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Originally Posted by peacegirl
Oh really, show me which free will we have that is not ruled out
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I did, below. Here it is again:
free will: the ability to contemplate and choose between multiple possible alternatives
And you agree that this form of free will is not ruled out.
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Originally Posted by LadyShea
If free will is defined as the ability to contemplate and choose between multiple possible alternatives, it is not ruled out.
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Originally Posted by peacegirl
That's true, if you're going by the old definition.
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Old definition new definitions blah blah blah. There are versions/forms of free will that are not ruled out by Lessans ideas, right? The one I presented is not ruled out
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Originally Posted by peacegilr
rules out the ability to choose another alternative than the one which was chosen.
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Originally Posted by LadyShea
We can't choose what we did not choose because we can't go back in time. Yes, this is a trivial truth.
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Yes. It is trivially true, because there is no case where "we cannot go back in time" is not true, therefore it doesn't matter what implication you are tying to it...
"we cannot go back in time" is always true in all circumstances. Anything you try to imply by that will therefore also be true.
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Originally Posted by peacegirl
Then show me how we can prove free will by not going back in time, which is impossible.
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I am not trying to prove free will at all. I am simply demonstrating that Lessans did not rule out all possible understandings of the term
I understand free will to mean the ability to contemplate and choose from multiple alternatives. Is this ruled out by Lessans?
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Originally Posted by LadyShea
So choosing other than what was chosen is not ruled out completely, we simply have to choose one option at a time is all.
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And that option, once it is chosen, could not have been otherwise. So there is no free will LadyShea.
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If there was more than one alternative available, it
could have been otherwise. It is not otherwise, but it could have been.
This is the difference between necessary and actual truths you have been unable to grasp.
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Originally Posted by LadyShea
And, speaking from a theoretical viewpoint, it's possible that we make all possible choices at every moment in time, just in different universes.
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Originally Posted by peacegirl
Ha ha, and you are supporting science, not science fiction?
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This is an idea found in theoretical science...specifically quantum theory