Spooky Action at a Distance and the Transfer of Information

[beyelzu]

Okay, you have two entangled electrons, as in the epr paradox now according to bell spooky action at a distance happens but it is impossible to actually send information using the entanglement. However what if you use time to do so??? As in you have very accurate clocks and you number the minutes even and odd. You set a collapse of the superposition during even minutes to be zero, odd minutes to be one.


In effect couldn't you send a one or zero faster than light?

[But]

But there is no way for either of the two observers to find out when the collapse actually took place and who caused it. There is no way the intended receiver could distinguish between the ones and zeros, the result he (his name is Bob!) gets cannot provide any clue about what Alice did with her electron before some other information, restricted to the speed of light (let's say a time-stamped photo of Alice shining her specially modified flashlight on her electron, along with a signed statement), reaches him.

[Ensign Steve]

It's all Eve's fault, isn't it?

[But]

Who the fuck is Alice Eve?

[GodPossessed]

Originally Posted by Ensign Steve

It's all Eve's fault, isn't it?

She's an apple-eatin', snake-fraternizing, hip swingin', problem cau....

Excuse me a sec...


Man, did you see the legs on her?!

<geesh>

[But]

In a parallel universe, Eve ate the snake and they all lived happily ever after.

[Dingfod]

Originally Posted by But

In a parallel universe, Eve ate the snake and they all lived happily ever after.

Instantly.

[Doctor X]

. . . whereas in the Lamu Creation Myth, Allah is willing to forgive Adam and Eve, but Eve will not ask for forgiveness. Being a gentleman, Adam chooses to accompany her out of paradise.









Bitch.

--J.D.

[Doctor X]

. . . and to my understanding, no information is actually exchanged.

--J.D.

[beyelzu]

Originally Posted by But

But there is no way for either of the two observers to find out when the collapse actually took place and who caused it. There is no way the intended receiver could distinguish between the ones and zeros, the result he (his name is Bob!) gets cannot provide any clue about what Alice did with her electron before some other information, restricted to the speed of light (let's say a time-stamped photo of Alice shining her specially modified flashlight on her electron, along with a signed statement), reaches him.

but they could based on when the collapse happened right?


I mean in theory they have to know that the collapsed happened and in theory couldn't they find out when it happened??

[But]

The pair of electrons starts out in an entangled state when they are released; they are in a superposition of states with the additional property that if you measure one electron's spin with regard to a certain axis, the other one's spin will be the opposite. Now if one of the two observers from the example measures his electron, the result will be completely random, but when the two of them come together and compare their observations, the results will always be consistent. The observer cannot tell the difference between the case where a) he himself just caused the collapse of the electron's state by observing it and b) the other person collapsed the state, after which he will measure the corresponding result that is consistent with the other's findings.

Another thing that might complicate finding out when the collapse happened is that physicists don't even know when this collapse actually happens, or if it even happens at all.

I'm not sure if I'm doing a good job of explaining this. I'm pretty sure one of the resident fyshicists will be better at it.

[beyelzu]

I didn't consider that they wouldn't know without measurement. That was my problem.

Thanks but, I thought that I must be missing something but I couldn't figure out what.

[beyelzu]

Now I really feel like trying to understand the actual math.

[naturalist.atheist]

You can do more than understand the math. You can perform the experiment yourself.

A Do-It-Yourself Quantum Eraser: Scientific American

[But]

Originally Posted by beyelzu

Now I really feel like trying to understand the actual math.

YouTube - Lecture 1 | Quantum Entanglements, Part...

This is part of the Stanford Continuing Studies courses. I don't know yet how much actual math is involved, but it seems like a good start, especially if you're interested in quantum entanglement. I like Susskind's down-to-earth style when he explains the plumbing of the universe (he's an expert on black holes, string theory and also a trained plumber)