Roe v Wade: Pretty cool while it lasted

[Miss Shelby]

Originally Posted by beyelzu

I don’t expect you to change your mind, if you cared about facts you wouldn’t have the belief system you have.

I care about facts and have oft considered posting these in various discussions but then you would question my sources and I don’t have energy for that.

[erimir]

Using bad sources simply because they agree with your pre-existing positions, of course, would be an indicator of not caring about facts.

Maybe you really do have good sources but you can't post them because bey will be so unfair and question them based off bullshit. That's not my experience of what bey does, but I suppose it's a possibility.

But more likely in my estimation is that that bey would question your sources for good reason. Based off my experience with you when you have tried to explain your reasoning.

[beyelzu]

Originally Posted by Miss Shelby

I care about facts and have oft considered posting these in various discussions but then you would question my sources and I don’t have energy for that.

I’m talking about how you responded to facts in this particular instance. You changed your position not at all even as you were corrected about the basic facts.

You can claim to care about facts, you demonstrate otherwise.

Just about everybody agrees that I can be an asshole, but I care about facts.

I value sources and data and proof.

[beyelzu]

Originally Posted by beyelzu

I don’t have a problem with shifting your perspective or changing your mind based on new evidence, that’s laudable but that’s not what you are doing.

Your initial position was, it’s not an issue because it will never happen.

Then you shifted all the way to wow I can’t believe that happened.

And finally, you ended up at

It’s not a big deal because it happens a lot.

I guess you could get points for not denying obvious facts, but you didn’t change your position.

I also don’t think it should be laudable to not deny obvious facts.

Fuck, it just occurred to me that I could have gone with

I don’t think you should be feted for accepting obvious facts.

I missed a chance to use feted.

[Miss Shelby]

Did we learn a new ten dollar word, bey?

If it makes you feel better, I’m getting dinner from a place called fetas. Maybe the present tense or the plural.

I don’t mind that you can be an asshole, far from it. But, if I were to post an article written by let’s say Ann Coulter where she gives sources that I cannot deny are factual would you give that any consideration. How bout Pat Buchanan or Matt Walsh?

[beyelzu]

I like words and language.

It’s not new to me, but it came up around the house recently, so it’s fresh in my mind.

It’s also a fun word.

[Miss Shelby]

Did you see my post after editing?

I like fun words too. That’s why I put free rice.com in the game section.

[Miss Shelby]

Freerice.com

[Miss Shelby]

Originally Posted by erimir

Using bad sources simply because they agree with your pre-existing positions, of course, would be an indicator of not caring about facts.

Maybe you really do have good sources but you can't post them because bey will be so unfair and question them based off bullshit. That's not my experience of what bey does, but I suppose it's a possibility.

But more likely in my estimation is that that bey would question your sources for good reason. Based off my experience with you when you have tried to explain your reasoning.

No erm, not bey. I mean everyone here. Everyone here agrees with everyone and therefore I believe everyone here would not want to consider what I put out there.

[beyelzu]

You show me a source and I will evaluate its claims without regard to the author, but standards of evidence are what they are.

In my experience, conservative writing tends toward the polemical and short on facts, but I promise not to let my previous familiarity overly bias me.

[Miss Shelby]

Fair. It may not be on this topic but okay

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

Here's a guy who seems able to change his position:

In exclusive interviews, the ex-wife of Michigan Supreme Court Justice Brian Zahra says that he impregnated her and took her to an abortion clinic in 1983.

In September, he voted to block an abortion-rights measure from going on the ballot. https://t.co/L1MvT0KRcU

— Jonathan Allen (@jonallendc) November 3, 2022

[beyelzu]

I am as pro choice as a matter of public policy as the average GOP candidate is in their personal life.

Or at least, I strive to be, it’s a high bar.

[JoeP]

Originally Posted by Miss Shelby

Everyone here agrees with everyone

Yes. Because we are all correct.

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

OBGYNs in Louisiana are refusing to see patients before 12 weeks of pregnancy because miscarriages are very common during that period and doctors afraid of being investigated and prosecuted for abortion if a patient miscarries. https://t.co/J0bqa9kjC1 pic.twitter.com/tlFR1zEvyJ

— Mark Joseph Stern (@mjs_DC) December 30, 2022

[Kamilah Hauptmann]

The anti-abortion movement just had a mask-off moment in Alabama | Moira Donegan | The Guardian

[BrotherMan]

Should we be surprised they don't like wearing masks?

[beyelzu]

In the resolution passed Monday, the RNC pushes the party apparatus—candidates, consultants, and committees—to “go on offense in the 2024 election cycle,” with regard to abortion. It further urges Republicans in state legislatures and Congress to pass the “strongest” anti-choice legislation possible, using language previously used to justify so-called “heartbeat” bills that would ban abortions at six weeks, before many even know they are pregnant.

