PM
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The majority of the 159 patients with reported measles in the 2015 outbreaks were either unvaccinated (71 [45%]) or had unknown vaccination status (60 [38%]); 28 (18%) had received measles vaccine. Among the 68 U.S. residents who had measles and were unvaccinated, 29 (43%) cited philosophical or religious objections to vaccination, 27 (40%) were ineligible because they were too young to receive vaccination (26 patients) or had a medical contraindication (one), three (4%) represented missed opportunities for vaccination, and nine (13%) had other reasons for not being vaccinated (Figure 2).

Of the 159 measles cases, 153 (96%) were import-associated. Ten cases were classified as direct importations, (six among unvaccinated U.S. residents returning from overseas travel, of whom three were aged 6–11 months and age-eligible for vaccination before departure, and four among foreign visitors). Countries associated with direct importations included Azerbaijan, China, Germany, India, Indonesia, Kyrgyzstan, Pakistan, Qatar, Singapore, and United Arab Emirates (one import each).
45% of US measels cases, whose status was known, in the US this year were unvaccinated

18% had received measles vaccine

Measles — United States, January 4–April 2, 2015
And, some 38% had an unknown status...might be unvaccinated, might be vaccinated.

Thus, we can confidently state that more than 18% of those affected by the measles outbreak in California were vaccinated. That's a considerably higher vaccine failure rate than touted by Merck, the vaccine manufacturer.
That doesn't work. The fraction of vaccinated people who get sick and the fraction of sick people who are vaccinated are two completely different numbers. Look up conditional probability.
They may be two different numbers, but that does not exclude the real possibility that those who are vaccinated have a higher degree of chronic illness than those who are not vaccinated. As I said earlier, why are these studies not being done? That doesn't even touch the issue of the MMR vaccine which has been implicated in an array of problems that are directly aimed at this shot, notwithstanding: regressive autism. There are no measles vaccines that stand alone, so this muddies the waters when it comes to accurate diagnosing.
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They may be two different numbers, but that does not exclude the real possibility that those who are vaccinated have a higher degree of chronic illness than those who are not vaccinated. As I said earlier, why are these studies not being done?
Probably because there is no good evidence for any of that.

Earlier, you posted a link saying that neutrinos don't exist by a crank who thinks the Earth is expanding, so I'll just assume you're hopelessly confused and incapable of critical thinking.
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Old 07-31-2015, 04:38 PM
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They may be two different numbers, but that does not exclude the real possibility that those who are vaccinated have a higher degree of chronic illness than those who are not vaccinated. As I said earlier, why are these studies not being done?
Probably because there is no good evidence for any of that.

Earlier, you posted a link saying that neutrinos don't exist by a crank who thinks the Earth is expanding, so I'll just assume you're hopelessly confused and incapable of critical thinking.
I'm sorry but you're dealing with theory, not fact. Critical thinking must take into consideration the possibility that the theory itself is misleading otherwise bias will take over and disallow anyone who challenges that theory however factual it appears. It is also true that once a "theory" is granted factual status, it can lead to confirmation bias. That's why I urge people to try to understand the reason Lessans came to the conclusions he did, otherwise, you're doing what everyone else has been doing; trying to negate his claims in a way that is inherently partial to the existing theory. That is not sound investigation. We're in the wrong thread. Please let's not mix them up so as to cause further confusion.
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Old 07-31-2015, 04:47 PM
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You're not a monster; you're just not knowledgeable on the issue. There is harm in vaccination as more and more are added to the crazy vaccine schedule. There is no way yet to know the exact extent of the harm, long term. There are more and more adverse reactions seen right after or not long after the shots, including death. If these dreaded diseases were still around, and if vaccines were effective at eradicating these diseases without undue side-effects, that would be another story, but that's not the case.
Show us stats on the reactions and deaths you are talking about that have been objectively verified, not dumpster dived from the VAERS (which at one point indicated vaccines turned people into The Hulk), or parental anecdotes.


