Nobody indicted for outing Valerie Plame

alphamale · 10-30-2005, 04:53 PM

Just to make sure that registers with everybody after two years of B.S. by libs on the net.

Sauron · 10-30-2005, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alphamale

Just to make sure that registers with everybody after two years of B.S. by libs on the net.

You apparently can't read Fitzgerald's own words.

He was unable to get to the truth of what happened about the outing of Valerie Plame because Administration officials committed perjury, lied to a grand jury, and obstructed justice.

So in the course of trying to cover up for their first crime (outing a CIA agent), this Administration committed several other crimes to cover their tracks.

D. Scarlatti · 10-30-2005, 04:59 PM

Make up your mind.

alphamale · 10-30-2005, 05:04 PM

Quote:

You apparently can't read Fitzgerald's own words.

He was unable to get to the truth of what happened about the outing of Valerie Plame because Administration officials committed perjury, lied to a grand jury, and obstructed justice.

No - Fitzgerald ALLEGES Libby with that - even that hasn't been proven.

Sauron · 10-30-2005, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alphamale

Quote:

You apparently can't read Fitzgerald's own words.

He was unable to get to the truth of what happened about the outing of Valerie Plame because Administration officials committed perjury, lied to a grand jury, and obstructed justice.

No - Fitzgerald ALLEGES Libby with that - even that hasn't been proven.

Nice try, but you got caught moving the goalpost.

The title of your original post was about who got INDICTED, not about what was proven. Libby was INDICTED on these charges above.

The fact that Fitzgerald couldn't get to the truth about Plame being outed and bring an indictment on those grounds is a situation caused and explained by the other crimes the Administration members committed.

Sauron · 10-30-2005, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D. Scarlatti

Make up your mind.

It must really suck for weeniemale to realize that his posts live forever in cyberspace, providing ample hunting ground for contradictions and backtracks. :popcorn:

alphamale · 10-30-2005, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Nice try, but you got caught moving the goalpost.

The title of your original post was about who got INDICTED, not about what was proven. Libby was INDICTED on these charges above.

No the title of my OP was that nobody got indicted for outing Valeri Plame, and no one did. Hint: Read from the top of the thread again - slowly.

D. Scarlatti · 10-30-2005, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sauron

[Y]ou got caught moving the goalpost.

Sauron indicted for outing alphamale.

alphamale · 10-30-2005, 05:20 PM

The bottom line:

Nobody indicted for outing Valerie Plame.

Sauron · 10-30-2005, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D. Scarlatti

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sauron

[Y]ou got caught moving the goalpost.

Sauron indicted for outing alphamale.

Indeed. And the world was shocked to discover that the poseur styling himself "alphamale" was more accurately described by the moniker "weeniemale".

The GOP talking point is just so lame. From AmericaBlog:

Quote:

Of course FItzgerald didn't charge anybody with violating the secrecy statutues - Libby obstructed the entire investigation

by John in DC - 10/30/2005 11:39:00 AM

Fitzgerald mentioned this on Friday, but it's worth repeating, since the Republican surrogates are now suggesting that no "real" crime occured because Fitzgerald has yet to charge anyone with leaking classified information.

Scooter, and possibly others (Official A comes to mind), obstructed the investigation. They lied to the investigators and thwarted the effort of the investigators to find out the truth. It wouldn't be surprising that when the key witness is lying and refusing to come clean, to this day, that the investigation hasn't yet charged anyone with the underlying crime. I mean, duh. As Fitzgerald noted, this is why perjury and obstruction of justice are such serious crimes. Scooter is literally stopping Fitzgerald from finding out what happened. So to suggest that Scooter's apparently-successful (so far) effort to obstruct the investigation by lying somehow proves that Scooter and Rove didn't violate any secrecy laws, well, that's just absurd.

And Al Capone was innocent of being a mobster, by the way. After all, they only got him on tax evasion, so that proves the prosecutor concluded he was innocent of everything else.

Sauron · 10-30-2005, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by weeniemale

Quote:

Nice try, but you got caught moving the goalpost.

The title of your original post was about who got INDICTED, not about what was proven. Libby was INDICTED on these charges above.

No the title of my OP was that nobody got indicted for outing Valeri Plame, and no one did.

1. Which is irrelevant, because the investigation into that crime was obstructed.

2. And your OP suggested that the claim of such an outing was "B.S.". And you tried to use the lack of any indictment as a validation of that judgement. But that's nonsense, since the investigation was obstructed -- your buddies in the White House were not cleared, they obstructed the investigation.

3. it was serious enough that administration officials felt the need to cover their tracks. Why cover, if there isn't something to hide?

4. But at least one of the obstructors got caught - and perhaps more will follow.

5. Scarlatti corrected your (frequently shifting) understanding of the charges in the indictment. You owe him a thank you.

Quote:

Hint: Read from the top of the thread again - slowly.

It was funny reading the first time, but on the second read the joke is already old.

