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Old 11-18-2011, 09:41 PM
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Default Re: A Revolution in Thought: Part Two

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vivisectus View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by peacegirl View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vivisectus View Post
Obviously, Spacemonkey was not referring to determinism at all, but at your inability to accept even the possibility of your father being wrong.
I am unable to accept the possibility that Lessans was wrong, BECAUSE HE WASN'T WRONG.
You can feel someone is right and still accept the possibility that this is not the case. In fact that is what rational people do: they allow for the possibility of being dead wrong.

You however, dogmatically believe that whatever Lessans says is an absolute, cast in rock objective truth.

Such absolutes are only to be found in religions.
Don't you see why he had to include this excerpt in the introduction?

Decline and Fall of All Evil: Introduction: pp. 5-7

To overcome this stubborn resistance and bring about this new
world, it is imperative that the knowledge in this book be adequately
understood which requires that the reader does not apply himself and
his ideas as a standard of what is true and false, but that he
understand the difference between a mathematical relation and an
opinion, belief, or theory. The mind of man is so utterly confused
with words that it will require painstaking clarification to clear away
the logical cobwebs of ignorance that have accumulated through the
years. For purposes of clarification please note that the words
scientific and mathematical only mean undeniable, and are
interchanged throughout the text.

The reasoning in this work is not
a form of logic, nor is it my opinion of the answer; it is mathematical,
scientific, and undeniable, and it is not necessary to deal in what has
been termed the ‘exact sciences’ in order to be exact and scientific.
Consequently, it is imperative to know that this demonstration will be
like a game of chess in which every one of your moves will be forced
and checkmate inevitable but only if you don’t make up your own
rules as to what is true and false which will only delay the very life you
want for yourself.

The laws of this universe, which include those of
our nature, are the rules of the game and the only thing required to
win, to bring about this Golden Age that will benefit everyone... is to
stick to the rules. But if you decide to move the king like the queen
because it does not satisfy you to see a pet belief slipping away or
because it irritates your pride to be proven wrong or checkmated, then
it is obvious that you are not sincerely concerned with learning the
truth but only with retaining your doctrines at all cost. However,
when it is scientifically revealed that the very things religion,
government, education and all others want, which include the means
as well as the end, are prevented from becoming a reality only because
we have not penetrated deeply enough into a thorough understanding
of our ultimate nature, are we given a choice as to the direction we are
compelled to travel even though this means the relinquishing of ideas
that have been part of our thinking since time immemorial?

This
discovery will be presented in a step by step fashion that brooks no
opposition and your awareness of this matter will preclude the
possibility of someone adducing his rank, title, affiliation, or the long
tenure of an accepted belief as a standard from which he thinks he
qualifies to disagree with knowledge that contains within itself
undeniable proof of its veracity. In other words, your background, the
color of your skin, your religion, the number of years you went to
school, how many titles you hold, your I.Q., your country, what you
do for a living, your being some kind of expert like Nageli (or
anything else you care to throw in) has no relation whatsoever to the
undeniable knowledge that 3 is to 6 what 4 is to 8.
So please don’t
be too hasty in using what you have been taught as a standard to judge
what has not even been revealed to you yet. If you should decide to
give me the benefit of the doubt — deny it — and two other
discoveries to be revealed, if you can.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Vivisectus
He has patiently and painstakingly explained to you why he disagrees with your case for determinism, showing that it relies on a tautology, something that you have thus far not been able to refute.
Quote:
I have been unable to refute this because IT'S NOT TRUE. I can't argue with a lie. :sadcheer:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vivisectus
Au Contraire: lies and things that are not true are quite easy to refute. Your problem is that you have been carefully shown where the problem lies, and that you have no rational response to that. So now you are resorting to shouting and accusing people of being malicious, as is your wont.
You say my problem is that I have no rational response to people pointing out where there is a problem. That's not true. I have responded to everybody and continue to respond. Just because I don't agree with the points being made doesn't mean I'm avoiding anyone.
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