Quote:
VAERS is a passive reporting system. This means that anyone can report anything to it. There is no go-between. It’s almost like an online forum or message board; anyone can post and no one vets the claims. As such, a report in VAERS does not prove that any adverse event was actually caused by vaccines. In fact, it doesn't even prove that any reported adverse event actually existed. One of the more well-known examples of how any report makes it into VAERS was Dr. James Laidler’s report that the influenza vaccine turned him into the Incredible Hulk. He inspired Kevin Leitch from Left Brain Right Brain to report a similar Wonder Woman adverse event. Moms Who Vax: The Incredible Hulk Vaccine Side Effect: Or, Understanding VAERS
Off subject but indirectly related, if studies are so important to people rather than anecdotal reports by parents who see their children day in and day out, why don't they study the vaccinated versus unvaccinated, which would give a picture of the general health of each group thereby offering valuable information? I know why. It's not because it's unethical to not get children vaccinated (there are many unvaccinated children who would volunteer for the job, I'm sure). It's because they're afraid of what they might find. The studies that you are counting on to be accurate don't give the full picture, so we can't use them either.
Why dont they? There are scientists and doctors on the anti-vax side of the issue, why do they rely on anecdotes instead of doing valid medical research?

And you are deluded if you thin non vaxxers would volunteer for a mainstream medicine study. They dont trust doctors, remember?
There are many studies that show a link between certain vaccines and autism. Doctors, on the other hand, don't do the research. They only go by what the CDC and Big Pharm tells them. You cannot go by what the typical doctor says because they are just parroting what they have been told.

The Vaccine Safety Myth

Posted on: Tuesday, February 10th 2015 at 11:15 am
Written By: Jamie Deckoff-Jones, MD
The Vaccine Safety Myth

Vaccines are proven safe, right? You may be surprised to find how non-evidence based this belief really is....

A few days ago, The Washington Post published an op-ed piece by a medical ethicist who thinks that all doctors who have concerns about vaccines should lose their licenses. Last week, it was parents who don't vaccinate their children should be jailed or sued. There are case reports where not vaccinating has been used as proof of neglect for CPS to remove children and terminate parental rights. Whatever you think about vaccination, think hard before you endorse the idea that the government should be able to mandate a profitable but invasive medical procedure without informed consent. This is a very dangerous precedent to set and one you may not be happy about when vaccines are mandated for adults to protect our "herd immunity". It is not about the measles. It is about your freedom to choose what goes into your body and your child's body.

Although we keep hearing from the media and the medical establishment that vaccines are unquestionably safe, the supreme court has deemed them "unavoidably unsafe" as recently as 2011. Pharmaceutical companies are indemnified by the government against liability and pediatricians also cannot be sued for vaccine injury. Rather, there is a special vaccine court that compensates the very few patients who can prove their injury beyond a shadow of a doubt. The National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program has paid out over 3 billion dollars to date.

We keep hearing about the overwhelming proof that vaccines and the MMR in particular is safe. Anyone who questions this is being ridiculed. Concerned parents are stupid and concerned doctors don't understand the science. Well, here is the science, from the most recent Cochrane Review of the entire literature on the subject. Cochrane Reviews are systematic reviews and meta-analyses which interpret the research and are generally recognised as the highest standard in evidence-based health care.

Cochrane Database Syst Rev. 2012 Feb 15;2:CD004407. doi: 10.1002/14651858.CD004407.pub3.

Vaccines for measles, mumps and rubella in children.

Demicheli V1, Rivetti A, Debalini MG, Di Pietrantonj C.

Partial Abstract

BACKGROUND:

Mumps, measles and rubella (MMR) are serious diseases that can lead to potentially fatal illness, disability and death. However, public debate over the safety of the trivalent MMR vaccine and the resultant drop in vaccination coverage in several countries persists, despite its almost universal use and accepted effectiveness.

