LotR Mafia - Game Thread

[wei yau]

vote: liv

Any Hobbit who wants the job is welcome to have it. Sounds far too much like work for my liking.

[beyelzu]

Originally Posted by BrotherMan

Curious oversight, Mr. Hobbnonymous. Would good sir care to elaborate, perhaps to throw another Nightson onto the pile?

I just missed the nightson campaigning, but yeah, I am suspicious of everyone who wants to be mayor.

[livius drusus]

Originally Posted by beyelzu

I don't know that it is that obvious that we all lose if "the bearer goes down"

That could make for one very short game.

Indeed, but Adam clarified that that's not what's going to happen. The "you win when all threats are eliminated and a hobbit possesses the ring" bit had me thinking we'd lose when the bad guys possess it.

Also, if you do think that is the case, wouldn't that be the most important part of the role?

Maybe in a macro sense, but it's not a controllable element. The leader gets what's in lynchee's pockets; it's an automatic thing. The lynch tie-break is where instincts and play skills count.

Adam, another question just sos I'm not making an ass of u and me: The leader only gets lynchee belongings, right? Not the pocket contents of nightkills?

[beyelzu]

Originally Posted by Megatron

Whether you mean to or not, you're setting up some serious WIFOM here. I don't see anything particularly suspicious about wanting or not wanting the leader role, to be honest.

I am, however, looking at reasoning...

Its a position of power with real tangible benefits in this game, because of the search the pockets aspect. That is what makes me suspicious. Normally I am not suspicoius of people wanting to be mayor because it's just a tie break and not that powerful. especially in a game that has really long days.

Further, I would also think that someone is gollem and is looking for precious, he might be indy/thief but he might also be solo scum.

[slimshady2357]

Originally Posted by wei yau

vote: liv

Any Hobbit who wants the job is welcome to have it. Sounds far too much like work for my liking.

It sounds too dangerous to me, like I said, the mayor must be the natural night kill choice every night if the scum want the ring.

And for that reason, I too am suspicious of the people gunning for mayor.

[livius drusus]

Only if a hobbit is lynched, of course. Why assume we'll slaughter innocents every day?

[beyelzu]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

Indeed, but Adam clarified that that's not what's going to happen. The "you win when all threats are eliminated and a hobbit possesses the ring" bit had me thinking we'd lose when the bad guys possess it.

Maybe in a macro sense, but it's not a controllable element. The leader gets what's in lynchee's pockets; it's an automatic thing. The lynch tie-break is where instincts and play skills count.

I just think that its pretty odd that you want to be mayor for the part of the role that probably isn't even going to come up.

You carry a certain gravitas already, liv, I see no reason to have it added to as I have no reason to trust you. If you are an innocent then sure it is great for the town. But if you are nazgul then I think we fuck ourselves immediately by electing you. Less so with other players.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

Adam, another question just sos I'm not making an ass of u and me: The leader only gets lynchee belongings, right? Not the pocket contents of nightkills?

Correct. People with night kills will search their own victims' pocketses.

[beyelzu]

Originally Posted by slimshady2357

It sounds too dangerous to me, like I said, the mayor must be the natural night kill choice every night if the scum want the ring.

And for that reason, I too am suspicious of the people gunning for mayor.

Indeed, a mayor has whatever is in his pockets at start and whatever was in the lynched person's pockets.

As a random aside, this is why mayor votes rule, it can allow us to jump right into scumhunting.

[beyelzu]

and wifom

[slimshady2357]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

Only if a hobbit is lynched, of course. Why assume we'll slaughter innocents every day?

I did mention that last time I brought this up, forgot to add that caveat this time.

[livius drusus]

Originally Posted by beyelzu

I just think that its pretty odd that you want to be mayor for the part of the role that probably isn't even going to come up.

You carry a certain gravitas already, liv, I see no reason to have it added to as I have no reason to trust you.

On a timed game it's more likely to come up than in an open-ended one. Sadly, my putative gravitas doesn't keep people from suspecting me/ignoring me/not believing me all the damn time which I've found fairly frustrating given how often I'm right.

If you are an innocent then sure it is great for the town. But if you are nazgul then I think we fuck ourselves immediately by electing you. Less so with other players.

