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  #51  
Old 06-12-2009, 01:35 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

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Government is now, always will be, and always has been a tool of the elite.

The sad thing is when the average honest caring person believes the lie that government is the solution to societal inequities.
Yeah, really.

Because it is so obvious that in countries with more state intervention in the economy, like the Scandinavian ones, they have this huge differences between rich and poor, whereas in the US for instance there is barely a difference.
Now, if you are going down that road...

If there was no America, Scandinavia would be under either Nazi or Communist control.

Not having to fund one's defense does make it easier, no?
And if there was no France the US would have remained a colony.

And if the moon was made of cheese the mold would extend to beyond Jupiter.

Norway and Sweden are actually pretty big spenders on 'defense' per citizen. They have very small populations, so it doesn't show up on the radar.

But you never let any facts get in the way, did you?

And what you call defense of the US, I call an empire.

Ohh, I call it an empire also, and I am against empire. In fact it is the poorest run empire in the history of the world, instead of pillaging, for the most part America has given.
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  #52  
Old 06-12-2009, 01:40 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

Bullcrap.

It is in fact pretty close to an example from antiquity: the Delian League.

Ask the Chileans, the Iranians, the Guatemalans, the Salvadorians etc. about the giving nature of the US. The US has only the interests of its corporations in mind. Not that there is anything new or different about an empire that only has its own interests at heart. What's new is the number of people willing to believe that it is all done for noble purposes.
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  #53  
Old 06-12-2009, 02:10 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

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Bullcrap.

It is in fact pretty close to an example from antiquity: the Delian League.

Ask the Chileans, the Iranians, the Guatemalans, the Salvadorians etc. about the giving nature of the US. The US has only the interests of its corporations in mind. Not that there is anything new or different about an empire that only has its own interests at heart. What's new is the number of people willing to believe that it is all done for noble purposes.
It is done for hegemony, some believe that a noble purpose, I do not.

In some places the the carrot is used, in others the stick is used.
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  #54  
Old 06-13-2009, 06:13 AM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

It seems you both generally agree on the sentiment that the US is an empire while disagreeing on the semantics being used. For some reason, this amuses me a little.
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  #55  
Old 06-13-2009, 01:21 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

I wouldn't think him saying the US has mainly been 'giving' and me saying the US rules the world so its corporations can loot it, is semantics...
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  #56  
Old 06-13-2009, 03:17 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

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I wouldn't think him saying the US has mainly been 'giving' and me saying the US rules the world so its corporations can loot it, is semantics...
I don't believe and didn't mean to convey that the "US has mainly been giving". Think of it like a bribe if you like. To ignore the fact that the American Empire does use it's resources in many areas to the benefit of those places is to construct a false reality.
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  #57  
Old 06-13-2009, 03:35 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

Alright then.

I think the Marshall Plan had more to do with restoring an important market for US goods than with bribing the Europeans, but maybe it was a bit of both.

For the record: I don't have any illusions about the benevolence of the former Dutch 'Empire' (which consisted mostly of what is now Indonesia) either.
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  #58  
Old 06-13-2009, 11:33 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

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Ohh, I call it an empire also, and I am against empire. In fact it is the poorest run empire in the history of the world, instead of pillaging, for the most part America has given.
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I don't believe and didn't mean to convey that the "US has mainly been giving". Think of it like a bribe if you like. To ignore the fact that the American Empire does use it's resources in many areas to the benefit of those places is to construct a false reality.

Sounds like you're saying it has been a lot of giving.
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  #59  
Old 06-14-2009, 12:41 AM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

Alternately, he could be claiming that we often improve local conditions when we exploit an area for our own benefit. That's arguably true, depending on your definition of "improve".
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  #60  
Old 06-14-2009, 01:27 AM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

I would argue that point. I mean, how localised is the improvement? Does it reach your general person on the street? If not, then it is yet another layer of oppression.
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  #61  
Old 06-14-2009, 03:48 AM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

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Ohh, I call it an empire also, and I am against empire. In fact it is the poorest run empire in the history of the world, instead of pillaging, for the most part America has given.
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Originally Posted by JEROME DA GNOME View Post
I don't believe and didn't mean to convey that the "US has mainly been giving". Think of it like a bribe if you like. To ignore the fact that the American Empire does use it's resources in many areas to the benefit of those places is to construct a false reality.

Sounds like you're saying it has been a lot of giving.

Now the argument is the degrees?
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  #62  
Old 06-14-2009, 04:12 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

"for the most part" and "mainly" would indicate degrees. Pay attention to what you write.
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  #63  
Old 06-14-2009, 11:51 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

The big question is whether or not the U.S. Empire has given MUCH.
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  #64  
Old 06-15-2009, 12:54 AM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

:rolleyes:
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  #65  
Old 06-15-2009, 03:21 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

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The big question is whether or not the U.S. Empire has given MUCH.
Where "MUCH" is defined as a value between 9 and 10%?
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  #66  
Old 06-15-2009, 03:24 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

But... It's such a SIGNIFICANT 9=10%!
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  #67  
Old 06-15-2009, 03:34 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

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I would argue that point. I mean, how localised is the improvement? Does it reach your general person on the street? If not, then it is yet another layer of oppression.
That's why I said "arguably", and pointed out that it depends on how you define "improve". I actually agree with you, but I don't think it's self-evident that we're right.
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  #68  
Old 06-17-2009, 02:13 AM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

In other news, Republicans continue to be classy, classy bunch.
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  #69  
Old 06-17-2009, 02:33 AM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

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If one wants to be offended and see racism, yep.
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  #70  
Old 06-17-2009, 11:35 AM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

If one is a contortionist who wants to reason away institutionalised racism, one might manage not to see it because one's head is up one's ass.
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  #71  
Old 06-17-2009, 02:16 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

The problem here is that some people's bigotry is so deeply ingrained that they don't recognize it for what it is.
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  #72  
Old 06-17-2009, 03:05 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

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The problem here is that some people's bigotry is so deeply ingrained that they don't recognize it for what it is.
Like Supreme Count nominee Judge Sotomayor?

“I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experiences would more often than not reach a better conclusion [as a judge] than a white male who hasn’t lived that life.”

Yes, racism is ingrained into the progressive community, you are correct.
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  #73  
Old 06-17-2009, 03:20 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

Would you like to spell out that argument? The picture showing Obama as a pair of eyes isn't racist because so is something Sotomayor said, once? That's what you're running up the flagpole, at this point?
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  #74  
Old 06-17-2009, 03:55 PM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

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The problem here is that some people's bigotry is so deeply ingrained that they don't recognize it for what it is.
Like Supreme Count nominee Judge Sotomayor?

“I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experiences would more often than not reach a better conclusion [as a judge] than a white male who hasn’t lived that life.”

Yes, racism is ingrained into the progressive community, you are correct.
Let me rephrase my comment. I am saying you are being willfully ignorant by denying the racist sentiment in that image. That the twit who posted it is feeling bad more about who it was sent to then the sentiment expressed shows that her bigotry is so ingrained that she doesn't see it for what it is.

Not all bigotry is blatant. There is a term I have heard of. It is "death of a thousand cuts". That image was but one small cut amongst undoubtedly many. She is a bigot of the worst sort since it isn't obvious and most people would find excuses for her comments or the image she sent than to call it out for the racist sentiment it expresses.
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  #75  
Old 06-18-2009, 02:08 AM
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Default Re: More blithe racism

Rihanna is racist.

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