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  #26  
Old 12-03-2012, 04:51 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

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I don't mean to derail, either, but you asked for armchair shrinks. :blank:

Also, like hell I would post any of my weird dreams on the internet for analysis, good god.

But please keep them coming. :popcorn:
Beginning to regret it now. Good god, indeed.
It's okay. I still love you.
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  #27  
Old 12-03-2012, 05:01 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

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I don't know. I guess it matters if you are a dick about it or not. I mean, it's along the same lines as calling a minority some demeaning slur; or being intolerant of someone else's beliefs or lifestyle. Essentially to not call someone by what they believe to be their true gender, you are discounting them as an independent person with thoughts and ideas of their own. Just give it a little more thought beyond what you yourself think. It honestly comes off as bigotry.
Well, I'm not being a dick about it. I'm just being a dick to those who think I'm being a dick about it after they assumed--understandably, this being the internet, which is full of dicks--that I'm being a dick about it.

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That's the point. It gives meaning to a person's life. Why wouldn't you want to support that?
Because I'm just no good.

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  #28  
Old 12-03-2012, 05:08 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

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That's "There are women, they are XX. There are men, they are XY. You're either one or the other, and I refuse to adjust my usage on the basis of other factors."
This is a strawman, so I won't waste my time.
How was I to predict that the people in the gray area are to you neither male nor female and that you would choose not use personal pronouns to refer to them at all?

Because it was pretty accurate aside from that.
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Why is only the genome relevant?
Why is anything more than the genome relevant? It's sex.
Because there's more to sex than genetics. For thousands of years, in fact, humans made reference to sex with no knowledge of genetics. Sex refers to biological differences between male and female. Those differences are not limited only to the chromosomes and so the distinction between the sexes has never really been considered to be just the chromosomes.

So when did "sex" become synonymous with "XX or XY"? Why do you consider that the only true definition even though it has never been the only factor considered by society or science?
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Would you, upon discovery of their chromosomal makeup, refuse to call them men or use "he" to refer to them?
I'd use their proper name. I don't need to denote a person's sex to another very often--really a non-issue here. Is "intersex" an insulting category to you? Maybe you're the one with a binary category problem.
Intersex is not an insulting category. The thing is that the English language has only two genders in its 3rd-person pronouns (that are appropriate for use with people) and that our (mainstream) society has only two genders. And so those intersex people will generally identify as one of those two genders and they will generally prefer to be referred to with one of those pronouns.

I would respect that. You would not.

Refusing to use personal pronouns for someone (matching the gender they identify as) rather than sully "he" with someone who's not "really" a man is what most people would consider insulting.
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Or you could just grow up and realize that you putting your pedantry (which isn't objectively right anyway) before other people's feelings just makes you a dick and nobody cares about how you preserved some meaningless "principle" of pronoun usage.
Alright, then: what would you call someone who was born male, thinks of themself as female, now looks like a female, "acts male", and performs in a classical male gender role?

:twisted:
Oh no, how twisted :rolleyes:

Assuming "thinks of themself as female" means "they identify as female"... I would call her "she." This is not a riddle or some impossible situation. Call her by the pronoun she prefers. It's really not that hard, dude.

All it requires is for you to consider other people's feelings to be more important than what you consider to be the purity of English pronoun usage or whatever.
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  #29  
Old 12-03-2012, 05:10 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

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I don't know. I guess it matters if you are a dick about it or not. I mean, it's along the same lines as calling a minority some demeaning slur; or being intolerant of someone else's beliefs or lifestyle. Essentially to not call someone by what they believe to be their true gender, you are discounting them as an independent person with thoughts and ideas of their own. Just give it a little more thought beyond what you yourself think. It honestly comes off as bigotry.
Well, I'm not being a dick about it. I'm just being a dick to those who think I'm being a dick about it after they assumed--understandably, this being the internet, which is full of dicks--that I'm being a dick about it.

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That's the point. It gives meaning to a person's life. Why wouldn't you want to support that?
Because I'm just no good.

Dammit, we don't have a Daria smiley?
We have a Cartman, though. :cartman:
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  #30  
Old 12-03-2012, 05:36 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

why do penises gross you out? i don't really watch porn all that much, but if i see it on late at night when i'm channel surfing, i'll leave it on if it's at a good scene. i'm not gay and i love women, but the penises don't gross me out. that's my penis on that well-hung man, banging the shit out of that beautiful women...and i like my penis.

not every penis wants you.
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  #31  
Old 12-03-2012, 05:36 AM
Kashmir Kashmir is offline
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

Well, I've learned a vauable lesson today: don't start an innocent thread trying to figure out the cause of persistent bad dreams.

What a fucking train wreck . . .
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  #32  
Old 12-03-2012, 05:39 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

why is it a train wreck?

people are playing in your thread. have some gratitude!
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  #33  
Old 12-03-2012, 05:52 AM
Kashmir Kashmir is offline
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

Well, because I don't want people thinking I'm a bigot, and it looks like some do.

Two pages of questioning my character blown out of a bit of word pedantry on my part. Good. Fucking. God.