OBJECTIVES:

To assess the effectiveness and adverse effects associated with the MMR vaccine in children up to 15 years of age.

SEARCH METHODS:

For this update we searched the Cochrane Central Register of Controlled Trials (CENTRAL) (The Cochrane Library 2011, Issue 2), which includes the Cochrane Acute Respiratory Infections Group's Specialised Register, PubMed (July 2004 to May week 2, 2011) and Embase.com (July 2004 to May 2011).

AUTHORS' CONCLUSIONS:

The design and reporting of safety outcomes in MMR vaccine studies, both pre- and post-marketing, are largely inadequate. The evidence of adverse events following immunisation with the MMR vaccine cannot be separated from its role in preventing the target diseases.

The full paper is behind a paywall, but I've read it in its entirety. The authors screened approximately 5000 papers, found 139 possible for inclusion and ended up with 31 papers that met their criteria. They rated 26 of 31 as having high or moderate risk of bias, most commonly selection bias. They concluded that there was no data to support efficacy, "We were disappointed by our inability to identify effectiveness studies with population or clinical outcomes. Given the existence of documented elimination of targeted diseases in large population by means of mass immunisation campaigns however, we have no reason to doubt the effectiveness of MMR." So we believe it, because we all saw it happen, not because there is a study which shows it to be true.

They state that there is no evidence for an association between MMR and autism, but the only included study which could possibly answer the question, comparing vaccinated to unvaccinated children, is Madsen 2002. One of the co-authors of that paper is Poul Thorsen, on the OIG's most wanted list for fraud. Thorsen is a co-author of 22 papers on autism and 5 papers on vaccine safety that still stand and are widely referenced by other authors. Even if including a paper co-authored by Thorsen doesn't bother you, their note on the Madsen study concludes: "The follow up of diagnostic records ends one year (31 Dec 1999) after the last day of admission to the cohort. Because of the length of time from birth to diagnosis, it becomes increasingly unlikely that those born later in the cohort could have a diagnosis." They noted the general absence of studies with unvaccinated controls. The reason given is that it would be unethical to have unvaccinated controls.

DeStefano 2004 is also included. One of the authors of that paper was reportedly granted official whistleblower status and immunity, alleging that the authors manipulated data to cover an association between the vaccine and autism in African American males vaccinated before the age of 36 months. Those authors are collectively responsible for a lot of the "indisputable" science we are hearing so much about. From a few months ago: The Fox Guarding The Henhouse.

CDC COVERUP

Here is a compilation of abstracts, 86 Research Papers Supporting the Vaccine/Autism Link (http://www.scribd.com/doc/220807175/...Vaccine-Autism) , but the media keeps telling us there is no evidence that vaccines can cause autism.

Why has there never been a well designed study comparing vaccinated to unvaccinated children? Rumor has it that Amish children don't get autism. Why isn't the CDC doing everything it can to figure out if that's true and, if so, why? The NIH just canceled the National Children's Study after wasting over 1.2 billion dollars.

continued at: http://www.greenmedinfo.com/blog/vaccine-safety-myth
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Old 07-31-2015, 05:30 PM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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The majority of the 159 patients with reported measles in the 2015 outbreaks were either unvaccinated (71 [45%]) or had unknown vaccination status (60 [38%]); 28 (18%) had received measles vaccine. Among the 68 U.S. residents who had measles and were unvaccinated, 29 (43%) cited philosophical or religious objections to vaccination, 27 (40%) were ineligible because they were too young to receive vaccination (26 patients) or had a medical contraindication (one), three (4%) represented missed opportunities for vaccination, and nine (13%) had other reasons for not being vaccinated (Figure 2).