That’s a bold move, Cotton.

[lisarea]

The Samuel Alito’s Mom’s Satanic Abortion Clinic

[beyelzu]

According to this article, the RNC is doubling down on abortion because it appeals to their misogynistic base.

As the study shows, the single best predictor of whether someone opposes abortion rights is if they subscribe to negative stereotypes about women and/or are committed to "traditional" gender roles. It's not just that anti-choice respondents were far more likely than pro-choice respondents to believe that "women are too easily offended" or "white men are the most attacked group in the country right now." Abortion opponents were also more likely to deny that it's rape if a man forces himself on his wife. A majority of anti-abortion respondents also believed men understand the biology of abortion better than women do. Over two-thirds of people who support abortion bans agreed "it bothers me when a guy acts like a girl," while only 28% of pro-choice people disliked men they perceive as effeminate.

And

"It's absurd," Undem said, "to believe that one woman, let alone 'many,' will decide to have an elective abortion, at say 39 weeks carrying around an 8-pound baby, out of irresponsibility." And yet their polling data shows that nearly 8 out of 10 people who oppose abortion rights believe a sexist myth that defies not just medical science, but common sense.

Concluding with

These sexist views are "why Republicans can succeed using the rhetoric they do," Undem told Salon. Republicans know that there's no substantive voting constituency for their economic policies. Tapping into this anger over women's economic and social gains allows the party to reach voters who would not be motivated by spending cuts to Social Security or tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans. So while most Americans may reject the misogyny that underpins abortion bans, the anti-choice message is tapping a larger group of voters than Republicans could otherwise access. If they give up sexism now, they risk losing their core voters without necessarily getting new ones to replace them. Misogyny has been central to the Republican brand for too long, it turns out, for them to risk changing course now.

So abortion is a loser issue but better than destroying social security.

The overturn of Roe cost the GOP. So why are Republicans now doubling down on abortion bans? | Salon.com

[beyelzu]

South Carolina legislators are hearing a bill that would make abortion punishable by death.

Abortion is currently legal in South Carolina, as the state’s Supreme Court has vetoed all proposed legislation to restrict abortions within the state. The Court’s 3-2 decision allows abortion to remain legal in the state until 20 weeks of pregnancy.

The new bill, “South Carolina Prenatal Equal Protection Act of 2023,″ was pre-filed on Dec. 15, 2022. Following the Supreme Court’s decision to overturn Roe v. Wade, Republican leaders have been hoping to reinstate a pre-Roe ban on almost all abortions at six weeks of pregnancy.

The bill seeks to amend the state constitution to recognize life as an individual person “from the moment of fertilization” and to define “person” to include an unborn child at any stage of development.

In altering the definition of “person” in the Palmetto State, the bill says that an unborn child who is “assaulted,” or “a victim of homicide,” would receive “equal protection under the assault laws of the state.”

Proposed SC bill could make abortion a death penalty eligible offense

[Stephen Maturin]

I lubs be some old fashioned, down home, country style wingnut unintended consequences. Back in 2012, Wyoming wingnuts drafted and Wyoming wingnut voters approved a state constitutional amendment aimed at the evils of Obamacare. The amendment, now section 38 of the Wyoming Constitution's Declaration of Rights, begins with "Each competent adult shall have the right to make his or her own health care decisions."

Given the location of this here poast, you can imagine where this is heading. The Wyoming legislature passed an abortion ban, and a Wyoming state court judge issued a preliminary injunction preventing enforcement of the ban, finding that the court could reasonably conclude "that [section 38 of] the Wyoming Constitution affords all Wyoming citizens with a fundamental right to make their own health care decisions and that includes a Wyoming woman’s right to make her own decision regarding abortion." A trial judge in Ohio issued a preliminary injunction against that state's abortion ban under substantially identical circumstances.

Oopsies.

Hoist, petard, etc.

[Ari]

In one of the many reminders that it’s about control, Idaho has just passed a law that makes it illegal to help a minor get an abortion in another state without their owners, I mean parents, permission. If the owner of the pregnant teen supports the abortion, then it’s ok, but don’t you dare go around the owners back and damage their property!

Idaho governor signs “abortion trafficking” bill into law

[LarsMac]

So, now we have this coming up:
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/supr...ry?id=98406201

I think we need to be prepared to review pretty much every decision that has come from the Thomas court, if this pans out.

That could get weird.

[Sock Puppet]

Trying to be optimistic that this will actually go somewhere. I doubt that all of his shit decisions will even be reviewed, let alone overturned, but there miiiiiiiight be a chance to get him to take early retirement.