I'll know in the future to never type anything, anything at all that someone could possibly disagree with. Because if they do, you're no better than a racist in their eyes.
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  #34  
Old 12-03-2012, 05:55 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

well...i don't think you're a bigot. these people get all excitable. they love feeling like victims because it gives them a right to be bullies.
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  #35  
Old 12-03-2012, 06:01 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

I don't think the problem was posting about dreams.
It seems to be about making assumptions about other types of people; people other members have more experience with.
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  #36  
Old 12-03-2012, 06:07 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

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For some reason Kashmir strikes me as the sort who would take time out of his day to go through the gynecology ward at his local hospital to let all the hysterectomy patients know they're not real "women" anymore, since they don't have functional uteruses (uteri?), and come away feeling like he's performed a valuable service for humanity.

where does this come from?

he gave his opinion which is what he thinks on the subject. he said he'd call anybody what they want to be called and his opinion doesn't really seem harmful to anybody.

do you really think Kashmir would do this or did you just conjure up some victims to bully him with?
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  #37  
Old 12-03-2012, 06:23 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

I don't think Kashmir is particularly or deliberately bigoted, he just seems to have an overbearing sense of his own rightness about what does and does not qualify as one gender or another, or one sex or another (much the same as he does about other topics in other threads, that's just what came up in this one). I think what I was trying to say is not that he's an asshole who would go around making other people miserable or angry just for kicks, but that he would do something that would make people miserable or angry while believing firmly he's only being right and if everyone would just be logical and objective like he is there wouldn't be a problem.
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  #38  
Old 12-03-2012, 06:26 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

but isn't that exactly what is being done to him?

it is.

but i'll move on...the world is round, ya know?
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  #39  
Old 12-03-2012, 07:39 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

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but isn't that exactly what is being done to him?

it is.
Minority groups discussed so far in this thread:

1) Transgender people
2) Kashmir

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well...i don't think you're a bigot. these people get all excitable. they love feeling like victims because it gives them a right to be bullies.
You and your apologism and your well hung penis. :pat:
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  #40  
Old 12-03-2012, 07:42 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

My earliest dream is the only one not terrifying enough to block out of my memory; it is also my favorite one.

It starred me as a four year old, saving my family from a black bear who put them inside a cage. The end.
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  #41  
Old 12-03-2012, 08:37 AM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

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You and your apologism and your well hung penis. :pat:
i literally laughed out loud. great line! :D
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  #42  
Old 12-03-2012, 01:37 PM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

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My earliest dream is the only one not terrifying enough to block out of my memory; it is also my favorite one.

It starred me as a four year old, saving my family from a black bear who put them inside a cage. The end.
The earliest dream I can still remember is from when I was about 8 I think. I found a skeleton lounging under some trees, and for some reason I knew it was my dad. We chatted for a while. I remember it as weird and a bit unsettling (my dad was alive and well and still is) but not scary.
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  #43  
Old 12-03-2012, 02:07 PM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

I dreamt last night that I'd bought a book from a store. When I got home the dust jacket thing on the book didn't seem to fit right and while I was trying to adjust it I found what was wrong was that it had some sticky plastic trailing from it that was connected to some large weird sort of floating contraption.

On investigation, the floating thing turned out to be a sort of light fitting from the bookshop - they'd obviously filled it and a supporting balloon with helium to keep it up near the ceiling rather than the more usual method of simply fastening it to the ceiling. :shrug: Anyway, it wasn't floating properly as some of the helium had leaked out and that was why it had come down and become accidentally attached to my book.

I was able to remove some of the unnecessary light bulbs and other junk from the fitting and that restored its buoyancy so that it floated properly again.

Next, the fitting was being used as part of a fairground ride (I don't know how that happened as I wasn't involved). The fitting was floating in the sky supporting a whole bunch of trapeze-like things, and people were swinging back and forth on the trapezes at high speed, narrowly missing each other. I was watching in a sort of disapproving way, thinking how dangerous it looked and wondering how whomever was running the ride managed to get it approved by the health and safety people.

Anyway, I don't consider that dream to be bad or ugly - just the usual sort of vaguely amusing nonsense that my dreams mostly consist of.
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  #44  
Old 12-03-2012, 04:31 PM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

I want more pretty dreams like that. So many of mine have make me think there is something seriously wrong with me. :\

My last one was strange... it was me and a few friends observing our young selves reacting to 9/11 in elementary school. Our adult selves watching our childhood selves sitting in a circle and crying. Which isn't how it happened at all. It was a stupid dream. You could get all Freudian on that, too.

I've had a few lucid dreams and waking dreams, however, which have been beautiful; and in which I could visualize color. Strangely, that earliest dream I can recall was in black in white and recurred up until I was about the age of ten.
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  #45  
Old 12-03-2012, 05:14 PM
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Default Re: The Bad and Ugly: Dreams

I have one where I am fleeing through a massive version of my childhood home. It has way more rooms and all the rooms are bigger too.

I am being chased by something I can never quite see, but I know it is quite large, vaguely human-shaped, and that it is terrifying. It is quite close behind me and it is trying to grab me, but I manage to scramble just out of it's reach by darting around corners, diving under tables and slamming doors shut.

Finally, I find my parents bedroom... and it has a lock. I lock it behind me, fumbling with the lock for a terrifyingly long moment, and step backwards. It seems that I have escaped. Then I look in the mirror next to the door, and I see that somehow the stairs to the attic are now in my parents room, right behind me... and the creature is already halfway down the stairs. I have locked myself in with it.
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