Bush SUCKS! (Warning: stream of consciousness fear-based rant within)

[livius drusus]

Man, that's some high, high praise. Wait. Are you high?

Oh well, either way I'm thrilled to be compared to a genius of Bower's stature. Just for that, I give you The Cry of the Broken-Hearted Bush Worshipper.

[Petra]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

...I give you The Cry of the Broken-Hearted Bush Worshipper.

Wow. Just Wow.



A part of me was happy to read what he wrote, but then as I got to the end, it scared me. I mean, Rushmore-level President? This guy sounds intelligent and observant, seems to know shit - so how the hell can he see Bush as a Rushmore-level President?! Fuck. Me.

I've only really seen the CF crowd as Bush lovers and they are (for the most part) a pretty brainless lot. I say for the most part, because there are intelligent ones among them, but there is still something incredibly one-eyed about them - an angry patriot and kinda "God's chosen few" attitude about them - I don't know what it is. But that guy, that guy really scares me more than the dumbasses out there.

Actually, here is a post by a guy at CF who sums up the different sides rather poetically. A little long-winded, but very eloquent:

Originally Posted by BobbieDog

There is an aspect of the debate and its evaluation, that has very much to do with democracy.

Kerry won in the "non-democratic" aspect. He was more erudite, more intelligent, more connected with fact and reality. Some have referred to this by saying he was the better "speaker".

Yet he may well not have won in a crucial democratic aspect. None of what he was able to bring to bear through these qualities, may have seen him engage with a crucial constituency, amounting to about half of the voting electorate of the USA.

What are the mechanics behind this? What which sees him connect with reality and truth, as seen by one constituency: precludes him from connecting, at all, with another constituency? How are we to understand such division?

How do you cope with globalisation? That to me is the touchstone of what distinguishes the two constituencies?

I think Kerry says: see it, understand it, engage with it; master it through embracing and leading it? He, and perhaps those who might vote for him, manifest the characteristics and personal qualities which might allow this.

I think Bush says: contain this emerging globalisation, more or less as an extension of America; make it American, make it submit to America. Bush, and perhaps those who vote for him, exemplify the characteristics and qualities which might see America set out to bring this about.

Kerry and his people require a refined intelligence: Bush and his people require a robust conviction. Kerry says international: Bush says American patriotism.

Crudely put, you have intelligence meeting patriotism: Kerry's intelligence simply might not reach and touch those regulated by patriotism; what you require to be a good American patriot, even within a bubble of foreign expedition, while having its own skill set, does not require the Kerry intelligence.

This feeds into and resolves the flip-flop claim. Kerry does not change his position: rather, the refinement of his position, when viewed from differing points of view, offers different aspect and prospect. The position remains the same: but the position is extensive, complex and subtle; when it is viewed from different points of the compass which it covers, it appears variantly.

You take one Mustang. You view it from the front, from the rear, from the sides, under the bonnet (hood), from below, in the trunk. microscopically, macroscopically, mechanically, environmentally, physically, electrochemically, in terms of fundamental particle physics, financially, as a product, as a possession, as an icon, whatever. You always have the one unified item, one Mustang. But the reality of this one Mustang, through the lines of its creation, production and usage: is rich and complex.

The ideas we need to comprehend and take part in global reality are no different: they are complex, extensive, multi-facetted, subtle.

What Bush spinning does, is simply take what are several aspects of one unified Kerry conception: and say look, this aspect is not the same as this aspect; the Kerry vision of the front of the Mustang, is different of the Kerry vision of the rear of the Mustang. They then say Kerry flip-flops on the Mustang: do not let him take charge of the Mustang; follow Bush who only ever gives you the single view of the Mustang, say from the front.

The democratic fact we must face: is that some people do not want to know that the Mustang has many sides. From Texas the Mustang is always seen from the front: some people just do not want to get into having to consider that a Mustang can be viewed from different angles; that is just absurdly too demanding.