Of the 159 measles cases, 153 (96%) were import-associated. Ten cases were classified as direct importations, (six among unvaccinated U.S. residents returning from overseas travel, of whom three were aged 6–11 months and age-eligible for vaccination before departure, and four among foreign visitors). Countries associated with direct importations included Azerbaijan, China, Germany, India, Indonesia, Kyrgyzstan, Pakistan, Qatar, Singapore, and United Arab Emirates (one import each).
45% of US measels cases, whose status was known, in the US this year were unvaccinated

18% had received measles vaccine

Measles — United States, January 4–April 2, 2015
And, some 38% had an unknown status...might be unvaccinated, might be vaccinated.

Thus, we can confidently state that more than 18% of those affected by the measles outbreak in California were vaccinated. That's a considerably higher vaccine failure rate than touted by Merck, the vaccine manufacturer.
That doesn't work. The fraction of vaccinated people who get sick and the fraction of sick people who are vaccinated are two completely different numbers. Look up conditional probability.
So in any random exposed population, how many vaccinated individuals would you expect to develop the infection?
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Old 07-31-2015, 06:23 PM
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So in any random exposed population, how many vaccinated individuals would you expect to develop the infection?
Obviously, that depends on the percentage of vaccinated people in that population. Let's say 91% are vaccinated, the vaccine has a failure rate of 5% and 90% of unvaccinated people get the disease.

Then
P(sick | vaccinated) = 5%.
P(vaccinated | sick) = P(vaccinated and sick) / P(sick) = 0.91 * 0.05 / (0.91 * 0.05 + 0.09 * 0.9) = (approx.) 0.36 = 36%

If you assume that everyone is vaccinated and the vaccine has a non-zero failure rate, you would get that 100% of those infected were vaccinated.
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Old 07-31-2015, 06:30 PM
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

Health Impact News Editor Comments:

Once again, we must turn to media outlets outside the U.S. to get straight facts concerning vaccines. The U.S. mainstream media only publishes one side of the vaccine debate and tries hard to squash any negative publicity regarding vaccines (see: The Vaccine Debate and Suppression of Free Speech in America).

We have previously reported how even local media sources in the U.S. are now reporting the truth about whooping cough outbreaks, since so many pertussis outbreaks are happening across the nation among fully vaccinated children, clearly showing that the vaccine is no longer effective (see: Whooping Cough Outbreaks Among Vaccinated Older Children Increasing). In spite of this well-documented fact that the whooping cough vaccine is a failure, it remains in the vaccine schedule and unvaccinated children are wrongly blamed for the outbreaks.

In addition to whooping cough, measles is also making a comeback with new outbreaks, and again, the U.S. mainstream media is blaming unvaccinated children. But the failures of the measles vaccine are also well documented. Lawrence Solomon, the research director of the Consumer Policy Institute in Canada, recently wrote a series of articles exposing the faults of the measles vaccine that were published in the Financial Post. This is the other side of the measles story. One that is well-documented, but censored in the U.S. media.

The untold story of measles

Continued at: The Measles Vaccine Failure the U.S. Media is not Covering
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Old 07-31-2015, 07:06 PM
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A parent can't opt out or the infant will be taken away? This has gone too far!

Rochester General Hospital in NY Newborn Policy Includes Medical Kidnapping

Rochester General Hospital in NY Newborn Policy Includes Medical Kidnapping - YouTube
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Default Re: Parents, do your due diligence on vaccination! There are serious risks!!

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So in any random exposed population, how many vaccinated individuals would you expect to develop the infection?
Obviously, that depends on the percentage of vaccinated people in that population. Let's say 91% are vaccinated, the vaccine has a failure rate of 5% and 90% of unvaccinated people get the disease.

Then
P(sick | vaccinated) = 5%.
P(vaccinated | sick) = P(vaccinated and sick) / P(sick) = 0.91 * 0.05 / (0.91 * 0.05 + 0.09 * 0.9) = (approx.) 0.36 = 36%

If you assume that everyone is vaccinated and the vaccine has a non-zero failure rate, you would get that 100% of those infected were vaccinated.
That assumes that you are confident of all those numbers you apply.
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