Yeah, I didn't buy that when fragment said it and I don't buy it now. If the tie-breaker is barely significant, if the power of the pocket-search is the real menace, then electing someone under the radar or who you think is a bad/neutral/ungravitassy player won't make any difference at all. They get the ring without having to play smart or convince anyone of anything. You want to pick blind because you're inherent suspicious of anyone who wants to be leader, go ahead, but you'll be just as likely, maybe even more likely, to be picking laying-low scum.

[beyelzu]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

On a timed game it's more likely to come up than in an open-ended one. Sadly, my putative gravitas doesn't keep people from suspecting me/ignoring me/not believing me all the damn time which I've found fairly frustrating given how often I'm right.

It is more likely to come up but with long time limits I doubt it will.

Yeah, I didn't buy that when fragment said it and I don't buy it now. If the tie-breaker is barely significant, if the power of the pocket-search is the real menace, then electing someone under the radar or who you think is a bad/neutral/ungravitassy player won't make any difference at all. They get the ring without having to play smart or convince anyone of anything. You want to pick blind because you're inherent suspicious of anyone who wants to be leader, go ahead, but you'll be just as likely, maybe even more likely, to be picking laying-low scum.

Maybe, I am not clear, there are two separate reasons for me to not want you to be mayor. one is gravitas and the second is the pocket searching. I think the scum would want that, I think that dl is probably right about the ring conferring power. To be clear, I want an active player to be mayor and someone who isn't campaigning for the job. I think it would be a mistake to randomly assign the mayor.

I never suggested that we pick blind or that we should pick an inactive, I suggested that we should pick someone who isn't campaigning.

There is a big difference there. Ideally, it should also be someone who is easy to read as well, so for me, es is out.

[beyelzu]

one day I will learn how to preview my posts and judge their clarity.

anyway, the second reason for you, liv, applies to anyone who wants the job.

[BrotherMan]

Originally Posted by Chris Porter

But I don't know what WIFOM is. If it's related to hobbit leaders, that may be a disadvantage.

WIFOM is an acronym taken from a hilarious and pivotal scene in The Princess Bride: The confrontation between the Man in Black and Vizzini.

But it's so simple. All I have to do is divine from what I know of you: are you the sort of man who would put the poison into his own goblet or his enemy's? Now, a clever man would put the poison into his own goblet, because he would know that only a great fool would reach for what he was given. I am not a great fool, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool, you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.

This has been a Public Service Announcement.

Originally Posted by beyelzu

You carry a certain gravitas already, liv, I see no reason to have it added to as I have no reason to trust you. If you are an innocent then sure it is great for the town. But if you are nazgul then I think we fuck ourselves immediately by electing you. Less so with other players.

What this Hobbit said. I too am suspicious of the Hobbitses who are hopping at the chance to lead our impromptu community - and double especially those with the more human-like ego to vote for themselves to start their own campaign! I find it un-hobbity to speak a truth. livius has given good reason to want to vote for her. But still the offers of free pipeweed can be compelling - as is the enviable talent of smoke ring a-blowing.

I can make allowance for Chris Porter meta-gaming a bit and pretending that being new to all this fancy voting and so forth is a shield, and though you may blow a mighty good smoking ring, I cannot at this time vote to elect you mayor.

What is your clan name Hobbit Nightson? Is it Proudfoot? Because you talk like one of them. Your offer of free pipeweed, tempting though it is, is irrelevent. We can open our back doors and scoop it from the field free as we please already. And why cast your suspicion on fragment? Has fragment done you wrong somehow already? My humble Hobbit's eyes are watching you very closely, sir. I should expect a good answer for such early, unfounded, accusations. Consider yourself suspect to me, sir!

[wei yau]

Originally Posted by beyelzu

To be clear, I want an active player to be mayor and someone who isn't campaigning for the job. I think it would be a mistake to randomly assign the mayor.

I never suggested that we pick blind or that we should pick an inactive, I suggested that we should pick someone who isn't campaigning.

There is a big difference there. Ideally, it should also be someone who is easy to read as well, so for me, es is out.

And to my ears, this is exactly the kind of non-campaigning campaigning someone who actually wants the job would do. I'm not convinced that only Nazgul would want to be mayor. Especially if the mayor gets a big ol' target painted on the back.

If Nazgul wanted to be mayor, then they'd have to open themselves as nightkill targets. But, then if they were truly scum, they couldn't be nightkilled.

So, not entirely sure how being mayor benefits the Nazgul.

I do see how the mayor is a ripe target, but that's not the same thing.

[livius drusus]

Originally Posted by BrotherMan

I too am suspicious of the Hobbitses who are hopping at the chance to lead our impromptu community - and double especially those with the more human-like ego to vote for themselves to start their own campaign!

I didn't self-vote to start my own campaign. Megatron voted for me first.

[Gonzo]

Anyone want a peanut?

Originally Posted by fragment

Safer options being people who would be less of a threat in the leader role if they happen to be scum. Some people strike me as likely to be better liars and manipulators than others.

With that reasoning perhaps Demi would make a better leader than Nightson. I think we could catch Dem in a lie if we had to.

Hmm.

unvote

Can anyone promise me something better than pipeweed?

[Gonzo]

I am not fearful that a scum becomes leader so much as that it is someone we can figure out. If a scum if leader, we're going to notice any misbehavior and they'll be screwed.

[livius drusus]

Originally Posted by beyelzu

Maybe, I am not clear, there are two separate reasons for me to not want you to be mayor. one is gravitas and the second is the pocket searching. I think the scum would want that, I think that dl is probably right about the ring conferring power.

There's no probably about it. We know that the ring confers power to the Nazgul because Adam said so this morning.

To be clear, I want an active player to be mayor and someone who isn't campaigning for the job. I think it would be a mistake to randomly assign the mayor.

You're still eliminating people who are out front on day one. I think that's going to increase your odds of picking scum, not decrease it, because they are less likely to be making noise out of the gate. Nazgul get to pick the pockets of their nightkills, remember, so being able to do so with lynchees may not be worth making a huge tada over leader power.

I never suggested that we pick blind or that we should pick an inactive, I suggested that we should pick someone who isn't campaigning.

There is a big difference there. Ideally, it should also be someone who is easy to read as well, so for me, es is out.

Whoever you vote for should be flattered.

[Ensign Steve]

Up to this point, I've been looking at all the mayor voting/campaigning as just that. The added bonus of pocket-searching is a bonus indeed, but I don't find it especially scummy to campaign. I like Crumb because I've seen him in mayoral action, and Gonzo's suggestion of Demi is a good one as well. I like a level-headed mayor who isn't prone to flights of irrational paranoia*, taking things personally (), or general insanity ().

I'm with wei, I don't want the job.




* rational paranoia being perfectly acceptable, of course.

[BrotherMan]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

I didn't self-vote to start my own campaign. Megatron voted for me first.

Apologies to the lady Hobbit. Though you are suspect for voting on yourself this particular barb was not directed directly at you. I appreciate the lively discussion between hobbitsus drusus and hobbelzu and I am inclined to lean in either of their direction.

I daresay though at this point all chances are nigh undistinguishable when voting for campaigner or non-campaigner for me. A servant of He Who Shan't Be Named (not necessarily a Nazgul, who I should think would desire to remain as hidden as possible) would desire the power and respect that comes from a position of leadership. It is, after all, that same naked ambition which lead to their downfall.

But, still, it is the stout heart and undomitable will of the Hobbit-kind which will see us through this dark time. The Fellowship itself was first formed when a brave Hobbit placed himself in the breech between Doom and all of Middle Earth.

All of this political hand slapping has made this humble Hobbit thirsty. Too much action for good Hobbit folk to be up to so early in a day!

[Crumb]

I like Crumb because I've seen him in mayoral action

[Crumb]

I don't believe I have ever been mayor. I appreciate the votes and only voted for myself because someone else already threw my name out there and I thought it would be fun to be mayor. In Mafia power is fun. Even if it gets you killed.

[Kael]

I'm with our good BrotherMan, as stout a fellow as any could ask for. These people jumping forward for the job, like crows in a field, just waiting for the farmer to leave so they can feast... Upsets my digestion, it does, and everyone knows what that can do to an otherwise reasonable hobbit.

Though I've seen plenty of liv's past efforts and know just how keen-eyed she can be, in this case we just don't know enough for me to happy-as-you-please hand over a job that could land her this world-ending artefact, or whatever they call it. Same can be said of Crumb, so I'll not repeat myself.

I'm thinking we might try something like random lots, which at least gives us an even chance and denies those wicked Naz things the opportunity to hoodwink the lot of us.

At the very least, let's consider giving the job to someone who isn't all-fired and clamoring for it. That's this hobbit's opinion, at any rate.