Bush is the politician who appeals to those who want to believe that the reality of the world, is confined and exhausted by what they can see from where they occur, period. That Bush appeals to people who in fact stand in many different occurrences, does not preclude this. He coheres and carries a political consensus, which allows half of voting America, to see that consensus as reflecting their immediate and personal occurrence.

The intelligence of Kerry, while inseparable from the constituency who might vote for him: simply has no function or resonance in the occurrences of those who might vote for Bush.

The differences between these constituencies, are just far more fundamental and deep, than often recognised: and manifests and constitutes a crisis of American democracy; the division of American society into two camps, with very little relation and interchange between the two.

Bush and Kerry, while struggling for partisan advantage within this electoral exigency, have not understood or mastered it.

It will be essential, before another Presidential election, to develop a politics, and a couple of the partisan, which does better understand and master this exigency. It is crucial to America that its politicians regain the capacity to speak to more of the electorate, hopefully all of the electorate.

Emphasis mine.

http://www.christianforums.com/showt...1&postcount=82

[Dingfod]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

Man, that's some high, high praise. Wait. Are you high?

Oh well, either way I'm thrilled to be compared to a genius of Bower's stature. Just for that, I give you The Cry of the Broken-Hearted Bush Worshipper.

That's the same link I posted here.
I'm fucking invisible.

[livius drusus]

I'm sorry, warren. I didn't read the link when you posted it and I didn't recognize the para you had quoted when I came across it from a Salon link today.

You're not invisible; I'm just stupid.

[LadyShea]

Originally Posted by lunachick

I really wish I'd seen this debate. Especially this one, as it was about foreign policy.

The thing that scares me, is that Kerry may come out top dog in the debates, but that didn't help Gore any when it came to the crunch. I'm still afraid that Bush will win, one way or the other. God, I hope I'm wrong.

I may be wrong, but I believe for the Bush/Gore debates, they were given the questions ahead of time...so Bush came off way better than he did this time.

[Petra]

Originally Posted by warrenly

I'm fucking invisible.

Never heard of her. Is she a new gal here at FF, or do you know her from somewhere else?

You old coyote, you.



I just had a thought! I'm invisible! You lie!

[Petra]

Originally Posted by LadyShea

I may be wrong, but I believe for the Bush/Gore debates, they were given the questions ahead of time...so Bush came off way better than he did this time.

I missed those debates, too. I honestly thought that Gore would be a shoo-in, so didn't pay as close attention to things as I am now. And things were...errr... different then; I mean, who knew?

Anyway, I couldn't believe what I was hearing immediately following that election. I was just so sure that Gore would win, and Bush would get walked on. Man, was I ever wrong.

[Petra]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

I'm just stupid.

Bollocks.

[LadyShea]

Gore should have won by a lanslide like Clinton did. I think Gore fucked up by distancing himself from the Clinton administration over the morality issue. He could have used the good things that came out of his administration, like the strong economy and kept the race from being so damned close, IMO.

Tht this race is so close, after everything Bush has done, boggles my mind.

[Petra]

Originally Posted by LadyShea

Tht this race is so close, after everything Bush has done, boggles my mind.

Ditto.

Scary as hell, too.

[Beth]

Originally Posted by LadyShea

Tht this race is so close, after everything Bush has done, boggles my mind.

I think the religious climate changed after 9-11. Sad to say. Religious fundamentalism grew, at least in my area, and these people are often Bush's core supporters.

[wildernesse]

Thanks for posting BobbieDog's views, lunachick. I've begun to realize that I must keep an eye out for his posts.

[Petra]

Originally Posted by wildernesse

Thanks for posting BobbieDog's views, lunachick. I've begun to realize that I must keep an eye out for his posts.

My pleasure. He can be a little convoluted sometimes, but is rich with pearls.

[Dingfod]

Originally Posted by livius drusus

I'm sorry, warren. I didn't read the link when you posted it and I didn't recognize the para you had quoted when I came across it from a Salon link today.

You're not invisible; I'm just stupid.

Oh, I'm not mad. I just been noticing that I've killed a number of threads lately.

[Scotty]

Did you say something Warren?

Anyway, I have the debate available, PM me if you want to download it. It is 200megs, not 400megs, I was just seeing double I guess, I knew what the size would be but can't add.

-Scott

[Scotty]

Sorry, I had the wrong link to the Daily Show, here is the right one.

The Daily Show Presidential Coverage

-Scott

[Petra]

Scotty,

Thank you so very much for allowing me to see the debate. I've just finished downloading and viewing it, and I found it to be very informative about each candidate. I've always had my doubts about Kerry, but this has minimised them to some degree. Thank you. I'll comment further when I get the time - in about an hour I have to get Zoe ready for her new school term, get her back to her school boarding house, and I'll probably go out after that.

I'm now downloading the Daily Show - something I need cable tv to watch, and I don't have cable - so thanks again.

[Beth]

Yes. I was a reluctant Kerry person till I watched the debates. I have no doubt that Bush does have smarts, despite his simplistic speak. I seem to understand the way he speaks and can see why half the country sees him as a leader (Do not get me wrong, I enjoyed the debate immensely, I was horribly mean, laughing at his idiocy, debating with hubby.) but Kerry did it for me. I finally saw a man who was more sophistocated and better fit to be a world leader. He understands the importance of the world and seems less of an isolationist. I look forward to the rest of the debates, but I can say that the conscience of this swing voter was finally put to rest and can vote for a leader, rather than "anyone is better than Bush".

[Petra]

Originally Posted by Beth

Yes. I was a reluctant Kerry person till I watched the debates.....I can say that the conscience of this swing voter was finally put to rest and can vote for a leader, rather than "anyone is better than Bush".

I agree. (Even if I can't vote).


Oh, and look at Bush's debate notes:

For someone who I've long suspected is illiterate, Bush seemed to be furiously taking notes yesterday. At times, the scribbling was so loud you could hear it over Kerry. Thanks to an undercover operative, The Talent Show is now able to present the notes that Bush took during last night's debate. With this peek behind the scenes, we hope to provide a candid look at the commander in chief.

[The Lone Ranger]

Originally Posted by lunachick

Anyway, I couldn't believe what I was hearing immediately following that election. I was just so sure that Gore would win, and Bush would get walked on. Man, was I ever wrong.

That's just the thing. You weren't wrong -- Gore made Bush look like a simpering idiot by comparison. Gore showed a commanding grasp of the facts and issues, was confident and articulate, and generally ran rings around Bush. Bush was evasive, inarticulate, had a poor grasp of the facts and issues (to be charitable), and on at least two occasions he outright lied.

The thing is, though, everyone expected Gore to make Bush look like a fool. Since Bush didn't come across quite as badly as everyone expected him to, the pundits declared him to be the "winner."


What a truly awful thing that says about this country: "Vote for Bush; sure he's incompetent, but he's not as incompetent as you thought!"

Cheers,

Michael

[beyelzu]

Originally Posted by lunachick

I agree. (Even if I can't vote).


Oh, and look at Bush's debate notes:

fuck that is a funny, funny picture.

[livius drusus]

He he... Ninjas are cool.

[beyelzu]

who knew that Bush worshipped her hornfulness the ipu??


I had no idea.

[BigBlue2]

Originally Posted by LadyShea

Gore should have won by a lanslide like Clinton did. I think Gore fucked up by distancing himself from the Clinton administration over the morality issue. He could have used the good things that came out of his administration, like the strong economy and kept the race from being so damned close, IMO.

Exactly right, which is why I get annoyed when Democrats whinge about the Florida shenanigans. Gore didn't lose because of the Florida shenanigans, he lost because he ran a crap campaign, mainly because he didn't use one of the best campaigners that the Democrats have ever produced. Gore couldn't even win his home state, which as far as I know is something that even Walter Mondale managed to do.

Originally Posted by LadyShea

That this race is so close, after everything Bush has done, boggles my mind.

You're definitely not the only one that this is happening to.

[maddog]

Originally Posted by LadyShea

That this race is so close, after everything Bush has done, boggles my mind.

Yes. Add me to the list of boggle-head dolls.
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