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Old 10-15-2004, 07:20 PM
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Default Abu Ghraib: Administration culpability?

Two alternate theories of the Iraq prisoner abuse scandal have been floated in this thread. One theory is that the current Administration ordered the abuses (though not explicitly and in detail), while another says that they are the regrettable deviations of a few enlistees.

My view is the former, that the administration did cause the abuses to happen, probably with the aim of gathering information about the insurgency in Iraq, but was cagey enough not to specifically order any of them. My evidence is Seymour Hersh's investigative reporting, in which he cites senior CIA sources, and the buttressing circumstancial evidence of the legal torture memos. (See also Bush's Churchillian Dreams.)

The trail to the administration passes through Stephen Cambone to Rumsfeld, for whom of course Bush retains responsibility. As yet, there appears to be a lot of responsibility on the CIA and Military Intelligence side which remains intensely murky, not to mention the outsourcing of interrogations to civilian contractors not covered by U.S. military codes and procedures.

What of Brigadier General Karpinski, direct supervisor of the prisons? My guess is that she was assigned more facilities than any one person could adequately supervise, and was possibly also selected as a reservist because she was likely to be out of her depth and thus not in control of the situation. That, however, is pure speculation on my part.

There is no definitive evidence in the form of specific orders and communications between the Pentagon and the other government agencies and subcontractors involved to document what took place. Indeed, at the rate the Administration is classifying and reclassifying material, none of it may ever become available. However, the legal memos to me provide damning evidence that the Administration was seeking to establish conditions that would cause such abuses to take place.

As usual, the full proof is slightly more complex. In this case, the issue I have barely seen discussed at all is that Abu Ghraib-style abuses are common practice at home; so in a sense, part of the problem may be as simple as the U.S. recreating prison conditions abroad that prevail here. In fact, Chip Frederick (one of the seven indicted servicemen) was a corrections officer in a facility investigated for prisoner abuse.

Primary sources: Legal memos reproduced at the Washington Post (pdf) and FindLaw, courtesy of the New York Review of Books.
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Old 10-15-2004, 07:29 PM
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Default Re: Abu Ghraib: Administration culpability?

I was getting all lazy about looking up those sources and then Blake did it for me. Thanks, Blake.

I was also frustrated at what I saw to be ignorance of what I had thought was common knowledge, but I now realize this has more to do with my feelings than anything else.
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Old 10-16-2004, 04:54 AM
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Default Re: Abu Ghraib: Administration culpability?

It seems difficult for me to believe that this would have happened without at least tacit approval from the administration. On the other hand, I'm sure that Bush's handlers are far too smart to have ever given any direct orders to torture prisoners for information.

Rather, I imagine that they created an atmosphere in which it was clear that this was expected, or at least that it would be tolerated. Kind of a "Will no one rid me of this turbulent priest?" thing.

Cheers,

Michael
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Old 10-18-2004, 10:00 PM
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Default Re: Abu Ghraib: Administration culpability?

You're welcome, and thank you, Dave. :)

Michael, I saw that famous quotation cited in at least one article I reviewed looking up the sources for the OP!
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Old 10-19-2004, 01:21 AM
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Default Re: Abu Ghraib: Administration culpability?

Don't forget the Arar case or alleged others. Or House bill HR 10 which "retroactively establishes a loophole legitimising the practice of extraditing "suspected terrorists" to another country where torture is legal or unprosecuted, for the purpose of having them tortured there." and... check this out:
http://www.hrw.org/backgrounder/usa/us1004/index.htm

<Sigh>
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Old 10-19-2004, 05:54 PM
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Default Re: Abu Ghraib: Administration culpability?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
What of Brigadier General Karpinski, direct supervisor of the prisons? My guess is that she was assigned more facilities than any one person could adequately supervise, and was possibly also selected as a reservist because she was likely to be out of her depth and thus not in control of the situation. That, however, is pure speculation on my part.
Well, parts of it are better than pure speculation, though I realize you're primarily talking about your attribution of motive. Giving Karpinski more than she could handle is of a piece with the widely evidenced pattern throughout the Iraq adventure of systematically under-staffing, under-preparing, and counting on the most optimistic projections.

Is there any evidence, additionally, that Karpinski tends toward Republican hackery? This admin also has a broad record of appointing non-military staff well beyond their experience and abilities, when their politics are sufficiently Bushite.
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Old 04-07-2005, 12:40 PM
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Default Re: Abu Ghraib: Administration culpability?

More: a memo from General Sanchez authorizing the use of torture has been obtained by the ACLU:

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/...p?story=625909

Quote:
Documents obtained by the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) reveal that Lt General Ricardo Sanchez authorised techniques such as the use of dogs to intimidate prisoners, stress positions and disorientation. In the documents, obtained under the Freedom of Information Act, Gen Sanchez admits that some of the techniques would not be tolerated by other countries.

When he appeared last year before a Congressional committee, Gen Sanchez denied authorising such techniques. He has now been accused of perjury.
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Old 04-07-2005, 04:42 PM
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Default Re: Abu Ghraib: Administration culpability?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Godless Dave
More: a memo from General Sanchez authorizing the use of torture has been obtained by the ACLU:

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/...p?story=625909

Quote:
Documents obtained by the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) reveal that Lt General Ricardo Sanchez authorised techniques such as the use of dogs to intimidate prisoners, stress positions and disorientation. In the documents, obtained under the Freedom of Information Act, Gen Sanchez admits that some of the techniques would not be tolerated by other countries.

When he appeared last year before a Congressional committee, Gen Sanchez denied authorising such techniques. He has now been accused of perjury.
Well, that's heartening....who has accused him? Can they make it stick, or will Congress give him an "Ollie North" and he can run for Senate in five years?
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Old 04-10-2005, 04:38 AM
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Default Re: Abu Ghraib: Administration culpability?

Thanks for the update, Godless Dave. I wonder who he might have consulted with about it at the Pentagon.
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