D. Scarlatti · 10-30-2005, 05:25 PM

Matthew Cooper was on This Week this morning and directly accused "Official A" (Karl Rove) of lying to Scott McClellan and possibly the president himself, giving rise to McLellan's numerous entreaties that Rove had nothing to do with any of this. McLellan, however, was spared the accusation of intent. Rove was not.

godfry n. glad · 10-30-2005, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alphamale

Quote:

Nice try, but you got caught moving the goalpost.

The title of your original post was about who got INDICTED, not about what was proven. Libby was INDICTED on these charges above.

No the title of my OP was that nobody got indicted for outing Valeri Plame, and no one did.

Yet. It ain't over 'til its over.

alphamale · 10-30-2005, 05:28 PM

You can scream and whine and complain and bitch and throw tantrums,

But the bottom line remains:

Nobody indicted for outing Valerie Plame.

Why don't switch gears and go back to blaming Bush for Katrina? :happy:

The tsunami?? :roflmao:

Sauron · 10-30-2005, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alphamale

The bottom line:

Nobody indicted for outing Valerie Plame.

Which does not make the charge "liberal BS" - contrary to your OP.

It simply means that the Administration officials who did this outing were successful in thwarting the investigation into those actions.

So this charge didn't fail because it was "liberal BS" and groundless. It failed due to perjury and a criminal efficiency at obstruction, that made it impossible to bring the charge -- for now, anyhow.

And given Fitzgerald's past behavior, it may not even be over yet.

But as I said elsewhere, in your world Al Capone being a mobster was just "liberal BS", too. They only got him on tax evasion, so all the other charges must have been trumped up liberal BS.

Sauron · 10-30-2005, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by weeniemale

You can scream and whine and complain and bitch and throw tantrums,

But the bottom line remains:

Nobody indicted for outing Valerie Plame.

Already rebutted this lame comment.
http://www.freethought-forum.com/for...4&postcount=15

Quote:

Why don't switch gears and go back to blaming Bush for Katrina? :happy:

The tsunami?? :roflmao:

Ah. This from the guy who claims to have argued political issues on the internet for years. No wonder you stopped arguing; constant defeat could not have been a pretty sight.

alphamale · 10-30-2005, 05:43 PM

Bush administration has bested you libs once again! During the John Roberts nomination, senate dems practically rolled over and played dead, like good little puppies! Same for next nomination to USSC. Dems don't give a damn if "covert agent" (

) Plame was outed, they really wanted to get at Rove, the brains of the white house - didn't work! Won't work!

YAAAAAAA HAAAAA HA HA HA HA

Sauron · 10-30-2005, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by weeniemale

Bush administration has bested you libs once again! During the John Roberts nomination, senate dems practically rolled over and played dead, like good little puppies! Same for next nomination to USSC. Dems don't give a damn if "covert agent" (

) Plame was outed, they really wanted to get at Rove, the brains of the white house - didn't work! Won't work!

YAAAAAAA HAAAAA HA HA HA HA

1. If you think that Dubya the Chimp came out of this one unscathed, then you're not paying attention to current events. Which I realize is a given anyhow, but it never hurts to point it out.

2. Next SC nomination? Not sure how you predict Dem reaction, given that nobody knows who it will be yet.

3. What Dems want about Rove is irrelevant. The fact is that he did out Plame. Dems couldn't have gone after him, if he hadn't left the door open in such a spectacular manner.

4. Setting aside the fact that you're rejoicing in a successful act of perjury and obstruction of justice, it's also rather hypocritical. All you redneck wingnuts were so focused on "rule of law" when pushing charges against Clinton.
Seems like the rest of America thinks Dubya & Co. are hypocrites, too:

In the aftermath of the latest crisis to confront the White House, Bush's overall job approval rating has fallen to 39 percent, the lowest of his presidency in Post-ABC polls. Barely a third of Americans -- 34 percent -- think Bush is doing a good job ensuring high ethics in government, which is slightly lower than President Bill Clinton's standing on this issue when he left office.

5. Nice to hear you admit that Rove is the brains of this operation - 'cause it sure as hell ain't the Coward from Crawford.

godfry n. glad · 10-30-2005, 06:36 PM

How 'bout this? Ain't we got fun?

I just wondered whether anyone in these parts is familiar with Scott Ritter?

Dingfod · 10-31-2005, 12:36 AM

Scott Ritter, the UN WMD inspector? I think I've heard of him, yes.

godfry n. glad · 10-31-2005, 12:46 AM

Yeah... Today's Sunday bOregonian has an essay by Ritter.

He says that the Libby indictment is a reflection of the lies and deceit which led the U.S. into the Iraq War II. This is a fairly damning claim from the man who asserted that the Clinton administration was too soft on Saddam. I can't seem to find this essay online, or I'd post it up.

Godless Dave · 11-02-2005, 12:21 PM

Funny you should mention this issue, alphamale. In another thread, you asked if anyone had proof that Bush was told the Iraqi WMD intelligence was faulty. Joseph Wilson, Plame's husband, was one of the people who told Bush exactly that. Are you saying you know about the Plame affair but know nothing about her husband or what he told the president? You're familiar with Robert Novak outing Plame, but didn't know that he did this right after Wilson went public with what he told the president?

:scratch: